Click & Go is Stuck!

Hi.

I just tried out my new '09 Hobie Outback SUV hull for the first time (it replaced my cracked '06 hull ...thanks Hobie!).

I was impressed with all the new hull changes. The new stow & Go rudder "pull cords" worked well, the rudder is very responsive and the new hull shape adds stability. When I tried the new Click & Go drive system on the water, it was VERY easy for an old guy like me to detach my old drive, adjust the Turbo ST's, and snap it back in. That was the best feature! The only problem I found was that once in a while one side of the Click & Go would let loose. But it was easy to clamp back down using the heal of my foot. Maybe there is a way to adjust it.

My problem happened AFTER I took the boat out of the water. The Click & Go would not release my drive. I repeatedly tried a slow pull, a quick yank, rocking the drive laterally and front to back, setting the levers in differing positions -- everything I could think of ...but it would not release. It worked so easy minutes before while in the water, but now it was stuck! After about 20 minutes I gave up! I was able to load the boat to my trailer with no harm to the still-attached drive, but now what do I do?

Thomas

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Absolute kayaking corrupts absolutely.

Thomas, what is the position of the Mirage Drive? Are both sides fully seated or is one side of the Drive partly lifted up but wedged in the C & G? Are the levers operating freely or is one jambed or stuck? Will one side of the Drive lift slightly but not the other?

When you say one side occasionally let loose previously, was it always one side? If so, which side? I'm wondering if this could possibly be caused by the drum shaft slowly rotating forward in your Drive. The new shafts are splined to prevent this, so it wouldn't normally be an issue. But your older Drive would not have this feature and it could possibly "walk" the lever forward to the retract position. This happened to me using an older Drive on one of the inflatables (also a Click & Go). If this is your case, it should be easy enough to fix with a newer splined axle.

Hi Roadrunner

The drive appears to be properly seated. The peddles and fins work freely, and nothing is noticeably out of line. And there is nothing stuck in the drive well either that I can see. It is as if, when the levers are in the open position (to take the drive out), the drive's shaft is just too wide to move up more than maybe a 1/4 inch out of its seated position.

Levers appear to be in matched open and closed positions as far as I can tell.

Thomas

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Absolute kayaking corrupts absolutely.

Thomas, I edited my previous post with more questions while you were replying -- sorry. I have a couple more -- 1) does your Drive have a rubber Drivewell seal on the back (now standard)? If so could it possibly be sticking your Drive in the well (really tight fit)? 2) Might your Drive be cocked fore and aft rather than side to side, possible sticking out of the bottom of the hull)? If so, this could also jamb the Drive.

If this is also negative, try re-seating the drive and re-locking it in place. Then try a normal extraction.

If that still doesn't work, it might be best to let the dealer have a look at it.

I tried repeatedly to re-seat and re-lock the drive thinking that it might somehow reset the assembly. Re-seating and locking was successful ...but the drive still wouldn't free itself afterwards when I moved the levers back to unlock the drive.

I don't have a drivewell seal installed. I also checked to see if something else may have lodged between the drive and dreive well but nothing was spotted.

The drive does not appear to be cocked fore and aft. When locked the drive cams under the boat appeared to be parralel to the hull and the fore and aft support areas of the drive appeared to be seated properly to the hull.

There is a little lateral play between the drive peddles ...so once the drive comes out I plan to tighten some cable bolts a bit, but that should have no bearing on the problem, which seems to be too tight tolorances when the Click & Go levers are unlocked and the drive is lifted up. I've even fiddled with the levers while trying to keep the drive lifted to see what happens, but something does not allow the drive to lift more that maybe a 1/4 inch high.

If it does not rain today I plan on going back out on the lake where I will attempt to dislodge the drive while seated in the boat. Maybe there is a certain required motion that happens when removing the drive while in the boat ...but I doubt that!

Thomas

_________________
Absolute kayaking corrupts absolutely.

That could well be it. The new installed drum width overall ('08 and newer) measures about 1/16" narrower than with the older Drives. I think they deliberately made the clearances small to minimize lateral movement but maybe didn't realize that the older overall drum requirement is a tiny bit wider?

I would think though that if it would drop in it would also lift out. When you installed the Drive do you remember it being a tight fit?

In any event, tightening your cables will not narrow your drums but may cause more friction if they're overly tightened. The drums can slide laterally on the axle and cannot be pulled in tighter by the cables. The wobble you're feeling at the pedals is likely caused by the drums rocking slightly on the axle due to clearances or wear.

PS This may seem like a really dumb question, but the fins are straight up and down when you attempt to extract them, right?

Thomas, I've been trying to simulate your problem using the local dealer's '09 Revolution. You can definitely see a difference in clearance between the new drums...


and the old, which fit snugly:


But at least with the Revo, both work fine and there is no issue. It's possible that there could be a slight difference between models, as each drivewell is unique to each application (deck height, etc.).

I did notice that the Drive can appear to be seated when it is not. The tell tale is that it rocks only side to side, but not front to rear; when fully engaged, it rocks fore and aft, but not side to side. When it has a false seat, the levers still move, but not as far; additional resistance is thrust against the forward mating surfaces of the C&G, causing some friction when extracting. In this case with the Revo, it still comes out without any great difficulty.

It looks like you have a unique situation with the Outback and your '06 Drive -- I would take them both down to the dealer where he should have the resources to investigate this further.

The drum widths might be a bit thicker on my old drive. I'll check that clearance out. More importantly, I wonder if the drum axial dimensions had changed as well. If my axial is a tad longer or thicker, that could come into play here.

(Hobie Admin Guy ...would you know anything about that?)

When I installed the drive, I remember no particular problems with the fit ...except that I thought the clamping levers were closed when they were set closer to my seat (I quickly found that the opposite was true ...but not till shortly after my first shove-off!).

When extracted while still on the water, removing the drive could not have been easier and the levers worked great, making this the best new feature offered by Hobie in my book. That's what's so mysterious about this problem. It worked fine in the water.

The slight wobble (maybe 1/4 to 1/2 inch movement) I previously mentioned appeared to be between the pedal stems only. And I suspect that the "sync" pulley cable is just a tad loose. I think someone mentioned that the play on that pulley cable, when squeezed together, should be about 1/8 inch. I plan to look that over once I get the drive off the boat.

The drive/hull assembly felt solid enough at the time once locked down properly and I didn't attribute any wobbling to that area.

Yes, (LOL!) the fins were straight up and down during my attempts! Do you think that it'd be easier if I pull the drive UP out of the well instead of trying to squeeze the drive DOWN through the hull? (...just kidding!)

Thanks for all your suggestions, Roadrunner. I appreciate your help!

Thomas

_________________
Absolute kayaking corrupts absolutely.

Whoops. Saw your great pics and post AFTER I posted my last post! If I don't resolve this, I'll go back to my dealer.

You know, maybe one of the clamp assemblies wasn't fully tight to the hull and shifted slightly, messin' up the fit.

thomas

_________________
Absolute kayaking corrupts absolutely.

Certainly listening... No input as to a problem (beyond what was offered by roadrunner) with the system as yet.

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Matt Miller
Former - Director of Parts and Accessory Sales
Warranty and Technical Support
Hobie Cat USA
(Retired 11/7/2022)

I checked out the boat once again (mounted on "L" kayak holders on the trailer). The drive was still stuck. After carefully looking at the assembly from the deck area I walked around to the bottom hull side. Thats when I spotted something I hadn't noticed before!

The drive's horizontal cam axial set screw had apparently become lose. That allowed the axial to somehow moved back about a half inch, effectively becoming a deadbolt of sorts against the hull! I just loosened the set screw a little more, gently tapped the axial back to it's correct position, then tightened the set screw.

The drive then easily clicked out of the Click & Go levers without a problem. No lever design problem. No old-drive-in-new-drive-well compatibility problem.

Funny thing ...this problem could have happened anytime with my old hull. Why it would suddenly show up on my very first test ride in the new hull is VERY strange.

As mentioned before ...thanks for the help guys! These forums are great!

Thomas

_________________
Absolute kayaking corrupts absolutely.

Good job getting to the root of the problem! Just make sure the flat spot on that sprocket shaft is facing the set screw and put a little Locktite Blue on the threads so it doesn't back out again.

Whoa. Didn't know the sprocket shaft had a flat spot for the set screw. Will check. Thanks!

thomas

_________________
Absolute kayaking corrupts absolutely.

There are a couple of Cardinal rules that apply to Hobie Drives.

1. Retaining screws always seat in a flat spot. If they don't, they will retain nothing. This includes the Allenhead screws for sprocket shafts, idler shafts and fin masts.

2. Anything on the Drive that is threaded can and will eventually back out, given a chance. Best prevention in all cases is a thread locker like Locktite Blue. This includes all retaining screws, the new '09 screw in masts, Nyloc cable nuts (especially with the new style cropped cables) and ST and Turbofin adjustable clew nuts. Exceptions -- pedal crank bolts, sprocket guard screws and pedal adjustment pin parts.

If you do this, you will eliminate over half of your potential problems. If you combine this with regular inspection and adjustment, the Drive will be hard pressed to surprise you with a breakdown. True spontaneous failures can occur due to a defective part, but they are quite rare.