Kayak Visibility

I was reading a thread in the "Hobie Mirage Pro Angler" forum about night kayaking. At the same time a thread came up on the New England Kayak Fishing (NEKF) forum concerning legislation trying to be passed in Massachusetts concerning kayak visibility.
I don't know how many of you fish in that state but you might want to check this out and respond to it before something gets passed without your input.
The bill http://www.malegislature.gov/Bills/187/House/H00652 basically states:


The topic thread on the NEKF forum can be found at http://www.newenglandkayakfishing.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=15362

I thought all of you might want to know about this, east coast or not - fishing or non-fishing kayaker, just so you know what sort of things to be watching for that could affect this form of recreation.

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Roger
http://www.aldenofsunapee.com/
http://www.NEKF.com/

Just what we need another uniformed idiot trying to make a law that will have no effect on a problem without getting any pertinent information from the people it effects.

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Mike
2015 Pro Angler 12
Yellow with Humminbird side imaging

uggg... what happens is they feel compelled to make laws initiated by people/unions that make large donations to their campaign....follow the money

Somebody... quick! Tell the MA legislature that lights and day shapes on boats are under the purview of the Coast Guard. MA can't just create their own system...

Aside from being non-standard night lighting, it's a great way to give the kayaker vertigo and send him in the water. A brilliant piece of legislature in so far as it actually jeopardizes safety in the interest of safety! An exemplary example of government in action.

Since I live a million miles away from where this issue is playing out it is hardly anything to do with me but I wonder if anyone else agrees with me that little dayglo flags on kayaks are a complete waste of money ?

IMNSHO and experience: if you can see the flag you can see both the kayaker and the kayak ! So what is the point in the flag except as another next-to-useless product brought to market by companies which seek to create a demand by playing up a neglible personal safety issue and then to separate people from their money by satisfying the same... Or as a badge for those who want to show that they have all the "professional" kit.

The problem is that when the market for these kinds of products comes to the attention of the busybodies of the nanny state, they create the perception that there really is a danger, not only to those reckless individuals (in this case kayakers) wanting to enjoy a pursuit with a calculated but slightly higher risk than "sitting in an armchair wrapped in cotton wool", but also to hoardes of innocent bystanders... The nanny state then seeks to pass a law making "safety" compulsory and then when challenged that large numbers of lives are not being lost in this way they justify the legislation by stating that "clearly the legislation is working".

We have a similar law in NZ which makes the wearing of a cycle helmet compulsory - this was brought in following a campaign by the parent of one child who died after bashing his/her head falling off a bike.

On a kayak the likelihood of death by immersion/drowning would seem to be a relatively high risk and one worth avoiding and therefore I have no problem with laws which require the carrying/wearing of lifejackets on board boats. Ditto seatbelts in cars. On the other hand I rarely, if ever, hear reports of kayakers being mown down in large numbers by other watercraft - so I deduce that the risk of death or injury this way is minimal... and therefore that the need for the flag is also minimal.

Perhaps one way to avoid the nanny state stepping in and passing neurotic legislation might be be not to get taken in by the subliminal demand-creation tactics of the product vendors and not buy the flags in the first place.

I'm also not in the same part of the world as this legislation, but to me the message is simple. As Hobie kayakers, we have a responsibility to be safe when we're out there.

If we show through facts that very few people are injured in the use of these boats, we could at least hope, or make the case to the lawmakers that any new law is unnecessary, and they should spend their time (and our money) making laws where those laws are needed.

I will say one thing though about the Hobie Mirage Drive kayaks. They are MUCH more difficult to see at a distance then a traditional kayak, especially when the conditions are a little bit more rough, or if the visibility is challenged by a rain or other weather system.

Traditional kayaks have the benefit of a consistent "flash" of the paddle, with each stroke. Hobie's tend to get visually buried in the waves. I really noticed this when my wife was several hundred metres away in her Revolution, and there were other kayakers a bit further away in their traditional boats. My wife was as difficult to see as a swimmer, while the flash of the paddles of the other kayakers made them quite visible. Motor boat owners aren't looking for "swimmers" when they're away from the shore.

For me, I keep a day glow green shirt in the boat, with reflective panels (it has the familiar X on the back, and stripes on the front) It's only their for low light, reduced visibility, or emergency situations, but I firmly believe that the colour, and the reflective nature of the shirt helps others notice me just a bit earlier then they would otherwise.

I also wear bright coloured shirts (not safety shirts) anytime that I'm in high traffic areas. Every year in Canada, we hear about drunk, or other boaters who DO hit kayakers, people on canoe's, or even SeaDoo's, so it is an issue! But again, I think it's up to each individual kayaker to be aware of their surroundings, and do what they can for their own safety. Legislating changes almost always creates new problems.

(Here is the shirt that's always packed with me, just in case. It fits over my lifejacket, and yes I realize it's not for everyone... I wouldn't want it legislated! )

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Paint the back of the paddle blades international orange...

I agree that we have a duty to not be negligent in pusuing our hobby i.e. to keep ourselves safe which includes a duty to take steps to ensure that we are not invisible on the water.

And I agree that often the thing that enables me to identify a dot in the ocean, which may be some kind or other of boat, as a conventional kayak is the flash of the paddles (N.B. NOT a dayglo kayak flag - which are often on board) - and to that extent a Hobie mirage drive kayak is probably less easily identifiable than a conventional kayak.

I am not taking an issue over either of these perfectly valid points, I am merely questionning the value of kayak flags as an aid to visibility. I just do not think that an approximately six inch dayglo triangle waving about on the end of a short pole does anything materially to increase the visibility of a kayak, Hobie or conventional, and therefore the safety of the kayaker. Sure it is a matter of individual choice, but I am not rushing out to my local kayak shop to buy one just because everyone else has got one - life is already full of enough useless cr*p as it is.

If we want common sense legislation let us at least exhibit some common sense ourselves so that we can then use common sense arguments against such illogical and neurotic legislation as was being described in this thread. If kayak flags do next to nothing to make us more visible but we all have kayak flags on our boats we can hardly argue that the legislators do not have a point can we ?

But, as Mark Twain said (& I probably misquote him), "the problem with common sense is that it ain't common enough".

I respect what you're saying stobbo and generally agree with you about the little flags with the exception that I can see how having a visible device a few feet higher then the boat could be a good thing in rougher water.

In the case of my wife being hard to see on her Revolution because of the waves, if there was something other then just her head visible above the waves, it might alert other boaters sooner.

Having said that, I'm not rushing out to buy one either. The real danger, as you pointed out, comes when someone doesn't use their common sense and instead completely relies on that flag or in my case, my ugly shirt. That's where legislating safety devices becomes dangerous. You're not safe because you're visible, you're safe because you're aware.

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I guess they should require a tall bright beacon on those freakin Sea Doos machines also. Talk about safety concerns.

revolving orange light at night. Man that will be great for fishermen!! CRAZY.

LOOK OUT!!! HERE I COME!!

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I am very afraid of speedy motorboats especially if they are pulling people on waterskies. They have their attention pointed backwards! And who knows if they are sober.

I use an ugly coloured west and a flag. I don't depend on that, I listen for the fast ones and try to spinn my head 360 degrees!

I use a 360 navigation light from Navisafe as soon as it feels adquate.

There are no sharks in Sweden. But there are 3 ways to get killed in a canoe here. 1 DROWNING. 2 HYPOTERMIA. 3 RUNNED OVER BY SOME OTHER BOAT/SHIP.

You better stay visible! As good as you can.

greetings from Sweden

thomas

Quite true augaut. Paddle kayaks tend to rock a little more than a Hobie Mirage Pedal kayak, too.

As for the visibility issue - Lighten Up everyone! Heh heh heh. The location of where one paddles/pedals should probably be the major factor in the level of visibility one needs to have. If you're in your own lake off your back yard, who cares? If you are pedaling down a major industrial port river at night, let them see you with standard lighting. If you're out with only a slim chance of crossing paths with a motor boat, then a flashlight might be all you need.

In my opinion, if you are kayaking in an area that has boat traffic at night, you need to run a boat light, period. No flashlight, no headlamp, no flashing light, no red or green light. I run a 12v, 360 degree directional beam light that is higher than my head so the light is not obstructed anywhere. This directional beam boat light also doesn't blind the person paddling next to me.

I always put a strips of marine reflector tape every foot along the kayak. I don't have a photo of the Adventure set up for a night run, but here is what my paddle kayak looks like when a night paddle is planned. You can see the reflectors along the side of the hull. At night, if a boat scans the horizon with a spotlight, the kayak will definitely light up to alert them of your presence. The'll see you from MILES away. Consider reflectorizing your kayak - it's a cheap form of insurance.