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PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 7:06 am 
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Hello-

This winter, I plan to kale cradles to replace the rollers on my trailer. Has anyone else done this? I know how to go about it, but I am in need of an offset table in order to construct them properly. I am thinking if I can get the offsets at 1" increments, I should be able to make a fine set for much less than they cost.

Thanks.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 8:48 am 
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Location: North Carolina
My suggestion would be to make a mold of your hulls and laminate the cradles off the mold. The factory cradles do not fit tightly nor do they actually follow the shape of the hull.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 10:18 am 
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Location: Southern New Jersey
I got this idea from a fellow Div 11 H-18 sailor (Thanks Dave).

Cut a 1/3 section of a 10" diameter Schedule 40 PVC pipe, length to suit your need. Line with carpet. Instant cradles! I'm working on a set now. Photos below.

I have kept the rollers on the trailer for loading. After the boat is on the trailer, Slide the PVC Cradle under the hulls and secure with a strap. I made the forward cradles 1 ft long and the aft 2 ft. The AFT cradles fit nice and snug; the FWD and a little more room. This takes the load off the rollers and distributes it over more of the hull during road bumps when tailoring and winter storage.

Image

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John Latimer
'79 Hobie18 - Magnum
Sail#4854


Last edited by danneskjold on Mon Jun 14, 2010 12:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:29 pm 
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To get the PCV to conform to the shape of the hull - heat it in an oven to about 85° C (185° F) until it becomes pliable.

With the boat upside down, use a piece of carpet to protect the hull and form the pliable PVC over the hull. Let cool. Instant cradle.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 4:34 pm 
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PVC works well. You may want to screw a piece of wood to the cradle on either side of the roller to keep the cradle from moving forward or aft.

sm


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 Post subject: H18 Cradles
PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 6:04 pm 
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Location: SE PA/ Chesapeak Bay
I think Dave Raughley saw my cradles ......

You can make them two different ways: Fiberglass or PVC.

The first set I made I molded a set of Epoxy/Fiberglass to inverted (upside down) H18 hulls .... that worked fairly well. It just took a little time and work

But next I needed a set of cradles quick for my beach wheels and I noticed that the fiberglass cradles could be damaged .... so I asked Roy Conover/Mech Contractor (old time Div11 sailor) for some Large diameter PVC pipe scraps/cut-offs, and I tried molding as set. To date I've made a least a half dozen sets of cradles by molding PVC Pipe for my friends.

Experimenting, I came to the same conclusions as mentioned above ... section PVC pipe into 1/3 dia pieces (if pipe is 10" or larger) ... heat oven to approximently 200F .... places padding on hull .... mold PVC pipe when pliable ....

Now I 've made cradles on both inverted hulls and right side up .... just use rachet straps to hold the pvc material to th hulls

Be sure to place padding between hulls and "Hot" PVC material to similate carpet and protect hulls from heat ... COOL/QUENCH w/ water, do not allow PVC to cool "naturely" as too much heat could be transfered to the hulls (the PVC can hold alot of BTU's dependeing on how thick it is)

Carpet: Use a cheap nylon carpet that WILL NOT retain water/moisture ... VERY IMPORTANT .... moisture + close prolong contact = Gellcoat Blisters!!!!!

MOST IMPORTANT !!!!!!
Do not attempt molding process/heating of PVC in Kitchen oven when Mom/Girlfriend/Wife is around!!!! This seems to bring on the accurence of the famed "CONNIPTION" event !!!!!! It seems that women do not like the idea of heating PVC in the same oven that food is cooked in generally

Do not heat oven above 225F .... slowly heat PVC material, raising oven thermostat in small incriments ... check every 10mins for pliability of PVC. (if smoke developes turn down thermostat!!!) It takes me 45mins - 1 hr approximently to heat PVC to pliability


Something I've been preaching since the 80's for trailering H18's ..... GET RID OF THE TRAILER ROLLERS !!!!!!!!! They cause damage to the bottom of the hulls ... grinding beach sand into the hulls ... leaving gouges and black streaks .... and creating divots/dents in the bottoms ..... rollers creat what is known as a "point source load" in engineering lingo .... what you want is a "distributed load" on the hull

I made "bunks" by using Pre-Treated 2x6's 14-16"lg .... and bolted them to the crossbar w/ carriage bolts then covered them w/ nylon carpet. The 6" wide board provide enough sidth to creat a distributed load. My trailer can carry anything from a H14 - P19/H20. And I have a seat to sit on to put on my sailing shoes( The first set I made I used "Kiln Dried" wood, and they rotted in approximently 4-5 years ..... presure treated wood last alot longer )

Stephen/Must5429 tells a a very funny but similiar story of: Car parts + Dishwasher = (1) PISSED OFF wife !!!!!!

John L: did you have a fun time at the Rock Hall Points Regatta??? Thanks for coming ... Div11 Scheduling Meeting Sat, Dec 6th , Newark Del.

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HarryMurphey
H-18 mag/ #9458
Fleet 54 Div 11


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 11, 2008 6:09 pm 
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Location: Southern New Jersey
Sorry Harry. :oops: I would have given you credit for the design if I had known the history. I first saw these cradles while helping Dave load his boat on his trailer at Wildwood. I'm still working on these cradles. I need to add blocks and securing straps. Thanks for the tip about the carpet. I'll be replacing these dumper scrap with some all synthetic outdoor carpet before I leave them in the weather.

My son and I really enjoyed the Rock Hall Points Regatta. You and your crew put on a great event :D and I look forward to next years racing season.

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John Latimer
'79 Hobie18 - Magnum
Sail#4854


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 8:39 am 
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Wow! I do not know what to say. I am thankful to you for your replies!

I was actually wondering if, since the 18 was out of production, I would get ANY responses. I am glad that I was wrong.

Thanks again!

Mike


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 16, 2008 2:20 pm 
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Do you really need to turn the boat upside down to mold the heated PVC sections to the hulls? What about sliding the heated sections between the rollers of the trailer and the hull and allowing the weight of the boat to form the shapes?


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 Post subject: Molding cradles
PostPosted: Sat Oct 18, 2008 8:29 am 
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Location: SE PA/ Chesapeak Bay
No, you don't really need to turn the hulls upside down. I made the first epoxy/fiberglass set that way and the first set of PVC that way, but I already had my H18 upside down because I was doing my annual winter "bottom job" on her. I used to touch up and re-gellcoat the bottom of the boat because of wear done by "through the surf" beach landings" and TRAILER ROLLERS ..... I REALLY HATE TRAILER ROLLERS ..... you spend all that time doing the bottoms, sanding (200-2500grit) and then waxing/polishing them ..... the first time you push the boat onto the trailer or use your beach wheels and you have black streaks and gouges .... AHHhhhhhhhhh

Since then most of the "through surf" regattas here in Div11 have gone away, (only one remains), most events are held at venues with protected launch beaches/sites. So I don't need to repair my boat's bottoms every year, so the last several sets I have made I have molded them to the hulls w/ the boat sitting on the trailer up-right, OK?

But here are some issues .... if you mold them like you asked by sliding them between the trailer rollers and the hull the rollers will make impressions in the HOT & PLIABLE PVC material ....

I would suggest that first you lift the boat slightly up off the rollers .... quickly mold the hot PVC using padding and several "Rachet Straps" to hold the PVC material in place .... then if you wish some "Roller Divets" in the cradles to help stablize them in place set the boat down on the rollers and quickly quench (w/water) the PVC to stop the PVC from "CREEPING" too much.

I can't do this method w/ my rear cradles due to where my boat sits on the trailer and the tramp .... my boat sits on my trailer w/ the trailer crossbars located slightly in front of the boat's front and rear crossbars

And since I have made "BUNKS" on my trailer I do not need cradles normally .... only when I double stack boats for long trips do I need trailer cradles ..... But Beach Wheels are a different story ..... especially the 84'-87' "Red Foam boats". Thats what I've made most of the cradles for .... beach wheels.

FYI- 1/2" Styrene is the best padding for between the cradle or bunk, and carpet .... just use contact cement to glue it in ....

FYI 2- Oven Mitts are a must for handling the Hot PVC

FYI 3- I have recently acquired an extra set of H18 hulls that are drying
out upside down in my backyard (do not leave you H18 on a mooring all season) ..... and I am using them as molds as the gellcoat blisters do not effect the molding of the PVC .... molding/constructing w/ epoxy/fiberglass would be a different story .....

Hope this has been helpful

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HarryMurphey
H-18 mag/ #9458
Fleet 54 Div 11


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 18, 2008 3:54 pm 
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Harry,

Thanks for your reply and detailed information, very much appreciated! One more thing I would like to know in regards to the cradles is when you're making a set for beach wheels, how are you fastening them to the wheels? What year is your magnum? Mine is an 88....great boat!

Thanks,

Tom Hundley
1988 H18M "Windraider"


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 18, 2008 5:41 pm 
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Location: SE PA/ Chesapeak Bay
Hi Tom,

Beach Wheels:

I drill holes through the cradle approximently 4" apart (2" off of the cradle's centerline) and countersink them, then use either 1/4" or 5/16" SS Flat head/countersunk bolts. The PVC material I have scrounged is usually approx 3/4" thick and is green or blue in color (the blue is much thicker) I usually make them approximently 12" long by 12" wide. I then use 1/4" thick styrene for padding w/ synthetic carpet.


Trailer Bunks/Cradles:

Trailer Cradles- I remove the roller from the trailer roller assemble .... I mount a wooden block w/ bolts and construction adhesive sightly (1") "Off-center" fore & aft that has a hole for the "rolleraxle"drilled through it. I want the cradle to naturely "fall" to the stern so that as I wheel the boat up on the beach wheels the cradles are angled/tilted so the bows can just lay right in them. You will need to "shape" the wooden block to the curve of the PVC. Using the rolleraxle I mount the cradles where the rollers were. I like to make these cradles 14"-16" long by 12" wide. Also, for these type of cradles I like to use 1/2" thick Styrene w/ the carpet.

Bunks- I use Pressure-Treated 2x6's or 2x8's approx 14"-16"lg stacked two high. I through bolt them to the trailer's crossbeam, and cover w/ 1/2" thck styrene and synthetic carpet. I like the bunks better for my uses as my trailer can carry any boat from a H14 to a H20. For some of the distance races we used my trailer as the "Rescue- Go and Get-em" trailer for a group of us so I need a flexible set-up.

Double Stacking- I don't have one of those nice trailers w/ a upper front and rear crossbars. I made a set of wooden crossbars that are curved/molded to the deck of my H18 that I attach PVC cradles to on the top. I place a complete set of (4) cradles under the bottom boat on-top of the bunks that has styrene and carpet in them to spread the load out even more on the lowwer boat. I use 1" thick styrene between the wooden crossbeams and the deck, these wooden cradles go from hull edge to hull edge and are maybe 14" wide fore and aft ... a large footprint. The top boat then sits in/on the upper cradles that are attached to the wooden crossbars. I then use (4) rachet straps per boat attached to the crossbars to hold everything to the trailer.

DO NOT tie/strap the lowwer boat down and then tie the upper boat to the lowwer boat .... each boat should be secured seperately.


Oh, my boat is a 1984 and the origonal sailpattern was Blue Hawaii .... currently I have an all white set of sails that I tranfered my old numbers to.

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HarryMurphey
H-18 mag/ #9458
Fleet 54 Div 11


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 8:42 am 
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Finally got my hands on some 10" PVC to make my trailer cradles. Does anybody know where the best place to find Styrene would be? What is this stuff typically used for?


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 9:08 am 
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Location: Detroit, MI
Just Google "styrene"

You get a whole bunch of hits and places to buy it.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 11:04 am 
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Understand that, actually already did Google it but was wondering if it was something I could pick up locally like at Home Depot or a craft store, etc.


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