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PostPosted: Tue Oct 17, 2006 8:31 pm 
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I was looking at the spinaker pole for the 18 in the parts catalog. I can't tell if it comes with a snuffer or not. Does anyone know? If it does not, I don't see an option to add one. Any ideas here?

How about the 18 spinaker that Hobie sells. Does anyone have experience with one? Is it a downwind sail or more of a reacher. I've got buddies that added spinakers (not made by Hobie) and can't drive downwind as much as they would like and keep the sail working.

I was wondering about a Tiger pole/snuffer setup on a regular old 18 (not sx mast). Would it fit? Where can you buy one?

I'd be interested in people's hobie 18 spinaker experience (Hobie or not). I'd like to eliminate as much of the trial and error as possible. Why not learn from someone else's mistakes!

Thanks,
Todd
H18 in MN


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2006 6:47 am 
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Location: North Carolina
I run a Tiger chute, pole and snuffer. It doesn't like deep downwind angles, any sail that does won't be very fast. I set it up on my 28' standard mast first and have now switched to an SX mast to run a Tiger main. My pole is 12' and is a endpole snuffer which I like better than the mid pole setup. There was a setup for sail on thebeachcats.com and catsailor.com recently, may still be available. Ask all the questions you want of me. I am very much into hotrodding my 18. Stay away from the Hobie spin sail, it is a old design and not fast at all.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2006 7:06 am 
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Thanks for the feedback. Very helpful! I'll look for a Tiger package and see what I find.

I'm also VERY intrigued by the SX mast/Tiger main addition. I may have to think about that...

Thanks!
Todd


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2006 2:31 pm 
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Location: North Carolina
The only issues I'm having with the main sail is the jib. Since an 18 runs a genoa which extends beyond the mast it has the effect of backwinding the main at the luff. I have a regular 18 jib, not the taller SX. Can't decide now whether to buy a SX jib or convert to a self tacker and run a Tiger jib. It would be nice to remove the jib blocks and track and have everything at the front crossbar. The self tacker is pricey so I don't know. It would also effect my portsmouth rating, effectively making it a Tiger by the numbers. Maybe for X-mas.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 06, 2006 8:00 pm 
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Location: League City, Texas, USA
ncmbm wrote:
The only issues I'm having with the main sail is the jib. Since an 18 runs a genoa which extends beyond the mast it has the effect of backwinding the main at the luff. I have a regular 18 jib, not the taller SX. Can't decide now whether to buy a SX jib or convert to a self tacker and run a Tiger jib. It would be nice to remove the jib blocks and track and have everything at the front crossbar. The self tacker is pricey so I don't know. It would also effect my portsmouth rating, effectively making it a Tiger by the numbers. Maybe for X-mas.


A flat cut jib like the Tiger works well on a H18SX when coupled with a Tiger main or similar. One issue is the sheeting angle - when a friend of mine was testing this set up we had to run the Tiger jib higher up the forestay (just an inch or two to get a nice angle.

The boat will point better and will be less over powered when reaching. With the spinnaker you don't need the big jib downwind. It just backwinds the main and messes with the air flow from the spinnaker - particulally if you run with a short spin pole like Hobie suggest in their setup instructions.

Chris.

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2008 Hobie Tiger


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 07, 2006 7:21 am 
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Location: North Carolina
Chris,
Just got a self tacking jib set up. Need to install it and find a used Tiger jib. Making plans now to run this boat in this upcoming years Tybee 500. The sheeting angles for the 18 really only work well with a gunoa. The smaller foot on a Tiger really creates a bad angle. I'm currently using a standard 18 jib which really doesn't cut it. Looking forward to this upgrade as I hate the jib block placement on the 18, always in the way. Should really clean up my deck for easier spin use.


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 Post subject: Tybee
PostPosted: Tue Nov 07, 2006 8:42 am 
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I don't think you can use the Hobie 18 in the Tybee. The boats have to be sailed as in there class rules and the way you have changed the boat it does not meet the class rules. It does not meet the F18 class rules with the curved beam. I would check with the race officials before I started making plans. I hope you can find a way to do the race though.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 08, 2006 7:37 am 
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Location: North Carolina
Dave,
I agree it doesn't fit the curved beam rule. Spoke with Chuck allready and he says yes but doesn't want to hear complaints about it. E-mailed Jake and he thinks its OK. Guess it will come down to the actual participants agreeing. JD Soloman and I are planning on making this trip on my boat as it was made in the year we started sailing together off the coast of Myrtle. Kind of a nostalgia thing. Old friends, old boat, in the ocean, what could be better? I don't think anyone will be concerned about my boat but you never know. Trey Brown has been helping me with setup and parts and I have the necessary spares, including a mast and comptip. I guess worst case that JD could just go ahead and buy an F18, he plans on that anyway.
Later, Michael
Thanks again for the spin pole!


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 9:21 pm 
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The hobie spinaker kit does not come with a snuffer. Alot of us are using a hoop and bag from performance catamarans, but then you have this big Nacra logo on your Hobie.

As for the Tiger jib on a SX you have to add fair leads to the front cross bar. I used harken track and cars. You will have to hoise the Tiger jib to the top of the lower forstay to get a decent sheeting angle. It works okay. We have since had Ullman make us a full batten jib that fits properly. The big square top and blade jib make the boat perform like no other SX but don't fool yourself into thinking it is a Tiger by the numbers. The tiger has more hull bouyancy and high aspect ratio foils which help to allow you to push harder on the downwind and point higher on the upwind respectivly. Most of your proposed mods I have done so feel free to ask questions so you can avoid the mistakes I made.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 7:15 am 
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Location: North Carolina
Flash,
Tell me more about your jib. I am currently running Tiger main and chute w/endpole snuff. Just picked up a self tacking system for the jib and now looking for a jib. I would still like to furl so full battens won't work. Am also looking at building sleeves for the dagger wells to use high aspect daggers. I should bite the bullet and purchase an F18 but don't trust the clamshell design of all the currently available models, due to my experience with the Fox. In recent racing the boat performed well with the other F18's. I was able to match them to weather but got left downwind, mostly due to my poor spin skills. I had hoped to race this boat in the Tybee but they, this week, pulled the plug on that. What have you done to your boat? What works and what doesn't?


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 Post subject: SX MODS
PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 8:17 am 
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We are running an Ullman square top main, probably very similar to the Tiger STX main. We have upgraded our downhaul to a 16:1 and our mainsheet is a Harken low profile 8:1. I considered a self tacker for the boat but it looked like a pain to adapt a Tiger or Nacra self tacker to the 18 crossbar because our crossbar is concave. So I have two harken tracks with adjustible cars. Our jib fits the triangle perfectly and could be made with out the full battens. The problem with the Tiger jib on the SX is the bottom of the sail will be flat and the top twisted off hurting your pointing. This is because the sheeting angles are screwed up. You may not have that problem with the self tacker as it would move your fairlead forward. Our spin pole is a carbon fiber windsurfer mast cut to 12 feet. I use the Nacra midpole snuffer (wears the chute less then the Tiger end pole). Our chute is also custom made by Ullman. This last weekend I found that I could point and have speed with the Tigers but downwind the Tiger just performs better. I considered developing high aspect ratio foils for the boat but how would handicap that? We take a big enough penalty for our main. I would rather sail the stock boards and try to correct over the Tigers and Inter 20's. For what it is worth we did a lot of jib experimentation and the blade jib is the best, we tack trough 80 degrees where as the stock jib only gave us 90.


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 Post subject: Re: SX MODS
PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 9:42 am 
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Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 4:44 pm
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Location: Raleigh, NC
JACK FLASH wrote:
I would rather sail the stock boards and try to correct over the Tigers and Inter 20's.


translated:

"I'd rather just win by the numbers, not by being a better sailor."

_________________
Trey Brown
www.velocitysailing.com
2006 N20 1017
1998 H16 102698
www.sunjammers.com ftw!


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 9:55 am 
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Location: Northern Texas
NCSUtrey,

In theory, the numbers are supposed to even the boats, and any modifications made to the boat, up in performance. If JACK FLASH does indeed time correct over the competitors, then he will be the better sailor.

Cool thing about JACK FLASH is that he has one of the ultimate Hobie 18SX HOT RODS. I think he will agree with me that the boat is lots faster than the skipper and crew. However, once he catches up to the performance of the boat Tomko better watch out! :P


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 Post subject: numbers
PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 11:28 am 
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Location: Raleigh, NC
I disagree. A portsmouth modification for 1, maybe 2 (at most) performance additions (spin and sq. top we'll say) may be somewhat accurate, but never can truly handicap the boat fairly. If he's building an F18, then he should take the F18 rating. Nothing is more disheartening than sailing your best, and then having some guy with a ratings killer boat correct over you (like a supercat 20). Why don't we open this can of worms on catsailor and see what the big boys have to say....

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Trey Brown
www.velocitysailing.com
2006 N20 1017
1998 H16 102698
www.sunjammers.com ftw!


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 Post subject: Rating ETC.
PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 11:45 am 
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The operative word in my comment was try to correct over them. I am not building an F18 boat. If I wanted to build an F-18 boat I would by one. The hobie 18SX does not have the correct width for F18 and the crossbars are curved, which is not allowd in the F18 class. My base rating already accounts for a spinnaker. I take a hit for having the larger main. I run a much smaller jib than stock and may even be smaller than a Tiger. Is my boat a rating killer? Maybe maybe not. I don't decide the rating and I did not buy the boat because of the rating. In fact I did not know what the rating even was when I bought it. I bought it because it was priced right, was in really good shape, and already had spinaker set up. Hobie is correct in his statement, the boat is much more advanced and powerful than the experience and competence of my crew and myself. At some point in time we will become better sailors and we may or may not beat Mr. Tomko who is by all accounts an awsome sailor. But as I recall, the previous owner of the boat is a pretty good sailor and he has alot of trophies, but most of them are second place, Mr. Tomko took home the first. The remarkable thing about Portsmouth ratings is they can change year to year based on results sent in by race committies. Besides, there are enough F18's that if they did not think it was fair to have to race against me that could race level with each other. It should also be noted that there is another SX in our area with similar sails that has never beaten Tomko. In fact in our race this past weekend he did not beat anybody, except for us.


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