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 Post subject: Mast step question
PostPosted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 6:06 pm 
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Joined: Fri May 30, 2014 12:00 pm
Posts: 11
I've seem a couple videos on stepping an 18 and one person can lift the mast up rite. I have trouble doing this. It just seems to heavy or at a bad angle. Am I doing something wrong?


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 Post subject: Re: Mast step question
PostPosted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 9:46 pm 
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Joined: Wed May 25, 2011 3:15 pm
Posts: 112
Location: Buffalo, NY
Because the mast is pinned to the boat as you try to pivot it upright, it is very heavy to lift by yourself. If the mast itself weighs ~50 lbs, with a centroid exactly halfway up, that means that standing at the rear crossbar on the trampoline, the "weight" of the mast as you try to step it is nearly 80 lbs. It's made trickier by the diamond wires and spreaders, which just seem to be in the way when stepping.

The best way I've found to step the mast is to have my crew lift the mast as high as they can off the ground. I get on the trampoline and hold it up, while they hop up with me. They hold the mast and lift from above it, I get under (behind the diamond wires) and lift from below it, then they switch so that we are both behind the diamond wires and push it up/forward the rest of the way. It's also much easier to keep the mast straight while stepping with two people. Once fully upright, one of us hops down and pins the forestay or bridle wires.

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Mike
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'79 H18 standard 'Rocketman II' sail #14921


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 Post subject: Re: Mast step question
PostPosted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 10:45 pm 
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Thanks that's what we ended up doing. They make it look so easy on YouTube


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 Post subject: Re: Mast step question
PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 6:01 am 
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Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2005 10:04 am
Posts: 156
Location: Bowie, MD
A small hand cranked winch mounted on the trailer's forward mast support makes it even easier. Do the initial lift as described above to get the mast off the back crossbar. Then the person on the tramp only has to keep the mast stable from side to side while the other turns the winch handle. Saved my marriage :D


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 Post subject: Re: Mast step question
PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 7:54 am 
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Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2005 10:13 am
Posts: 685
Location: Nepean S.C. Ottawa, Canada
I have some old mainsheets and jib sheets.....
we join them to create a hoisting line. Let out the main halyard all the way, so the figure 8 knot is at the base of the mast.
We attach the hoisting line to the ring of the main halyard, and round up a volunteer (usually a Tornado sailor).
Volunteer takes the end of the hoisting line, places it around their hips like mountain climbers do, and stands about 30 feet in front of the H18.
I jump up on the tramp, crew lifts the mast up a bit, I grab the mast and hoist it above my head.
At this point, the volunteer takes up the slack and starts the 'raise', usually by walking backwards carefully.
I continue to lift the mast, walking forward on the trampoline...
Crew helps me keep the mast vertical by using trap handles, and also helps by getting rid of any tangles or things getting hung up.
At my old club, a buddy used to place the H18 on cat trax, one set under each cross bar, then tie the bitter end of the hoisting line to a handy tree, jump up on the tramp to start the mast raise, and crew would gently push the H18 backwards.....Yikes!

Whatever you do, stay away from power lines, and do it with safety in mind.

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1989 Hobie SX18 Sail # 1947
'Only two things are infinite, the universe, and human stupidity. But I'm not sure about the former.'


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 Post subject: Re: Mast step question
PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 9:07 am 
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It's fantastic motivation for some self improvement! I could do it OK when I got my 18, then over the winter it was rough, so I did some work out routines and have maintained them mostly and it's not an issue anymore.

When I'm feeling quite tired or the boat is at a weird angle on a weird beach... I might have crew or helper grab the forward trap lines, one in each hand and have them help me raise. The hard part for me is getting from 2' up from the crossbar, to up and over my head.

Another consideration is to put part of one foot on the crossbar, I had a mast cradle slip and damage the lacing on my trampoline on my H20 one time, and halfway through the raise, my trampoline went to the ground. Lucky it wasn't on the trailer at the time. Since then I have put part of a foot or most of a foot on the crossbar. It even helps a bit since I'm not stretching into the trampoline and seem to be getting a better footing. Beware of slipping... (I haven't heard of anyone else ever ripping through the trampoline before, may not even happen like that on an 18)

Tom

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Tom
Fleet 259, Central Coast CA
H18 ('81)
H18 ('85)
H20 ('97)
H18 ('78)


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 Post subject: Re: Mast step question
PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 2:13 pm 
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Joined: Fri May 30, 2014 12:00 pm
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thanks for the info. I have a nice block and tackle i use to step my macgregor mast. i'll try hooking it up high to the front of the trailer and raising it by the for stay.


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 Post subject: Re: Mast step question
PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2014 11:12 am 
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Joined: Tue Oct 08, 2013 6:55 am
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I have read on this forum that you could do damage to the hulls by stepping on the boat to raise the mast. I assume this is just if the trailer has rollers instead of hull cradles? Anyone here climb up on the boat while it's on a trailer with rollers?
sorry to hijack this thread...


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 Post subject: Re: Mast step question
PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2014 11:21 am 
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Joined: Tue May 27, 2003 12:44 pm
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Location: Oceanside, California
I've stepped a LOT of Hobie 18 masts on a trailer... on single rollers. Not an issue for a Hobie 18.

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Matt Miller
Director of Parts and Accessory Sales
Hobie Cat USA


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 Post subject: Re: Mast step question
PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2014 12:21 pm 
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Joined: Wed May 25, 2011 3:15 pm
Posts: 112
Location: Buffalo, NY
I agree with Matt, I've always stepped my mast on a trailer, both when I had rollers and now that I have bunks, and never had a problem. I believe that it could eventually be a fatigue problem on the hulls, but there's no need to be concerned about a sudden or immediate hull failure. I also have never seen any sign that my trampoline can't handle the stress of stepping the mast. It does stretch a little, but it's plenty strong enough. I don't see how it could ever "drop," unless maybe it was already pretty well torn.

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Mike
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'79 H18 standard 'Rocketman II' sail #14921


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 Post subject: Re: Mast step question
PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2014 1:05 pm 
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Joined: Mon May 09, 2005 10:25 am
Posts: 2568
Location: Jersey Shore
I agree with the others that the act of stepping the mast with the boat on single rollers is not likely to be an issue. However, over the long term, I think you would be much better off to put either double rollers or some other type of cradle or support between the roller and the hull. This can be as simple as a 12" long piece of 2x6 with some carpet on top. If you look at the hull when sitting on a single roller, there is very little surface area in contact with the roller and so there is a lot of pressure acting on the hull at that point. So if you want to get a long life out of your hulls, single rollers should be avoided. There have definitely been cases where the single roller punched through the hull.

sm


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 Post subject: Re: Mast step question
PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2014 1:38 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2005 10:04 am
Posts: 156
Location: Bowie, MD
I just sailed a borrowed 18 that had a large deformed area on the bottom of the hull right where it sat on a single roller. It still seemed solid, not crushed in. More like the hull "melted" and sunk in to the roller. Not sure what sort of failure mode this is. Does the resin retain some elasticity long after it has "set"? Anyway, that boat was a poster child for have cradles or bunks for the forward supports.


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 Post subject: Re: Mast step question
PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2014 2:26 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2005 10:13 am
Posts: 685
Location: Nepean S.C. Ottawa, Canada
Years ago, my buddy Adrio, left his H18 in the driveway, on rollers on the trailer, covered with a tarp.
After each snowfall, he would brush off the snow.
One March, we had a major snow storm, followed immediately by rain,
then a cold front came through and everything froze up solid. Only in Canada, eh! Pity.
Needless to say, the weight crushed the hulls at the rollers.

He did a great repair job, and now stores his H18 on the same trailer behind mine at the Sailing Club, with 1" x 5" x 5' long planks which re-distribute the weight to prevent any crushing.

I vote for cradles every time.

_________________
1989 Hobie SX18 Sail # 1947
'Only two things are infinite, the universe, and human stupidity. But I'm not sure about the former.'


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 Post subject: Re: Mast step question
PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2014 4:57 pm 
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Joined: Mon May 09, 2005 10:25 am
Posts: 2568
Location: Jersey Shore
This is one of the reasons that I prefer to step the mast with the boat off the trailer. I put the boat on the ground with the beach wheels under the rear crossbar. This way the load on the hulls is well distributed through the cradles on the wheels. It also has the advantage of not having to climb up onto the boat on the trailer. The mast also starts out at a higher angle so lifting it up into position is easier.

sm


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