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PostPosted: Sat Sep 07, 2013 5:26 am 
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Hello All,

I know this has been discussed many times and I am aware of the following options:
Righting Bag:I have not found a seller in the UK, contacted UK Hobie Center to be informed this is due to EU health and safety, that's the nanny state for you. Could potentially fab one in house, thinking of a large 100ltr drybag or a fabric punch bag as a donor or order from US (Murrays).
Shroud Extenders Understand these help by allowing the top hull to change its center of gravity or tilting angle so as to assist in righting but again talking with a very nice chap from the Hobie Center UK was advised against them due to the horrid and very real possibility of de-masting and again these are not available in the UK, but could potentially have made or order from US.
Righting Pole: This is a possibility and could probably fab one in house.

I have an understanding of positioning the boat correctly, releasing the sheets, methods of breaking sail water tension etc

But I have as yet not had the opportunity to right the boat, I am new to sailing but am picking it up and just want to get out on the water more often.
I would feel confident to solo if not for the fact of my concerns with regards to righting.
Its proving difficult to find a willing crew mate at times and as such I feel I am missing out on some great days sailing here in the UK.
I am a 150llb / 10.75 st 5'10 skinny git, and as such am pretty sure that righting the H16 is nye impossible solo.

My rig has a Hobie bob float attached to mast. So I got to thinking about a mast lifting system (Feel free to laugh) to assist in righting whereby the bob float is attached to a swinging arm connected to the mast. I should point out I am only interest in day sailing so class restrictions are not a concern to me at this time and to be honest if / when I decide to race the system would be designed to be easily removed for this purpose.

So, in the event of a capsize the system in its simplest form would require one to swim to the end of the mast and push the the bob down which is connected to a pole / bar (1-1.5 mtr length) that pivots at the mast while pulling on the opposite end of the bar/ pole. The bob would be forced downwards to a point that it is facing on a slight angle towards the hulls forward of its pivot point, a stopper mechanism would stop the float doing a full rotation. The mast would lift to the height determined by the length of bar connecting at the pivot point to the where the bob is connected. (the bar length 1-1.5 mtr but this needs to be investigated further).

Congratulations, if your following me thus far, I really should try and sketch a picture to assist in this description.

So, with the mast raised say by a meter or so, swim back to the hulls and use the righting line in the normal fashion but with the added benefit that the center of gravity has moved to ones favor. On successfully righting and with the bob clear from the water it would spring back to its upright position by some mechanism, for example a preloaded bungee or a line that could be released on capsize and then pulled and set at the base of the mast on righting.

Going further, I have designed a system / process that will do the above without having to swim to the end of the mast, by employing lines and pulleys at the base of mast.

OK, so I can hear myself saying over engineer a problem why don't ya, (heck thinking urban myth of NASA's zero gravity, upside down byro ;-) ) and sure it may look rather odd having this stuck up there at the top of the mast but if it works and it gives me peace of mind and more importantly get me out there sailing and learning then who gives a damn. I'm forty three, just been diagnosed with the onset of rheumatoid arthritis in my fingers so don't give a hoot about the fashion police! If it happens to work, it works, right?

Any thoughts and comments?

A couple of questions at what height approximately is the end of the mast when the top hull passes its own tipping point?
Let's say the end of the mast is lifted by approximately 1-1.5 meters, how much benefit / assistance would you think is gained in righting?

Thanks for reading and have a great Hobie Day :-)

-SRG

Owner of and Old but sexy 1984 H16 non comp tip. Yep, she's old enough to smoke.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 07, 2013 6:31 am 
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Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2005 10:18 am
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Location: Virginia Beach VA
I've tried all three. The righting bag is impossibly cumbersome. Most righting pole systems are not solo. You still need weight for leverage. They too are somewhat cumbersome to rig and stow. I wouldn't worry about demasting with shroud extenders. The kit comes with a small cable that lashes the mast to the step to prevent this from happening.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 07, 2013 6:44 am 
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Location: St. Louis, MO
That does sound really complicated. In my design experience, complicated things break at inopportune times. My suggestion is to focus on the righting pole. With the contraption you are describing you will also be adding weight aloft with the pole and probably disturbing the airflow over the mast and sail. The weight aloft will make capsizing easier.

The righting pole, however, is stowed under the tramp out of the way. The weight is kept nice and low. And it will be much easier to fabricate.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 07, 2013 7:44 pm 
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Location: Sarasota Sailing Squadron
im 125 and my crew is 125 and we got my boat up just fine with a righting pole. but i think if i had to i could get it up with just my weight, i can on land easily

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 08, 2013 5:16 am 
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This is what a lot of us use where I sail. Ron was letting a newbe Sam try it out and didn't want to get his sails wet but it works just as well with them on.

Some use a 2x4, some an aluminum pole with wooden ends bolted on. Pole is easily stored behind the front pylons crossways and up tight against the tramp with bungee cords. A 165lb person can right an 18 solo with this setup.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_26Fyll ... e=youtu.be

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_26FyllMq4&feature=youtu.be[/youtube]

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 08, 2013 10:06 am 
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What kind of stress does this put on the lip of the bottom hull? I would think this is not great for it. Do you notice any cracks in the gel coat in the area the end of the 2x4 is placed? If the hull is not being damaged by this, you cannot get any simpler for a righting pole.

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'84 H16
'82 H18 Magnum
St. Louis, MO


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2013 6:07 am 
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Location: New Brighton, PA
No one has had any damage and we have had them for 3 years at least. We have a couple of different version but all have a lip at the end the helps hold it in the hull. Create the lip by cutting of off about 1 1/4" off the 2" (1 1/2") I took a 6"x8" cutting board and screwed that onto the end of the 2x4 leaving about 3/4 in sticking out and then glued carpeting onto it and the wood. If making one out of 1.25" aluminum tube you can make the end as wide as you like.

I took some photos of a stick I made in about 20 min while on vacation just in case I needed one. I have everything with me but the 2x3. Black area is a spray on bed liner material for added traction. Also added one of what the end piece can look like on a tube Dave Adams was making. It was his idea to start making these to help right his 18.

Image

Image

Image

Image

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2013 4:19 am 
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Location: London
Thanks for your replies and writing pole pictures.
Leading towards a righting pole system at this time but also considering shroud extensions.

Thanks.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 9:09 am 
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buxton wrote:
This is what a lot of us use where I sail. Ron was letting a newbe Sam try it out and didn't want to get his sails wet but it works just as well with them on.

Some use a 2x4, some an aluminum pole with wooden ends bolted on. Pole is easily stored behind the front pylons crossways and up tight against the tramp with bungee cords. A 165lb person can right an 18 solo with this setup.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_26Fyll ... e=youtu.be

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_26FyllMq4&feature=youtu.be[/youtube]



hy!
great! i will try that out. but what does 2x4 excatly mean - inch? how is the third lenght (x*y*z)?
thanks!


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 1:00 pm 
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2"x4" is a standard dimension sold in the US that you buy in the store. It's measured before being planned smooth, so it's really a 1.5"x3.5" that you walk out with. You want it to reach from pylon to pylon across the front of your boat and mount it right behind your dolphin striker, 7 feet works great, 7'2" max. Anything longer will splash up too much water while flying a hull.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 8:26 am 
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thanks! i definitley will try that.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 1:02 pm 
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Hi thanks for tips on the righting pole. I really want to fab one.
One thing I am a little confused with is the bottom end of the pole ie the end with the carpet on it.
I see you have added a lip by using a bread board but am a little confused how the pole stays in place when walking out on, ie it doesn't slip from the bottom hull.
So does the lip (bread / cutting board) tuck under the hull, or put another way is the bread board portion at the bottom of the pole when placing the pole against the bottom hull?

Watching the following video it appears that a lip is wedged between the dagger board but ofcouse as we know the H16 does not employ dagger boards.


Sorry for not quite getting this ;-)

SRG

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 2:38 pm 
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Dave is using a pole he first made for his 18. For the 16 the lip does tuck up in the hull lip. The carpet adds a little resistance. Some guys have just cut off 3/4" at the end leaving a lip. I wanted a little wider lip to help spread the load a little.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 3:34 am 
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Thank you buxton for your reply. Its making sense to me now.
Best I get to fabbing one up.

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