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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 5:06 pm 
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I have done a search for the correct way to fasten the batten ties for the jib and still need instructions. the leech cap has 1 hole and one groove. I read to "tie like mainsail" the directions for main is to tie bowline knot at grommet. My concern is that while jib is rotating past mast it will eventually pull line from leech thus allowing batten to come from sail and go swimming. question 2 is which side does the batten tie go into the leech cap smooth side first or recessed side first? I also searched on Google with no good results

I'm really looking forward to getting out early this year

Thanks
Hal


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 7:33 am 
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Location: Lake Norman NC
always tie a fail safe knot and epoxy the caps on
Battens are very expensive these days even one getting loose is an unplanned trip to shore
Former Hobie Admiral Gary


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 8:46 am 
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Just tuck the loose end of the line under one of the tightened lines. Tie a knot in the end... if it comes loose, the knot stops it at the batten cap hole.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 4:49 pm 
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I have what seems to be a unique method of tieing battens on both the main and jib. When I was a dealer, I never had to sell a replacement batten because of one getting lost from one of the boats I rigged-which was several hundred.
For the jib, start by tieing the end of the line in a small, tight bowline on the side of the sail that the wide part of the cleat slot in the batten will be. There is not a lot of extra line for the main, so learn to tie the bowline tight to the sail with little tail left. I would have to show you in person the easy way, but you'll have to figure that out on your own from here.
The next step is the important part. The line now goes through the hole, and you need this very specific knot that I invented for this purpose. It's sort of like tying a figure 8, but rather than making the lower part of the 8, the line passes completely around the line just where it comes out of the hole in the batten cap, and after circumnavigating the bottom of the knot, goes through the loop formed by the top of the 8. At that point, the loop formed by the top of the 8 gets passed down over the rest of the knot, and tail pulled tight. As you push the loop down over the rest of the knot, you can easily take all the slack out of the line to the point that the batten is exactly held fully in the pocket with no forward/backward motion. This leaves a stop knot tight on that side of the batten cap hole that won't go back through the hole. It really is like a figure 8 with an extra twist. A figure 8 will go back through the hole. This knot will not. If you tie it correctly, and forget to cleat the line, it won't matter at all. The batten should automatically be in the right tension as if the line was cleated with no tension on the batten, but also no slack.

Now the tail of the line can go through the grommet on the other side of the sail and back through the cleat slot, to cleat tension as needed.

For the main is very similar, but the line goes farther for the extra purchase. For the second purchase, the line goes through the original bowline loop instead of the grommet again, and then back to the cleat. If I'm remembering correctly, there wasn't enough length to go through the first grommet again.

I tie the little bowline with just the tips of my fingers, in a twisting motion. You can't actually see what happening under my fingertips, because the knot is so tiny. Learn to tie a bowline with regular sized line first with the twisting motion. Lay the tail across the line, put thumb under the intersection, twist your hand away from you, and form the loop with the line coming up through it in that one motion. The little batten line bowline is tied the same way, only under your finger tips. The stock lines didn't give any extra to have left over, but just enough to do it this way.

I never epoxied a batten cap on, and never lost one. The stop knot at the right tension makes it impossible for even the cap to come off of the batten.


Last edited by Tom King on Fri Apr 19, 2013 1:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 5:26 pm 
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Location: Central Oregon
I am going to have to read that a few dozen times. 8)

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 19, 2013 6:37 am 
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Location: Lake Norman NC
What is this bowline everyone keeps talking about? I keep a pair of ss hemostats in the hobie hell box It comes in handy for pulling lines thru the grommets on the jib sail and for securing the line with a few wrapes
Former Hobie Admiral Gary


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 19, 2013 7:57 am 
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Location: Oceanside, California
This video of tying batten lines is from the Getaway, but that sail uses both types of caps... jib and main. I show here how to properly thread, cleat and tuck the ends to secure. Batten tensioning starts about 14 seconds into this segment.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gv1L8Q3K0Wk&list=PLBB01CB7DA7D36802&feature=player_detailpage#t=14s[/youtube]

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Hobie Cat USA


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 19, 2013 1:46 pm 
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That's a standard way of tensioning the batten in the video. My way allows that, but also prevents the possibility of losing a batten, or batten cap regardless of how the line is cleated and secured, or even forgotten about. The stop knot doesn't affect tensioning any kind of way at all. Batten lines didn't used to come that long, as in the video, and the little bowline knot was the only way to secure the line to start with and end up with enough line for the rest of the purchase with the safety knot.

The battens haven't been out of our 21 or 16 sails for 25 years, and are still fine with the original batten tie line.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 19, 2013 2:42 pm 
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can you provide a picture of this?


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PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2013 2:27 pm 
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hobiesrock wrote:
I am going to have to read that a few dozen times. 8)


Seriously! Me too! :shock:

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PostPosted: Sun May 05, 2013 5:25 pm 
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It's really easy once you see it. Just like tying a figure 8 knot, but go all the way around the bottom of the 8 another time, then after the tail goes through the upper loop of the 8, slide the upper loop down over the rest of the knot. It just forms a stop knot with the batten all the way in the pocket with no tension on the batten at all, but also won't let the batten back out even a fraction.

A regular figure 8 was not large enough with the old stock tie line to not go back through the hole. The extra wrap of the bottom loop gives it just enough size so it won't go through the hole.

Tightening the batten line normally just pulls the stop knot towards the grommet and doesn't prevent tensioning the batten any kind of way you want to. When tension is released, the stop knot just goes back to its place of holding the batten in the pocket with no slack.

I post pictures on all sorts of other forums, but this one has too many hoops to go through. The line is small and the knot mostly takes place under my fingertips, so I'm not sure pictures would help.

There are probably still hundreds of Hobie sails out there somewhere that are still tyed like this, that I did.


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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 4:06 am 
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Location: Tuscaloosa, AL
Tom King wrote:
It's really easy once you see it. Just like tying a figure 8 knot, but go all the way around the bottom of the 8 another time, then after the tail goes through the upper loop of the 8, slide the upper loop down over the rest of the knot. It just forms a stop knot with the batten all the way in the pocket with no tension on the batten at all, but also won't let the batten back out even a fraction.

A regular figure 8 was not large enough with the old stock tie line to not go back through the hole. The extra wrap of the bottom loop gives it just enough size so it won't go through the hole.

Tightening the batten line normally just pulls the stop knot towards the grommet and doesn't prevent tensioning the batten any kind of way you want to. When tension is released, the stop knot just goes back to its place of holding the batten in the pocket with no slack.

I post pictures on all sorts of other forums, but this one has too many hoops to go through. The line is small and the knot mostly takes place under my fingertips, so I'm not sure pictures would help.

There are probably still hundreds of Hobie sails out there somewhere that are still tyed like this, that I did.

Do you have an iphone or aneroid phone? If so install Tapatalk. It lets you upload pica directly.


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