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Problem with comp tip masthead and halyard
http://www.hobie.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=52810		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  Kate [ Sun Sep 07, 2014 3:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Problem with comp tip masthead and halyard
We just bought our first (used) Hobie Cat and the previous owner had never sailed it. When trying to raise the mainsail we are finding it impossible to get the last few inches up when the mast is vertical. The front side of the brass slug joining the rope to the wire portion on the mainsail halyard is getting caught on the inner top side of the masthead. When the mast is down we can overcome this by pulling the halyard at a much wider angle (away from the mast) but with the mast up the halyard gets jammed as it goes over the top of the sheaves. The sheaves themselves are fine and the masthead casing doesn't appear missshapen. The last inch of the rope portion of the halyard (by the copper slug) is stiff, presumably with metal inside, and it appears that the length of this stiff portion, plus the visible copper slug, are not allowing the halyard to turn in the space between the top of the sheaves and the inner top side of the masthead.
Has anyone else seen this? Do we just need to buy a new mainsail halyard?
Author:  mmiller [ Mon Sep 08, 2014 3:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Problem with comp tip masthead and halyard
Never heard of that problem... maybe not a Hobie made halyard? Maybe not the right mast head? Bend in the housing which encroaches on the halyard space?
Author:  AntonLargiader [ Mon Sep 08, 2014 3:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Problem with comp tip masthead and halyard
It's gotta be either your masthead or halyard. I just checked my boat and the halyard feels pretty much as you describe, so let's take a closer look at the masthead.

Here's an outside pic of the masthead just in case there's something radically different about yours:

Image

It's positioned so the halyard misses the leading edge of the mast as it comes down over the tang. Inside, there is about a half halyard's clearance between the halyard itself and the roof of the sheave frame. If this clearance is too small, I can see how it would bind as it rolls off the front sheave.

Image
Author:  Kate [ Mon Sep 08, 2014 7:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Problem with comp tip masthead and halyard
Thank you for the replies. Anton, the photos are very helpful. I will go to where the boat is stored and check out the clearance between the halyard and sheave frame roof. I think it is a lot tighter than you show. Will take a photo ... just need to figure out how I post the photo!
Author:  MBounds [ Tue Sep 09, 2014 4:42 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Problem with comp tip masthead and halyard
It may be technique as well. Stand outside the jib / bridles to decrease the angle of the halyard exiting the mast and make sure you're not pulling at an angle to the mast (straight along the front).
Author:  sxrracer [ Tue Sep 09, 2014 2:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Problem with comp tip masthead and halyard
When I got my 98 H16 last year, it was very difficult to get past the same spot you are talking about. The farther out you go the better. The more I did it the easier it got. Part of it is technique and part may be from just the boat not being rigged...
Author:  Kate [ Tue Sep 09, 2014 7:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Problem with comp tip masthead and halyard
Ive now taken some pictures.

First one shows the masthead - looks the same as yours Anton, and same clearance as the halyard passes down the mast
http://imgur.com/2f2cJNY
Next one tries to show the internal clearance of the halyard - picture is not that clear, but its about 1/4 of a halyard space
http://imgur.com/PlxqHFx
This then tries to show the clearance (zero) as the slug passes over the second sheave and gets jammed
http://imgur.com/O280NHp
And finally an external shot showing the point at which it is jammed
http://imgur.com/kfEmuaI

I think me next step is to go to a local dealer and see if they have a masthead I can run my halyard through, or a new halyard I can try in my mast (and return if that sticks too!)
Author:  MBounds [ Tue Sep 09, 2014 8:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Problem with comp tip masthead and halyard
There's something wrong with that masthead fitting. The top of it should be parallel to the top of the mast - and this looks like it slopes aft.

Maybe someone backed the mast into something when it was on the trailer?

Cure is either straightening it out or a new(used) masthead. There's a couple on eBay, but they're $$.
Author:  sunvista [ Wed Sep 10, 2014 7:35 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Problem with comp tip masthead and halyard
It was definitely whacked with something. Hard enough for the mounting flange to break off in the back.
Author:  mattsails247 [ Wed Sep 10, 2014 10:39 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Problem with comp tip masthead and halyard
Comp-tip mast heads are pretty easy to straighten out. I dropped mine and it broke a couple of the rivets and bent it up bad. Some new rivets, a set of flat jaw vice grips and some paint fixed it right up.
Author:  MBounds [ Wed Sep 10, 2014 2:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Problem with comp tip masthead and halyard
sunvista wrote:
It was definitely whacked with something. Hard enough for the mounting flange to break off in the back.
There is no mounting flange on the aft end to begin with.

The more I look at it, the more I think it looks bent because of an optical illusion.

Is the slug at the wire/line join larger than the line diameter? It looks like it from the photo where it's jammed.

Bottom line is that the slug needs to make its way through the masthead - either by increasing the clearance between the sheaves and the top, or making the slug smaller.
Author:  waldorf [ Thu Sep 11, 2014 10:14 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Problem with comp tip masthead and halyard
Does the Hobie made halyard have the Hobie logo on it ????
Author:  MBounds [ Thu Sep 11, 2014 11:55 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Problem with comp tip masthead and halyard
waldorf wrote:
Does the Hobie made halyard have the Hobie logo on it ????

No - the Hobie Comptip halyard has no logo on it or the shackle.

But the flecks in the line they have look exactly like a Hobie brand Comptip halyard.
Author:  DanITman [ Thu Sep 11, 2014 7:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Problem with comp tip masthead and halyard
Kate wrote:
Ive now taken some pictures.

First one shows the masthead - looks the same as yours Anton, and same clearance as the halyard passes down the mast
http://imgur.com/2f2cJNY
Next one tries to show the internal clearance of the halyard - picture is not that clear, but its about 1/4 of a halyard space
http://imgur.com/PlxqHFx
This then tries to show the clearance (zero) as the slug passes over the second sheave and gets jammed
http://imgur.com/O280NHp
And finally an external shot showing the point at which it is jammed
http://imgur.com/kfEmuaI

I think me next step is to go to a local dealer and see if they have a masthead I can run my halyard through, or a new halyard I can try in my mast (and return if that sticks too!)


Can you post a photo where the halyard connects to the wire. Based on the photos you have here it looks as if there is a knot connecting the two. There should be no knot and it should be smooth. Here is what it should look like.

Image
Author:  Kate [ Sat Sep 13, 2014 1:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Problem with comp tip masthead and halyard
Here is a picture of the halyard.
http://imgur.com/qNW66NG
The copper "slug" was pretty rough with nicks and lumps, and looked a little fatter than the rope section, so I carefully used a dremel with a sanding roller to smooth it and slightly reduce the diameter. But then I think I melted whatever bonds it into the rope, and the slug actually moved out of the rope by about 1-2mm. Going from bad to worse!

Anyway, when I tried it in the masthead this morning it rubbed, but it was no longer totally jamming as it was before. Having decided I've probably ruined it anyway and will need to by another, I went the whole hog and cut a ring about 3mm long off the end. Now it goes through even easier, but still with some rubbing.

I guess if it fails I just have my main fall down and I have to sail back on the jib. Should I use it or just buy a new one?

By the way, I don't think the masthead is sloping back, I think the photo was mis-leading because the mast was slightly rolled to one side, so the perspective was off...
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