Hobie 16 Restoration Project: Advice wanted

I have what seems to be a mid 70's Hobie 16 (Not really sure..) that is in pretty back nick that I would greatly enjoy getting back into sailing condition. I've been wanting one of these for years now and just could never find anything in my price range. However this one was just over $200 so I went and bought it. I'm not really worried about how much effort it will take to fix it as I'm very capable usually and I know anything can be fixed with fiberglass. But I was wanting some opinions and advice.

I'll load pictures into a second post on this thread.

I know for a fact that I should replace all the rigging, I need to do probably a lot of work to the hulls, and I may need to patch the sails slightly. (I have't gotten a great look at them yet but they seem mostly whole.)
About 70% of the deck in front of the pylon on the right hull is soft and cracks slightly when pressure is added, to me this sounds like I'll have to do more than the usual resin/epoxy injection that is suggested?
The left hull is much more firm an does not crak at all though there does still seem to be a lot of soft area in the front as well in the rear. Though both hulls are very firm between the pylons and against the pylons.

There is also some damage on the lower inside of the left hull that I know I will have to grind out and reglass the area to correct.

I was curious is anyone has made a mold of the hulls and created there own? I know it'd cost quiet a lot more but it seems like a logical alternative considering the market for wholesome hulls.. Or what is the option for reglassing the entire hull? Once again I know it'd take a lot of effort and cost a good bit but I'm curious if anyone has attempted it?

I've decided to dig myself into a nice little (Major) project. I don't care if the boat is never capable of racing again in it's life, I just want something that'd be a nice day sailer.

Thank you,
Richard

As far as I know, no one is making replacement hulls other than Hobie. I would recommend searching craigslist for good hulls before you try to repair extensive soft spots.

Yea, Hobie Alter and his buddies, about 45 years ago....

Seriously, the only reason to create full on molds of the hulls would be if you wanted to go into production. Besides the enormous scale of such a project, I think you would have to deal with the lawyers pouncing all over you for trademark infringement...



Cut out the entire effected area of the deck leaving a 1" to 2" wide "tab" all around rebuild the deck laminate and then glass it back into the hull. You are correct, it is a major project.

From the sounds of your description, the hulls are shot and you would be much better off just sourcing a decent pair of structurally sound hulls.




Always amazing to me when someone waits years to find a boat in their price range (a couple hundred bucks) and then is willing to sink endless amounts of money and time into repairing it when they could have just plunked down a few more bucks from the get go and had a boat that was immediately ready to sail.

sm

+1

This is a silly project. Find some decent hulls. You'll spend less and have more time to sail.

Sorry, but those hulls are done. 70% of the deck really means that the boat is beyond reasonably saving. If the boat had some sentimental value, I'd understand trying to save it, but why spend ~$5-10k trying to resurrect a boat when you can get one in almost new condition for that price? Chances are the deck is almost completely separated from the hull, and if the deck is that far gone, the sides of the hulls can't be far behind. This is a boat that was abused and neglected. Water was almost definitely left in the hulls, which only hastens the formation of soft spots. The decks are very important, structurally. If the deck separates from the hull or buckles, or if the sides are soft and they buckle, the whole boat will break apart. If you try to inject epoxy into such a large area, it'll "balloon" and fill with quarts and quarts of epoxy, probably crack the inner layer of glass and fill the bottom of the boat. You can't just re-glass it because you need the two layers of glass with a foam core for strength.



The boat was originally built in two pieces - the hull and the deck. Each had it's own mold. I'm sure that the decks are soft all the way to the lip. The only way to repair that, really, is to build a new deck. You'd need a mold of the deck (which would probably cost close to $1k to build and take weeks to finish). You'd have to get the mold perfect, with no air pockets or voids, with enough strength to hold it's shape. Then you'd have to spray several layers of gel coat into the mold, followed by a few layers of glass, followed by foam, followed by another few layers of glass. Then you'd have to re-bond the deck to the hull, and that's IF the hull is still good. That much fiberglass and resin will probably cost you another $1k. Need to do the hull? that's another $3-4k for the mold and the hull. The two hulls are not identical, so if you need to make another deck/hull, that's even more. Replacement hulls from Hobie are probably $5-6k. Hobie has a dedicated factory, already built molds and experienced workers. You're not going to be able to build a hull for less than they can.

I'm sure if you wanted to, you could spend $10k and re-build the boat almost as good as new, and it'd take you months and months of work. The question is why? You can get a "nice day sailer" for probably $2k used, or a brand new boat for $12k, and save yourself a lot of time and headache in the process.

For $200, you may have some decent parts (mast and trampoline frame, maybe some blocks, pins and rings, rudder system). Hang onto those and find a boat in better shape. Trust me, even a $1,500 boat will have it's share of problem to fix and repairs to make in order to get it back into good shape, and you can still have fun fixing up an old boat, learn a lot and take pride in the boat. You're always bound to find problems that need to be repaired or improved as you get more familiar with the boat. Trust me, that's what I did. (Just don't expect it to be cheap! )

However, if you're dead set on building new hulls and saving an old boat, might I suggest an 18?

_________________
Mike

'79 H18 standard 'Rocketman II' sail #14921 RIP
'78 H18 (unnamed) sail #14921
'08 H16 sail #114312
'97 H21SC sail #238

I find the mixture of negative and positive in here to be really odd.. My first instinct is honestly to argue with you simply because I know it CAN be done. But you're all completely correct, it shouldn't be done for this boat.

I concede the point and hope you'll all help me then in parting this boat out to try and afford one in a at least fixable condition. From all of my reading, while the hulls are shot, the mast, rudder system and rudders, sails, and possibly the tramp parts are all good and usable.

The mast is one piece aluminum with a plastic round tip at the end and is arrow straight and all the fittings on it are still shiny and whole. Even the steel cables mounted to it look to be in good condition, but I understand that doesn't mean a whole lot all the time.

The rudders need cleaning and the four bar system has been sitting out in the weather for around 5 years I'm told, but it all operates pretty smoothly. I just can't say for sure if it's actually going to be worth anything to anyone.

It came with two main sails and a single jib. the sail in better condition needs two patches but has all the battens as well as the boom and the pulley rigging that would be at the rear. The main is the Cat Fever (1978) sail. The second main lacks all battens as well as any boom or rigging, it looks like it has multiple small tears around the numbers and two small tears in the portion below. It's the Flamer coloration (1975). And the jib has all the battens as well but is a light blue colour with two windows. (maybe a 70 - 72 jib by the sail colour chart?)
I know the sails are suppose to be somewhat pricey in good condition, but with damaged I'm not sure.

The tramp I believe is the vinyl? It doesn't seem to be a mesh but it does seem to still be strong. I have't tested my weight on it as the cord I believe should be replaced first but against my hand it seems more than capable of holding my weight. It's just white and of course got rather dirty from sitting outside so long so it does need cleaning. All the aluminum framework still likes whole and once cleaned looks new to me.

I can also post pictures to show each part, I tried to take detailed ones. Of course I also know that used prices are somewhat conjecture, I'd just like to know what each one should kind of average at so I can try to sell them as an informed person. I'm certainly not looking to get rich of them as it'd take extremely little to break even in this.

Thank you,
Richard

I think the dichotomy of responses reflects two different viewpoints of what to do with an old boat: emotional vs. economic.

Some people become very emotionally attached to their boats - even if they've only recently acquired them - and will spend large sums to fix delamination problems, even though the results may be temporary (delam is like cancer - it can and will come back) and unsightly (unless you're a fiberglass expert, you'll never bring the boat back to "like new" condition).

The question to ask yourself is, do you want to fix boats or go sailing? If it's the latter, then you're better off finding a boat in better condition than the one you have.

I agree with Matt. A lot of guys spend a lot of time fixing up their boats because they become attached to them, or in the case of the discontinued boats, because there is a finite number of them left. Hobie 16's, however, are both plentiful and still in production, so if you're looking to get one, you're better off looking for one that's in good shape. You said you had waited a while to find one in your price range, but you were about to spend seriously a ton of money trying to fix it up, and I think as much as we all love these boats, we also hate to see someone get themselves frustrated with a big project like that when they could find a boat in better shape for less, and spend more time on the water enjoying the boat!

I'd recommend looking for a boat in the $1000-$2000 range. Price is no guarantee of quality, so check over the boat thoroughly, but I think your money would be much better spent at that price point. A boat with a small soft spot or two could be a bargain, as soft spot repairs are relatively cheap and easy, and the boat could surely still last for years. That said, see if you can find one without any, and what the price point may be. Someone may just be looking to get rid of a boat they don't use anymore. Doesn't even need to be a newer boat, as there are many boats in my area in great shape from the 70's and 80's (fresh water helps).

As far as selling used parts, that's tricky. You need to find someone in the market for used parts, and the bigger parts (mast, tramp frame, etc) are difficult to transport. There is definitely value in them, it's just a matter of finding someone who wants or needs them. Sails are common on ebay for a few hundred bucks, rudders are cheap and not worth much (maybe $25-75). A good trampoline is still worth some money ($100+?) - yours is probably original vinyl, and if it's not overly worn down or tearing, it's still in good shape. Used rigging isn't really worth much unless you can say with certainty how old it is. New standing rigging is ~$300 and running rigging is probably ~$200. The blocks are all worth something, say ~$50 for jib blocks and ~$200 for mainsheet blocks. The boom and the mast could be worth a few hundred a piece, as well as the trampoline frame, but that's provided you find someone local who needs them. All prices are obviously heavily dependent on condition. It may be worth considering hanging on to a lot of these parts for spares when you get a boat in good shape, as a lot of the parts that sell well are also parts you may find yourself in need of down the road.