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 Post subject: Re: Transom Failure
PostPosted: Tue May 29, 2012 9:07 am 
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Hobie Tech / Moderator

Joined: Wed May 28, 2003 1:12 pm
Posts: 999
Roy wrote:
Hello! I'd like someone from Hobie to coment if at all possible. I'd hate to be far from shore and have half the transom seperate from the rest of the boat. :( :o :o


Sorry Roy for the delay - we have been closed for the Holiday.

There ins't an answer for you though - nothing about a 2006 Getaway that would have an issue or need your attention. The other user had a much older boat than yours... and with extensive use through surf, so a transom does get abused more in ocean conditions.

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Jacques Bernier
http://www.hobiecat.com/
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 Post subject: Re: Transom Failure
PostPosted: Tue May 29, 2012 11:50 am 
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Joined: Thu Apr 21, 2005 8:36 am
Posts: 51
Location: Ormond Beach, Florida
the person that started this thread had a hull failure exactly like mine in Sept 2009.
i really feel that my boat was well taken care of. We bought this boat to for comfortable and safe sailing. Roller furling jib and boomless main slows this boat to a crawl in any wind and was a much drier boat than the fiber 16. I just replaced the tramp last year and a set of shrouds 3-4 years ago. The shrouds looked great but everyone said to replace them. My rudders still have the original cams and still work great.


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 Post subject: Re: Transom Failure
PostPosted: Sat Jun 02, 2012 9:51 pm 
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Site Rank - Deck Hand

Joined: Sat Jun 02, 2012 8:48 pm
Posts: 3
That's crazy, we run getaways and wave's 6 days a week, 7 hours per day and our oldest boat is a 2006 wave. We have no signs of cracks like that in any of our boats hulls. Also in the gulf...

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You're not doing it right if you don't keep it upright...

When in doubt, let it out...

You look awesome flying a hull, then you dump and look like a jerk...


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 Post subject: Re: Transom Failure
PostPosted: Sat Jun 02, 2012 9:55 pm 
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Site Rank - Deck Hand

Joined: Sat Jun 02, 2012 8:48 pm
Posts: 3
Ours sit on the beach 24-7, rain or shine, uncovered. SWFL...

_________________
You're not doing it right if you don't keep it upright...

When in doubt, let it out...

You look awesome flying a hull, then you dump and look like a jerk...


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 Post subject: Re: Transom Failure
PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 10:09 am 
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Site Rank - Captain

Joined: Thu Apr 21, 2005 8:36 am
Posts: 51
Location: Ormond Beach, Florida
never saw any cracks. Always saw rudders flex the transom. im surprised how thin the material is in the area of the transom. looks like the white plastic is like 1/8" and the foam backing is maybe 1/4" which is not structural at all. Maybe the stainless screws started bleeding rust and started the process of creating the cracks. i was a able to easily rip a piece off and will take more close up pics.


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 Post subject: Re: Transom Failure
PostPosted: Thu Jun 07, 2012 7:00 am 
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Site Rank - Captain

Joined: Thu Apr 21, 2005 8:36 am
Posts: 51
Location: Ormond Beach, Florida
Image
Image
Image
this was a piece that i was able to rip off the transom by hand.


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 Post subject: Re: Transom Failure
PostPosted: Thu Jun 07, 2012 6:59 pm 
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Site Rank - Captain

Joined: Tue Sep 20, 2011 7:27 pm
Posts: 27
Location: Costa Rica
zhopper, first I want to say I am glad you made it back safely and thank you for sharing this with the rest of us and making all of us aware of this potential situation. You could have contacted Hobie directly and left the rest of us in the dark.

I am very concerned over your transom problems and somewhat frustrated by Mr Bernier's response and his lack of concern for your problem and the possibility of future issues with other boats. Yours is the third documented failure of this type on this site in the last 3 years. I assume that not every owner knows of this site and that there may have been other failures that never got posted here.

I didn't realize that the Getaway had a life expectancy of 9 years or so and that they are more of a lake boat, rather then a ocean capable boat, like the true Hobie's of the fiberglass variety. I am sure that many of us would not have bought our boats if this information was published on their web site, or in the owners manual. I have come to realize the limitations of the Getaway since reading Mr Bernier's remarks to Roy. He states "that the other user had a much older boat than yours....and with extensive use through surf, so a transom does get abused more in ocean conditions." I am really confused by his comments and my total misunderstanding of what a Hobie Cat is. I thought the original design concept of Hobie Alter was to build a boat that could be launched from the beach through the surf, to be sailed in the ocean off of the southern California coast. I guess by his comment to Roy that your much older boat, ( your 2003 vs his 2006) should be expected to fail and that he probably shouldn't worry about his transom for another 3 years or so. I can only say that I am very concerned about my 2002 model, that I sail in the ocean in Costa Rica, with my wife and 2 year old on board. I realize that 3 boats or so, may not be a large failure rate compared to the number of Getaways that Hobie has built, but I can not imagine the fear and concern that I would have for my family's safety and the trauma that they might have if this were to happen to me.

If I sound a bit bitter and angry, I am. I bought my 2002 Getaway last fall, because I thought that the rotomolded boats were family safe and almost indestructible. To bring the boat up to par and to be secure with the safety of the boat, I replaced both tramps, main sail, standing rigging, running rigging, wing covers, rebuilt the rudders and replaced any pins and keepers that looked suspect. In addition, I had a custom SS motor bracket fabricated and mounted a new 2HP Yamaha to get me out of the river mouth and into the ocean. I am currently waiting for a new Screecher to be made, which will be mounted on a custom bowsprit with roller furling. Add in the cost of shipping and import taxes and I have almost $11,000 invested in this boat and now I am concerned about the safety of my family and the possibility of my investment going to the bottom of the ocean.

I realize I might get bashed for being so critical about Hobie, but I really think Hobie has a responsibility to make you whole for the loss you incurred. I looked at the OP from 2009 and it appears that his transom was also about 1/8" thick also, this looks to be way to thin for the transom, considering the loads put on it. I also understand that nothing lasts forever, but their fiber glass boats have lasted a lot longer than 9 years and none of us bought these boats thinking that they only had a 9 year life expectancy. In addition this problem has a life threatening possibility attached to it and I think it should be covered beyond the normal warranty period, the same as GM does on their cars when a safety issue has been discovered, even if the car is out of warranty. I hope that Hobie steps up to the plate for you and that I need to apologize for being so critical of them. In the mean time, I will sail my boat a bit less confident in it's ability to handle the abuse of the ocean and I will be much more aware of my distance off shore, wondering if I may be in the same situation that you were.


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 Post subject: Re: Transom Failure
PostPosted: Sat Jun 09, 2012 7:16 pm 
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Site Rank - Captain

Joined: Thu Apr 21, 2005 8:36 am
Posts: 51
Location: Ormond Beach, Florida
The getaway has been a great boat. Its not a fiber 16 like i have had in the past and this is why i purchased it. Look at the cost of this boat versus the fiber 16. The getaway is not a performance boat but was designed to get people back into sailing and has been viral in the rental fleets. After 2004 there were no more hull issues but i actually thought issues were only around the front cross member. There were no cracks or discoloration that gave me warning. A 2002 boat falls into the area of under baked hulls. So removing the inspection port inside the cooler and taking pictures of your critical areas would be beneficial. I am still in contact with Hobie and would love to send them this piece of hull for analysis. They have not asked for it yet but Was very surprised by the thinness of the transom. As far as being abused by ocean conditions going through a beach break for the inexperienced is not a good idea. You can get turned sideways very quickly and not having enough weight forward and enough speed hitting a breaker will push the boat backwards and if the rudders are locked down will back down and snap them off in an instant. Thats what i did when i was 20 years old with my first Hobie. im 43 now and personally with family onbaord, i walk it through the breakers and dont go out on rough days. I removed the front tramp years ago. Funny thing is my boat never gets trailered and i personally think that trailering with your rudders adds more wear and tear than sailing. The quick releases means its takes 10 seconds to pull them off and stow them away. Ive never even replaced by rudder cams yet.


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 Post subject: Re: Transom Failure
PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2012 7:09 pm 
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Site Rank - Captain

Joined: Tue Sep 20, 2011 7:27 pm
Posts: 27
Location: Costa Rica
I stayed a week in Mexico last fall and the resort had a fleet of Wave"s available. I thoroughly enjoyed the Wave and liked the durability of the hulls, however they did have 2 with cracks at the rear cross members. I wrote this off to rental abuse, or even the possibility of being tossed through the air in a hurricane. I really enjoyed the boat, but decided it was to small for my needs and under powered for the light winds here in CR.

Not knowing anything about Hobie's, I went to the Hobie website to see what other models they offered and was pleasantly surprised when I saw the Getaway. I found this site and read almost every post to learn about the Getaway and the two negatives I found were the under cooked hulls, which I thought were only on the 2001 and possibly 2002 models and the OP on this thread regarding transom failure. I decided to attribute the transom issue to possible owner negligence. I spent so much time under my Hobie looking for cracks at the cross members and on the transoms, that I think the seller thought I was nuts. I found this boat in CR and I didn't want to think about the time and cost involved to get a new hull, or hulls, shipped to CR in the event of a hull failure. I felt that being a 9 year old boat without any signs of stress cracks, that this boat was probably not going to have any issues.

Now that you have posted your pictures and after reviewing the pictures from the OP, I am concerned about the thickness of my transom's and there is really no way to know the thickness unless they fail and as you well know, at the very best, that is not a pleasant experience.

I am not to surprised that Hobie hasn't asked you to send a piece of the transom back to them, I am surprised that they haven't asked for the complete hulls back. It doesn't seem to be a problem with under cooking, it looks as if there is just not enough material at the transom. I would think that this is due to a lack of material being placed in the molds, or uneven distribution of material as the mold was rotated. Getting the hulls back would allow Hobie to weigh them and to see if the proper amount of material was used. This would also allow them to cut cross sections through the hulls, allowing them to see if the material was excessively thick or thin in other areas. If this problem is due to uneven disbursement, or a lack of materials and I don't know what else could have caused such a thin transom, then this problem could pop up any model year to date. Please keep us informed as to what Hobie's position is on this.


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 Post subject: Re: Transom Failure
PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 12:31 pm 
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Site Rank - Captain

Joined: Thu Apr 21, 2005 8:36 am
Posts: 51
Location: Ormond Beach, Florida
Hobie Cat did get back with me on prorating a set of hulls. Unfortunately they are still out of my price range and I can't afford to invest that much money into her right now but for 9 year old hulls they did step up and give me a good break. I wish I just needed one hull. But 2, I just can't swing it right now. I also still need one rudder that I lost. We are thinking of cutting port holes in the back and sandwiching starboard or aluminum with 5200 but just don't know if the materiel will continue to rip. You would think the stainless bolts would have sheared first like other people have experienced. That I could have repaired. If this doesn’t work we might take the whole rig and put it on my friend's old matrix 5.5 cat.


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 Post subject: Re: Transom Failure
PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 1:07 pm 
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Site Rank - Captain

Joined: Sat Jul 24, 2010 6:07 pm
Posts: 62
I've seen (today) Getaway hulls for sale but they needed some repairs. Use www.statewidesearch.com to search craigslist.
You can buy a decent used Getaway for less than 2 new hulls ($5k) and selle your old boat for spare parts (all at once or part by part). I assume home owner's insurance won't cover it.

I think there is another thread on this issue because I recall Hobie offering to give a discount years ago. My recollection is they said the hull problem was only in 2001 and maybe 2002 - same as the other poster said.

Maybe they should have wood inside the hull for the hardware to mount to (to spread the force out more). And the steel rusting is worrisome. I wonder what type of CRES / stainless they used.


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 Post subject: Re: Transom Failure
PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 4:32 pm 
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Site Rank - Captain

Joined: Sun Dec 04, 2011 2:40 pm
Posts: 80
This is a very frightening thread... I'm wondering if it would be a good idea to back out every possible screw and bolt and apply some:
http://shopping.rexmar.com/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/167196.jpg
...just for a bit of insurance against the devastations of saltwater corrosion.
Thanks.
Scott


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 Post subject: Re: Transom Failure
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 8:43 am 
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Site Rank - Captain

Joined: Thu Apr 21, 2005 8:36 am
Posts: 51
Location: Ormond Beach, Florida
i was able to put kril oil (orange can) in my screws and worked them out on my remaining assembly without snapping the bolts. Took a couple of days of spraying trying and waiting but all 6 came out.

after over a year of not being able to find a good set of hulls we are going to to try to rebuild the transom. First step was to cut the raised part out. It was soo thin that a box cutter knife was able to cut it out.

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 Post subject: Re: Transom Failure
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 9:09 am 
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Site Rank - Captain

Joined: Sat Jul 24, 2010 6:07 pm
Posts: 62
Hope it works out...wood on both sides (screwed together) would be easiest and strong I think, but how to get wood on the inside...I think similar to patching a hole in the wall of a house, you can probably get a piece of wood in the hole yet have it be larger than the hole (since the hole is not a perfect circle). Put a screw in the middle of the wood to have something to hold onto.

I suppose you don't need the inner wood to cover the hole completely - rely on the outer piece of wood to be 100% watertight.

Supposedly no glue sticks well the last I followed this stuff, so maybe a thick (needs to be thick due to curves of the hull) soft rubber gasket is the best way to seal it.

The bottom of the hole you cut out is awfully close to the sharp turns at the bottom of the hull...that'll be a tough area to patch/cover I fear.

To hold the two pieces of wood together tightly (and "sandwich" the plastic hull), drill the holes (in the outer wood and through the hull, but not the inner wood) larger than the screws, so the screws pull the boards together.


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 Post subject: Re: Transom Failure
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 9:24 am 
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Site Rank - Captain

Joined: Thu Apr 21, 2005 8:36 am
Posts: 51
Location: Ormond Beach, Florida
Thats my feeling as well but going to try starboard or pvc board first. Talked with the Gudgeon Brothers and they actually got a sample of the hull materiel and even their Gflex didn't work. Lots of nuts and bolts with two pieces sandwiched together with 5200 as gasket. The inner board should fit in sideways with the hole i made. I have some pvc board on hand will work on a mock up tonight.

Cut portholes into the top of the hull and very thick and strong no box cutter getting through there. rotozip worked well and didn't melt while cutting.


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