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PostPosted: Sun Apr 13, 2014 8:07 pm 
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So, I have become a victim of my own hubris. It was my belief that I could sail my Revo11 without amas. For calm weather, that's actually true. For winds 15 knots and over, well... you be the judge:
http://youtu.be/NVRbX3T2NQA

Edit: sorry the video is long because I didn't do much editing. Sail unfurls at 1:34 and the flip happens sometime after the 8 minute mark.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2014 1:18 pm 
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Location: Portland, Texas
Nothing like an accidental jibe to wake a person up out of a slumber. I especially enjoyed the underwater shots after the second flip. Nice job getting back in the boat. That part was picture perfect. I hope nothing beyond your pride was hurt during all of that. I usually try to remember to pull in the sheet during a jibe to prevent this from happening but every so often I forget and though I've yet to capsize (there's always the first time) it usually gives me a good heart thumping scare. You did good though, you kept your cool. Did you retrieve your hat?

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2010 Oasis
Lucie Belle


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2014 1:52 pm 
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I lost my hat and my slippers in the capsize, but forum member Revo_1756 spotted my slippers and collected them for me. The hat (one of my favorites) has probably drifted to Cuba by now.

It was a learning experience for sure, and only my 4th time sailing actually. You will see that I foolishly did NOT ease the main line as I jibed, so the flip was inevitable. Then if you look at the second re-entry you will notice that the mast is now bent near the base, so my sailing was over and done with as soon as I got back into the kayak. I guess the weight of the water on the sail was too much for the mast as I righted the kayak. I will get it straightened out and reinforce with a wooden dowel insert.

I remain unimpressed by the Hobie furling device, but Revo has told me a few tips to try to improve its performance, which I am keen to try and record on video for the community.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2014 2:34 pm 
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Location: S.E. Florida
Jcanracer wrote:
I lost my hat and my slippers in the capsize, but forum member Revo_1756 spotted my slippers and collected them for me. The hat (one of my favorites) has probably drifted to Cuba by now.

You were doing so well up to that instant of bad luck.
Sadly the hat got carried by the current or sank before I got there. It happened so quick. I turned my head to look up the channel for boats and turned back and saw the hull bottom. Fortunately the flip flops floated and were easily retrieved.

Jcanracer wrote:
I remain unimpressed by the Hobie furling device, but Revo has told me a few tips to try to improve its performance, which I am keen to try and record on video for the community.


I found even with my home made furler the mast sleeve was just to sloppy so twists in the bungee snugged things up. It makes a major difference with the new furler kit too. Adjustments need to be made in lines and bungee hook point for the different length kayaks. I ended up with the bungee hook above the rear paddle rest in order to get the furling line tight enough. It cannot be loose or slack at all or the teeth in the pulley have no grip. It should actually have a good deal of resistance to pull either way. Make sure it works correctly on land before venturing out on the water. Hold resistance on the sail main sheet as you furl if it slips tighten it up more.

image of the bungee twist on my old home made furler.. I now put the mast through 3 hoops.
Image

Revo

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A Thrill Ride is being dragged around in your kayak for 40 minutes by an extremely large fish.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2014 3:11 pm 
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I'm not giving up my friend. I still want to see what max speed I can get out of this kayak under sail.
BUT now I will also be lurking craigslist for some form of amas. I like the look of Spring Creek's stabilizers more than the Hobie floats, but they are twice the price. Not sure if I can justify that at the moment.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2014 5:02 pm 
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Location: S.E. Florida
Just remember any stabilizer in the water will cause drag and slow you down as many will attest to here in the forum. I used to keep mine lower and found it was not necessary. Nice thing about Hobie sidekicks is the height adjustment to keep them up and out of the water. They give you just that moment to dump the sail if you keel over too far. Function outweighs the looks. I have had 20+ knot gusts between cul de sacs on a lake catch me and the sidekicks prevented a turtle.

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I would rather be kayaking and think about work than to be at work thinking about kayaking.
A Thrill Ride is being dragged around in your kayak for 40 minutes by an extremely large fish.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2014 11:40 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 12, 2005 10:46 pm
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Location: Escondido
Jcanracer wrote:
So, I have become a victim of my own hubris. It was my belief that I could sail my Revo11 without amas. For calm weather, that's actually true. For winds 15 knots and over, well... you be the judge:
You actually sailed quite well -- the only problem you had was not paying attention to the sail while you were changing direction. This would have happened with any of the kayaks.

When sailing, I always take my down wind foot off the Drive and plant it in one of the scallop grooves -- gives better leverage to lean upwind. The upwind foot is kept at the base of the pedals to keep the fins pointing straight down so they act as a daggerboard. This gives you less side slip and actually slows any changes in heeling, thus allowing a little more reaction time.

When sailing downwind I usually try to sail at least 20 degrees off straight downwind to discourage any shifting winds (especially lake winds) from giving the accidental gybe. When executing the gybe, I pull the sail in while gybing and let it out the other side. This keeps it from whipping across and flipping the boat. If it gets too windy you can always head upwind and tack to change direction. Yes, it's a little slower, but much more predictable!

The more experience you get, the easier it gets to stay upright. The Revo 11 is not an easy boat to sail in more lively winds -- I thought you did a great job. You don't need any amas! :wink:


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 7:33 am 
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Thanks Roadrunner, and great tips!
I especially like this tip:

Quote:
When sailing, I always take my down wind foot off the Drive and plant it in one of the scallop grooves -- gives better leverage to lean upwind. The upwind foot is kept at the base of the pedals to keep the fins pointing straight down so they act as a daggerboard. This gives you less side slip and actually slows any changes in heeling, thus allowing a little more reaction time.


I'm going to try that this weekend!


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 4:49 pm 
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Location: Portland, Texas
I'm with Roadrunner on that one. First, I don't use amas but I do pay serious attention to conditions when sailing. I used to sail a catboat and learned that they sailed best on a run when slightly off the wind. I do the same thing with the Oasis. Also as Road runner stated when entering a jibe (or gybe as the English spell it) I pull the sheet in to depower the sail and then slowly let it out once the stern has passed through the wind and it's coming from the other side. They have some really good small boat sailing lessons available on CD's which I found to be very helpful to my sailing. You might want to consider getting some of those to help hone your skills. Don't quit the sailing as its just too much fun.

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2010 Oasis
Lucie Belle


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 4:45 am 
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I have a question..... the line coming off the end of the sail... not sure what you call it... was it secured/knotted/tied to the eye at the back of the stern storage well?

Reason I ask is it looks like it's tied off, you're using both hands for other things... I've sailed my Revo and Outback in some pretty windy places and come close to tipping but I keep the tail of the line in my hand and just ease up on the line and dump the sail a little when it gusts... let's air spill out and I don't go over.... or haven't yet. Now... I'm NO sailor... but the guy I got the sail from said he couldn't sail his without flipping over... I like to get the Revo right up on the edge, little lean, and it'll fly... but got to be real careful how much blow it'll take.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 7:23 am 
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That line is called the sheet or mainsheet. It runs from the sail, through the rear (aft) padeye and to your hand. I never let go if it (without amas or outriggers) for the same reason as you. It must run free to release the sail instantly if there is a gust. You should tie a simple knot at the "bitter end" so it can't accidently slip out of the aft padeye if you lose it temporarily.

I use a microblock (small pulley) attached to the padeye to run the mainsheet through for less binding and faster response time. I put a second block forward on the right (starboard) inside of the cockpit to run the mainsheet through so I can pull it backwards instead of forward (personal preference).

If you have a wider, more stable boat (like a tandom) or use the Sidekick, you can get a cleat to hold the line and rest your hand. Cam cleats and jamb (clam) cleats can be released very quickly in an emergency.

Now you know all the sailing language so you can sound like an old salt. It also helps to swagger when you're near your boat! :lol:


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 8:17 am 
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Quote:
I use a microblock (small pulley) attached to the (aft) padeye to run the mainsheet through for less binding and faster response time. I put a second block forward on the right (starboard) inside of the cockpit to run the mainsheet through so I can pull it backwards instead of forward (personal preference).


^^^This is what I have, and the knot at the end of the main sheet is what I am holding on to [with my right hand] in the video to control the sail. Reviewing this video showed me that I need a longer main sheet line: since I've added that second block up front on the starboard side, my resting/comfortable posture has the sheet under tension with the end of the line slightly in front of me. With 2-3ft more line (longer line already purchased), I could lean back and keep less tension in the line or let it slip through my hand to rapidly dump the sail without completely letting go of it.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 8:26 am 
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:lol: ok... I have so much line, dam thing usually wraps all around me..., knocks my hat off.... one more question... what the hell are those little dangly things mounted on the face (front) of the sail? I know it's supposed to tell me something about the wind....

and hey, I might not be all verbally proficient on sailing lingo and old salt (fart) talk, but I never did a barrel roll in mine either LOL! :P

here I is:

Image


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 10:30 am 
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Yours is an Outback isnt it? Maybe I should try sailing the Outback, since it is wider and will probably lean less in equal wind when compared against the Revo11, no wonder you haven't flipped yet :lol:

Slightly off topic: I've been enjoying reading through older posts on the sailing section of this forum, there is so much good info out there and I have much to learn.
Cheers! :mrgreen:


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 12:09 pm 
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redsinthehead...."those little dangly things mounted on the face (front) of the sail? I know it's supposed to tell me something about the wind" are called telltales.... this video explains how to "read the message" they are showing you as the wind crosses the leading edge of the sail......https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lq1PwuKIZiE
Enjoy!

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