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PostPosted: Sat Mar 13, 2010 12:45 pm 
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Location: Boston Ma / Newport RI
Hi All,

Im looking at a 2002 Tiger for doing a few distance races this year ( New England 100 and Cuba Run) and maybe some Tiger class and/or F18 class races next year. What are typical mods for F18 racing?

What about distance races? I imagine spinnaker locks are a must as holding that thing for 8+ hours would suck hard but what else?

Thanks for the info all!

Blair

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I love these calm moments before the storm, it reminds me of Beethoven...


'02 Hobie Tiger USA 1152


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 19, 2010 9:20 pm 
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Location: eureka,california
Tow Rope, Compass , are required. I carry flares and a radio for off shore races as well as a Gps and phone in a dry bag. If you double block the spin and they both have rachets its not too bad. The Ditch took me 7 hours this year. 68 miles point to point but 119 miles sailed total distance. For distance racing I put the Furling jib on the boat incase things get way out of hand. Make sure you have good foot straps and a trained crew to get ya if you fall off, or you can get them and put the spin away alone.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 20, 2010 5:48 am 
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Location: Boston Ma / Newport RI
Thanks, sounds good. what's this rudder mod I hear about? New style? What's the benefit, besides lightening my wallet?

Another thing, the Tiger I just bought has a hard plastic snuffer, should that be replaced with the soft one? Less weight I'd imagine.


Thanks for the info

Blair

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Blair T

I love these calm moments before the storm, it reminds me of Beethoven...


'02 Hobie Tiger USA 1152


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 20, 2010 9:19 am 
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Location: eureka,california
The new rudders are a different shape. They require new Gudgeons, and get the front of the rudder under the hull. They make for a smoother more responsive steering. Your out about $650 (est) and can be done in a day. If you need pics or help on the upgrade I am documenting my upgrade and will post pics of each step.

As far as the snuffer I use the SNU made by Barefoot Studios. He's in So Cal and his design is one of the nicest I have seen, or used. Btw the new design he just came out with is killer. I just got my new one and can't wait to throw the chute.
http://www.gobarefootstudio.com/store.html

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Rich Vilvens
F-18 5150
R.Vilvens@yahoo.com
http://www.sailblogs.com/member/f-185150sailing/


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 20, 2010 6:21 pm 
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Location: Northfield Minnesota
hobie18rich wrote:
Btw the new design he just came out with is killer.



The new mesh bottom is sweet! I put one on the Viper.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 26, 2010 4:41 am 
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Location: Washington, DC
Karl Brogger wrote:
The new mesh bottom is sweet! I put one on the Viper.


Karl: So did you finally sell the FX-one? Or did you get the Viper even without selling the FX?

Would love to hear how the FX-one and AHPC Viper (F16) compare! The Viper seems like a good upgrade for those who want to sail a boat that can go one-up or two-up, but want a more active racing circuit than the FX-one can offer.

And, of course, like we've said many times before, I wish that Hobie (presumably HCE) would come up with their own F16 design! Then we wouldn't have to go to the competition to compete. :P

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Sailing vintage Hobie Cats in West Africa.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 27, 2010 1:14 pm 
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Africat wrote:
Karl: So did you finally sell the FX-one? Or did you get the Viper even without selling the FX?

Haven't sold it yet, kinda of tough time of year to be trying to sell a boat. There's still ice on the lakes around here!

Africat wrote:
Would love to hear how the FX-one and AHPC Viper (F16) compare! The Viper seems like a good upgrade for those who want to sail a boat that can go one-up or two-up, but want a more active racing circuit than the FX-one can offer.

I can't really do a fair comparison, I haven't sailed the Viper singlehanded yet. There's definetly some things in the rigging that are way ahead of the FXone, but most of them could be done to the FXone as well.
-Diamond wire tension is adjustable by a big bolt head on the bottom of the mast. On the water changes are pretty simple.
-Most of the downhaul is under the tramp, as is the jib sheets, and the leach tension for the jib.
-I'll be setting it up with a seperate tack/halyard line for the spinnaker.
-Internal tack line in the spin pole
-Pull up lines on the daggerboards

The Viper is not nearly as sexy as the FXone in my opinion. Its also a bit more numb to drive, the FXone is kind of a tricky bastard to sail well, and it lets you know right away when you're doing something wrong. Viper isn't much lighter either, about 25lbs. The bow's are massive on the Viper, it can be driven really hard. The FXone needs to have the boards pulled up pretty early when it starts to blow.

Africat wrote:
And, of course, like we've said many times before, I wish that Hobie (presumably HCE) would come up with their own F16 design! Then we wouldn't have to go to the competition to compete. :P


No doubt.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 31, 2010 7:44 pm 
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Location: League City, Texas, USA
Quote:
What about distance races? I imagine spinnaker locks are a must as holding that thing for 8+ hours would suck hard but what else?

Thanks for the info all!

Blair

Locking off the spinnaker is dog slow in any situation - the crew has to play the kite to be quick. If reaching double trapped those sheet loads are stout and after a couple of hours the crew will tend to stop sheeting in and out as much as they should for top performance. This is where the doubler pays dividends - it halves the sheet load for the crew.

Spinnaker sheet doubler system. Attach a pair of blocks to the clew of the spinnaker. Each spin sheet runs through a block and has a figure 8 knot at the end. For 1:1 operation this knot just rides against that block. For 2:1 operation you pull the knot back to a hook or loop secured to a the base of your outside rachet block on the hull. You may need a slightly longer spin sheet - it depends how short your current one is cut.

Other distance racing mods: You can add a chicken line system to prevent falling forward (and getting hurt or flipping) when you stuff a hull in hard. There are a couple of ways of doing this:

1) Run a line along the edge of the hull - secure to the transom and the front cross beam. 3/16" is adequate. Fasten a loop of line to this line using a prusik knot or equivalent. Put a carabiner or quick release on the other end and fasten it to the trap hook when you are out on the wire. The prussik lets you tension up the system and adjust it for moving your weight fore and aft.

2) Install sail maker cleats on your harness cross bar (the kind you get on a jib. They come in a port and starboard model and you need one of each for either side of your hook. Then run a chicken line from the transom and suck the excess into the rear cross beam (3/16" works well) . When you are on the wire you reach down and grab this line and pull it up and into the harness cleat (the side towards the back of the boat).

Alternative to chicken line: A good footstrap. Dakine (Magic Marine coming soon to the US are good as well). Avoid the 'breakaway design' - they let loose to early to do any good even on the highest setting.

Other mods:

Adjustable trap setup. You probably have to shorten the wires if you have stock ones - not a big deal at your local rigging shop. This lets you get up out of the big stuff, and in marginal trap conditions you reduce righting moment in a high position.

Rotator arm moved from the boom to the base of the mast - using a bolt through the 3 pulleys to secure it. Rig a system that permits adjustment from out on the wire. Rotate back and pull down haul to depower (even with the kite - that Tiger mast is much stronger than the wing masts and is a real weapon when distance racing).

Remember depowering moves for example, jib traveller car dumped, boards lifted a bit. They all add up in hanging higher and harder than the next team when reaching with or without the kite.

Chris Green
Over 2000 miles distance racing experience on the Tiger.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2010 3:58 am 
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Location: Washington, DC
Karl Brogger wrote:
Haven't sold [the FX-one] yet, kinda of tough time of year to be trying to sell a boat. There's still ice on the lakes around here!


I looked at an FX on Cape May in New Jersey last Spring. But it didn't come with the kite or a trailer. Then I decided not to buy my own boat, because we were moving to Africa, and the mast wouldn't fit in our container-shipping allowance. This was the right call. Still wish I were in the States to make your FX-one an option.

Karl Brogger wrote:
I can't really do a fair comparison, I haven't sailed the Viper singlehanded yet. There's definetly some things in the rigging that are way ahead of the FXone, but most of them could be done to the FXone as well.
-Diamond wire tension is adjustable by a big bolt head on the bottom of the mast. On the water changes are pretty simple.
-Most of the downhaul is under the tramp, as is the jib sheets, and the leach tension for the jib.
-I'll be setting it up with a seperate tack/halyard line for the spinnaker.
-Internal tack line in the spin pole
-Pull up lines on the daggerboards

The Viper is not nearly as sexy as the FXone in my opinion. Its also a bit more numb to drive, the FXone is kind of a tricky bastard to sail well, and it lets you know right away when you're doing something wrong. Viper isn't much lighter either, about 25lbs. The bow's are massive on the Viper, it can be driven really hard. The FXone needs to have the boards pulled up pretty early when it starts to blow.


Thanks for the detailed points, Karl! This is very helpful. Look forward to updates once you've spent more time on the Water with the Viper -- one-up or double handed!

Much of my choice in 2012 will depend on whether I decide that active racing is essential (that would mean Viper, or the immortal Hobie 16), or a secondary consideration to the relaxation and social aspects of sailing (that would mean the FX-one).

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-Roland
Sailing vintage Hobie Cats in West Africa.


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