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PostPosted: Wed Feb 26, 2014 11:31 am 
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Joined: Thu May 30, 2013 5:31 pm
Posts: 27
Last summer I bought an Oasis, AMA and sail kit. I thought I had done my due diligence, but if I am being honest I am pretty disappointed as I find the Sail Kit to be little more than a toy that will achieve a fast drift at best. Stand alone Kayak - Love it. Sailing Vessel -fail.

Without questions I probably should have sported for the Tandem AI.

But before I do, I would like some feed back from owners if you don't mind.

1.What do you absolutely love about it?

2.What do you dislike about it?

3. What kind of water do you mostly use yours in? (salt, fresh, warm, cold?)

4. What would you change?


Thank you.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 26, 2014 12:19 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2005 6:29 pm
Posts: 1991
Location: High Point, NC
To be fair, the optional sailing kit for the Hobie kayaks isn't intended to turn the boats into full-on sailboats. And the Oasis, being larger and heavier, won't become one for sure. However, they do pretty well considering you're talking about a mere 20 square feet of sail.

More direct to your questions:

1. With any moderate wind, it's fast. This gives me more speed and range for reaching more distant fishing spots. Not to mention the boat is responsive and fun to sail. It has a huge tankwell and generous interior storage. It'll carry more than my ProAngler, although the cockpit isn't as generous. It's also very quick to set up considering how well it sails. If I'm being efficient, I can set up, unload and be underway in less than 15 minutes, easy.

2. Sitting in a puddle of water, although I've fixed that on mine with a slightly raised seat bottom.

3. Freshwater.

4. Not much. A little higher seat tub would be about it. And that shouldn't be a deal breaker either way.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 26, 2014 1:06 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2012 8:24 pm
Posts: 96
Location: Houston, TX
1. The versatility to pick up and sail anywhere my car can drive. The quick setups and cleanups. The Hobie backing of this product.

2. I would like more comfortable seating without having to modify. I would like the tramps to support my 230# (they don't- butt sags in the water when sitting on) or have available Hobie lightweight hakas.

3. Mostly saltwater and offshore

4. Near perfect boat for me. I love the fact that it is easy to modify to my own needs. Would like a Hobie jib for both AI and TIs though.

vetgam


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 26, 2014 4:04 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2011 1:58 am
Posts: 1440
Location: Forster, NSW, Australia
1.What do you absolutely love about it?
Talking TI here: The total versatility, usable in almost any weather, plenty of storage space above and below for expedition trips, exhilarating ride (wet fun!), very low running costs, virtually unsinkable (3 hulls, each ama supports 220#), furling sail allows for big wind capabilities, shallow draft capability, second seat perfect for friends, great fishing/diving platform, cover great distances, terrific exercise when pedaling. The TI seat is a good inch higher than on the AI, which makes for better seat drainage, but just as importantly, makes the Miragedrive retsining levers harder to accidentally open with your heels.

2.What do you dislike about it?
Would like heavier duty tramps, or even better, Hobie rotormolded hakas (not really a dislike though eh?)

3. What kind of water do you mostly use yours in? (salt, fresh, warm, cold?)
Mostly salt lake, but 20% offshore

4. What would you change?
Add one-way venturi valves to seat scuppers, slightly more robust paddle (maybe Hobie option), add masthead wind indicator, make Lowrance ready (inset transducer mounting like on newer single hull Hobies), slightly improved front hatch seal, not really much needs improving really.

Bottom line... go for it, you won't regret a moment!

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Tony Stott
2012 Tandem Island "SIC EM"
www.scenefromabove.com.au


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 26, 2014 7:04 pm 
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Joined: Sat Mar 12, 2011 12:55 pm
Posts: 2
1.Love the versatility and the distances you can cover easily, sailing it is a buzz and even more so when speeding past a group of other kayaks all pumping away - usually followed by "your a cheat", my response is usually yes and proud of it !

2. Initially hated the size and weight compared to my Oasis but have now adapted trailer and launch sites to suit but you can still break it down to a kayak and launch from the same sites as the Oasis. Also when the wind is not favourable and tacking options limited it is a beast to peddle and requires far more effort, this can be reduced by taking down the sail, this can be done on the water but is a very tricky and you need to be prepared to fall off and get wet.

3. Mainly the ocean and salt water creeks but occasional fresh water lakes.

4. I would change the seat to the newer PA style, you get a much wetter butt in a TI than an Oasis and as mentioned by others the tramps are for kids only, something stronger or rigid would make them far more useful. The cart is an issue if you can not launch from a trailer but there is plenty of options on this forum that can help with this.

Thank you.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 27, 2014 3:16 am 
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Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2011 11:26 pm
Posts: 55
Had an oasis with sail kit first and really liked it. In fact was surprised how well this little sail did and in light wind was actually able to sail upwind.

Got my TI one year later, fell in love with it the first minute under sail and NEVER used the Oasis again.

Comparing the TI with an Oasis is like comparing a kid's bike with stabilizers to a BMW sports motorbike - a totally different league.

Go for the TI - you will not regret it. Guaranteed.

peace
Serbi


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 27, 2014 11:46 am 
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Joined: Thu May 30, 2013 5:31 pm
Posts: 27
serbi wrote:
Had an oasis with sail kit first and really liked it. In fact was surprised how well this little sail did and in light wind was actually able to sail upwind.

Got my TI one year later, fell in love with it the first minute under sail and NEVER used the Oasis again.

Comparing the TI with an Oasis is like comparing a kid's bike with stabilizers to a BMW sports motorbike - a totally different league.

Go for the TI - you will not regret it. Guaranteed.

peace
Serbi



Thanks Serbi, I do love BMW bikes too!


At 18'6 do you guys find this to be difficult to store?


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 27, 2014 3:04 pm 
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Joined: Mon May 31, 2010 4:13 pm
Posts: 198
Location: oki - jp
1.What do you absolutely love about it?

I love how it can go in very shallow water, is so quiet, very peaceful & relaxing (when not in high wind and seas), can easily be used as a swimming and snorkeling platform.

2.What do you dislike about it?

That it cannot sail into the wind at all, it really needs a jib kit (cough HOBIE!!!). when in deep water i wish the sides were a bit taller and could offer me a little more sense of security. i will not sit on the tramps with my ass an inch off the water when past the reef here, but i've taken many guests out and i don't think any of them have ever thought about it to tell you the truth.

3. What kind of water do you mostly use yours in? (salt, fresh, warm, cold?)

i live next to the ocean so i use mine in the ocean primarily. the water here is pretty much warm (not cold) year round, but if the air temp is below 68 F i usually don't take it out since i've gotten acclimated :D

4. What would you change?

I wish it were a little faster at times in low winds and a little more secure feeling when actually going near top speeds for the TI. I wish i could safely and comfortably fit a 4th person :D i can fit me and 3 japanese people when in kayak only mode (with tramps out) just fine, but full size americans can be an issue...


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 27, 2014 3:57 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2005 6:29 pm
Posts: 1991
Location: High Point, NC
Something is wrong here - the AI and TI sail into the wind like gangbusters! The drive unit negates much of what the jib would provide when tacking so it's not as much of an omission as you might think.

I hear this comment occasionally and don't understand why anyone can't sail their Island kayaks into the wind. Of course, no sailboat is going to sail much closer than about 45 degrees into the wind, but the Islands will do that easily, and with a little pedal input they'll even do a bit better than that.

If they come up short on any point of sail, it's downwind (no boom), not upwind. And even then I just stay off the wind a bit instead of attemping DDW and all is well.

The following video is just two minutes long. Nothing you see here is beyond a close reach. Several shots are the boat close hauled. Note the angle of the sail. At the end you'll see us tack and note how quickly we take off again after the bow comes through the wind. These boats sail to windward exceptionally well. I just don't get the idea that they somehow lack the ability to sail into the wind.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sybw680_RKE


Last edited by Tom Kirkman on Fri Feb 28, 2014 5:17 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 27, 2014 11:22 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2011 1:58 am
Posts: 1440
Location: Forster, NSW, Australia
Rusty, you have to be doing something wrong, because Islands CAN go to windward as Tom says. Not as close-winded as sailboats with jibs, but they do OK. Here is a plot of a day's sail, and while there has been some tidal assistance, you can clearly see the tacks making progress upwind.
Image[/URL]

_________________
Tony Stott
2012 Tandem Island "SIC EM"
www.scenefromabove.com.au


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 28, 2014 4:35 pm 
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Joined: Mon May 31, 2010 4:13 pm
Posts: 198
Location: oki - jp
I love the TI, don't get me wrong. i would also comment that it is super easy sailing fun for any sailing skill level, and near impossible to make a mistake. by this i mean there is not much to get wrong when sailing, just watch the sail and speed/angle etc...

i just woke up so bear with me as my thoughts are coming out of my brain all jumbled up. i just think those last few degrees of sailing into the wind are crucial to making significant progress. i actually think it sails downwind fairly good as i will let additional sail out and hold it out by pushing the back ropes as far to the side as my arm will reach.

i just wish it could sail a few degrees closer to the wind if headed into the wind. yes i know i can paddle and this really helps out too, especially when tacking as not to loose any speed, this is actually another one of my favorite things about the AI/TI that i forgot to mention.

i think we could all (most of us) agree that with a jib we 'should' be able to get a little more upwind sailing capability, but for a 'kayak' it is great!!

***i'm not a sailing geek by a long shot but i have sailed many different sized sailboats... i never understood all the lingo and a lot of the technical stuff on some of the more complex systems on racing type boats but i think for the most part sailing is pretty easily understood, as long as you pay attention to the small/big changes after changing something on the sail***


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 28, 2014 4:46 pm 
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Location: High Point, NC
For me, do all you can and downwind is still easily the slowest point of sail for the Island boats. They rip on a reach or close haul however. I've never had any trouble making progress to windward. I remain perplexed as the Island will sail as close to the wind as nearly other sailboat. It certainly sails closer to the wind than a Windrider, and the Windrider has a jib.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 28, 2014 11:29 pm 
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Location: Forster, NSW, Australia
I think one important thing to do is be prepared to furl early. Windward progress is best with the "sweet spot" where drive exceeds drag the most. I often find my speed the same as similar TIs while I have a roll or two wrapped round the mast, and the leeward ama sitting up a bit higher.

Downwind, apart from holding the clew out with my notched paddle, the TI will always be limited in forward speed apart from momentary surges dowm the face of swell.

Personaslly, I don't crave the addition of a jib, as I love the simplicity!

_________________
Tony Stott
2012 Tandem Island "SIC EM"
www.scenefromabove.com.au


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2014 9:30 pm 
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Joined: Fri Dec 20, 2013 4:44 pm
Posts: 20
Location: Kailua-Kona Hawaii
What I love about it:

1. Other than the fuel for the tow vehicle it costs nothing to use after the initial purchase! For me that is $5.00 in diesel. I sold my 20' center console because I could only afford to take it out a few times a month. Now I can go as often as I like...mostly 2-3 times a week.
2. It is way too much fun.......easy to sail, easy to set up and maintain and easy to modify if you so choose. I just sailed with 4 people for the first time yesterday and other than being a little lower in the water there was a nice 10kt wind and we still did 4-6kts.

Dislikes:

1. The trampolines. That is why I built full haka platforms also you will see the simple quarter deck that lets you get out of the seat and hike out a bit. My newest version of the quarter deck is aluminum.
Image
A full useable surface. a little extra weight but to me well worth it.

Really that is the only dislike for me.

I feel that they sail fine into the wind and other points of wind except as noted here the down wind performance but it is easily dealt with and not that much of a liability. I have added a jib to mine and enjoy the advantages it offers.
Image

I spend all my time in the pacific ocean here, 88 degree water makes all the difference. I grew up on the west coast and know cold water. I appreciate everyday here.

I can't think of anything to change. I would like more cockpit room but the kayak design is limited as to what you can do and I can now lash things down to the hard hakas.

The bottom line is that you will not be sorry that you purchased one.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2014 2:45 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2007 6:14 pm
Posts: 1856
Location: South Florida
If you plan to camp regularly using a TI (or AI), you need to think carefully about your decision. There are several TIs with male/male or mixed crews still in the WaterTribe Everglades Challenge (8-day, 300 mile adventure race) after a couple days, but BackwaterBob is the only remaining solo-crew TI. BWB is a big guy. In contrast, most AIs are still in the race.

If the TI is to be used mainly for day sailing and with family, go for it.

Keith

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I sail: Biscayne Bay, Everglades to Cape Romano, Ft Desoto, Cedar Key

"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex ... It takes a touch of genius and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction." A. Einstein


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