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Early model Torqueedo Ultralight or Evolve?
http://www.hobie.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=71&t=19833		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  skymax [ Tue Jan 19, 2010 10:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Early model Torqueedo Ultralight or Evolve?
Waiting, waiting, waiting for my Hobie guy to get delivery of the Evolve but no news of delivery date yet.
Meanwhile watching videos of AI Captains using the earlier Torqueedo Ultralight mounted on the Ball fitment on the side just behind the Bridge who seem quite happy with it, hmmmm..

I operate in a lot of shallow estuaries, the Evolve is an expensive thing to hit the bottom with when its mounted in the Well, yet I cant mount it on the rudder because I sail a lot, the Ball Side-mount, (as seen in so many Youtube videos), allows you to keep your Sailing rudder and Mirage drive in place AND kicks up when a bottom-strike occurs.
http://www.torqeedo.com/en/hn/products/ ... ption.html

The Ultralight model, (same thing I believe just different mounting system), is about $AUD150 less expensive than the Evolve here, so why am I waiting for a less-configuration-versatile, more expensive Evolve model?

Must be something I don't know yet...
Author:  kayakingglenn [ Wed Jan 20, 2010 5:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Early model Torqueedo Ultralight or Evolve?
I agree with you. I think the ultralight is the solution that I have been looking for. With a ball mount, I can still sail and use the mirage drive. The electric power just be a backup when I need it. :D
Author:  mmiller [ Wed Jan 20, 2010 5:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Early model Torqueedo Ultralight or Evolve?
There is no doubt that a different mount for the motor would be great on the Islands. We are on that, but have nothing for the near future. The thing about the Torqeedo solution / ball mount and shaft is a bit "Frankenstein". We want something cleaner / lighter / more integrated.
Author:  skymax [ Wed Jan 20, 2010 9:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Early model Torqueedo Ultralight or Evolve?
mmiller wrote:
There is no doubt that a different mount for the motor would be great on the Islands. We are on that, but have nothing for the near future. The thing about the Torqeedo solution / ball mount and shaft is a bit "Frankenstein". We want something cleaner / lighter / more integrated.


Thanks Matt, I hear what you are saying.
Don't get me wrong, the Evolve is a wonderfully designed peice of kit, it's just my particular "AI in shallow water without Rudder mount", situation that I am trying to plan for, and possibly being able to transfer easily to one of my non-Hobie boats by buying an extra ball mount.
One Hobie dealer said the Ultralight model can be connected to the rear AMA crossbar easily but this is still hearsay.

But Two questions please: Is the Torq Ultralight model the same Motor/Battery/Prop as the new Evolve?
Would an Adventure go a bit quicker than a Revo with the Evolve because it is longer?
Author:  skymax [ Wed Jan 20, 2010 9:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Early model Torqueedo Ultralight or Evolve?
kayakingglenn wrote:
I agree with you. I think the ultralight is the solution that I have been looking for. With a ball mount, I can still sail and use the mirage drive. The electric power just be a backup when I need it. :D


Yerr, I guess the down-tube on the Ultralight model has a tad more drag than the skinny aqua-dynamic Evolve but at these speeds maybe not a real factor.
Author:  skymax [ Wed Jan 20, 2010 9:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Early model Torqueedo Ultralight or Evolve?
kayakingglenn wrote:
I agree with you. I think the ultralight is the solution that I have been looking for. With a ball mount, I can still sail and use the mirage drive. The electric power just be a backup when I need it. :D


Image

Ja, I guess the Downtube on the Ultralight has a tad more drag than the Faired Evolve mount but they still seem to motor pretty fast in Adventure mode.
Author:  skymax [ Wed Jan 20, 2010 10:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Early model Torqueedo Ultralight or Evolve?
AI's with Ultralight Torqeedo drives mounted behind the rear Well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mhdbPZC2wAc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3MR-RfD1h94

The wind is so light the water is glossy, one AI has folded sail plus a passenger and still seems to be moving at an acceptable cruise speed.

As MM says it works but looks a bit bolt-on, I can handle that, I just need to find out a bit more about whether it has many Neg factors..
Author:  mmiller [ Thu Jan 21, 2010 9:40 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Early model Torqueedo Ultralight or Evolve?
The Evolve prop is a little different to fit into the drive well. Top speeds seem very comparable, but less wattage used for a longer sleek hull I believe.
Author:  timo [ Thu Jan 21, 2010 3:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Early model Torqueedo Ultralight or Evolve?
I've also been struggling with the question of which way to go. It seems to me (1) that the evolve is married to the AI whereas the torquedo is not -- the evolve is not transferable to other boats. Most of us have other boats or dream of having them. I have several other kayaks. (2) the evolve won't kick up on grounding in shallow water whereas the torquedo might, (3) for those of us sailing our AIs, the evolve eliminates the possibility of using the mirage drive whereas the torquedo doesn't.

Still if the equation weren't so much against the evolve, I would prefer to buy it because I would like to have the possibility of dropping the motor into the well. Plus, I would like to support Hobie. It seems to me the solution for Hobie in the short term is to supply a third mounting option -- the ball socket thing that torquedo provides. If Hobie provided that too, the purchase from Hobie would be the obvious, unconflicted choice. If Hobie doesn't provide it by late spring (US), I expect I'll buy the torquedo as it is a safer, more versatile investment that, unsightly or not (and surely no more unsightly than outboards on other sailboats), makes more sense in the context of AI sailing. Of course the expense of this system is in no sense trivial, which makes this problem more likely to be resolved in favor of the more flexible and easily resold torquedo.
Author:  mmiller [ Thu Jan 21, 2010 3:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Early model Torqueedo Ultralight or Evolve?
FYI...

The Evolve does "Kick up" when using the rudder mounted version and the Drive Well version has an impact absorbing fiberglass rod as the mount shaft.
Author:  ChaosDave [ Sat Jan 30, 2010 7:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Early model Torqueedo Ultralight or Evolve?
ultralight > evolve
Author:  skymax [ Sat Jan 30, 2010 3:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Early model Torqueedo Ultralight or Evolve?
timo wrote:
I've also been struggling with the question of which way to go. It seems to me (1) that the evolve is married to the AI whereas the torquedo is not -- the evolve is not transferable to other boats. Most of us have other boats or dream of having them. I have several other kayaks. (2) the evolve won't kick up on grounding in shallow water whereas the torquedo might, (3) for those of us sailing our AIs, the evolve eliminates the possibility of using the mirage drive whereas the torquedo doesn't.

Still if the equation weren't so much against the evolve, I would prefer to buy it because I would like to have the possibility of dropping the motor into the well. Plus, I would like to support Hobie. It seems to me the solution for Hobie in the short term is to supply a third mounting option -- the ball socket thing that torquedo provides. If Hobie provided that too, the purchase from Hobie would be the obvious, unconflicted choice. If Hobie doesn't provide it by late spring (US), I expect I'll buy the torquedo as it is a safer, more versatile investment that, unsightly or not (and surely no more unsightly than outboards on other sailboats), makes more sense in the context of AI sailing. Of course the expense of this system is in no sense trivial, which makes this problem more likely to be resolved in favor of the more flexible and easily resold torquedo.


I have Two Hobie's (plus others i could use the Ultralight 402 on), half the time I spend in shallow estuaries, although the eVolve has a protector fin i would still hate to bang that pricey item against a rock with 150 Kilos of boat and occupant behind it, it sure bends SS masts easily, so tilt-up sounds sensible.
I dont worry about tidy appearance since one look at my boat's occupant would dispell that notion instantly.

Now hesitatingly my suspicious side wonders if the original Torqeedo Ultralight 402 Prop which presumably was designed to have the most efficient size & shape for its motor is now less than it was having been modified, (cut down?), on the eVolve to fit through the drive well?

Lastly, I see some A's & AI's with the Torqeedo Ultralight 402 model mounted just behind the rear AKA and some mounted near the rudder mount but to the side so the Rudder tilt-up is not affected.
If any one knows the Pro's and Con's of Torqeedo Ultralight positions i would be glad to hear them.

PS: On one of the Torqeedo Ultralight 402 websites they mention the Torqeedo Ultralight 405, "...for longer journeys and more power!", but I have not seen any more info on this model.
Author:  oasisman [ Thu Sep 27, 2012 2:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Early model Torqueedo Ultralight or Evolve?
mmiller wrote:
There is no doubt that a different mount for the motor would be great on the Islands. We are on that, but have nothing for the near future. The thing about the Torqeedo solution / ball mount and shaft is a bit "Frankenstein". We want something cleaner / lighter / more integrated.


2013 is near and no new evolve with a better mounting system is projected.
Hobie fishers and Island sailors Know evolve is nice but it has no versatility and it has not real functionality. It is a nice toy.

Torqeedo Ultralight mounting system is ugly and "Frankenstein": however, it is functional and it has real versatility for fishing and for sailing hobie kayaks. I don't like very strong noise running of ultralight and evolve. Uhmmmmmm is not a sweet music: it is noise, strong noise.

If I'd buy one of them, I buy Torqeedo Ultralight.

I hope Hobiecat projects a new and innovative mounting system for evolve motor and it helps Torqeedo to project a less noisy motor, with folding propeller too. This should be the future!
Thanks
Author:  fishman-rd [ Thu Dec 05, 2013 5:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Early model Torqueedo Ultralight or Evolve?
Hi Hobie... any update you can share on an improved Torqueedo mount for the AI?
Author:  Tom Kirkman [ Thu Dec 05, 2013 6:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Early model Torqueedo Ultralight or Evolve?
You could easily substitute the Evolve for the Sevylor shown here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-xa-XJ5G9vU
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