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PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2010 11:10 am 
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Joined: Wed Sep 02, 2009 3:54 pm
Posts: 125
Location: Canyon Lake, Tx
I love my wave piercing diving AI!!! It's a blast to sail...that's why I bought it...relax and go sailing...you'll feel better... :D

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"Anything's gonna happen,
it's gonna happen out there"


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2010 11:36 am 
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Location: Oceanside, California
Polecat...

Quote:
stung by the tone and attitude expressed in your terse, dismissive response


I'm rather surprised by your interpretation of my response, but when so focused on your desire to push your agenda... I can understand. You can pass along any concerns you have via "info@hobiecat.com".

Being demanding from the get-go is my problem with your posts here. We do respond to customers ideas and that has been proven time and again, but I am being quite realistic about the AI design. Its a GREAT boat.

again...

Will we consider an accessory bow plane? Yes.

Will we redesign the bow of this hull? Not likely.

and...

Will we possibly come out with another AI type single with different hull shape? Maybe someday. I have personally pushed this idea.

I love the Island concept and agree it has huge potential for change and improvements.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2010 11:37 am 
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Joined: Sun Jul 08, 2007 6:39 pm
Posts: 101
Location: Venice, Florida
Hey Thanks Ron!

I feel better already. It's a great boat...but new amas could make it eeeeevennnn better. I see you live on a lake. Maybe your conditions don't warrant any change, but sailing in offshore winds with a substantial following sea can make you very uneasy. Hey, maybe some of us are asking more of the boat than what it is currently built to handle...that's why we have this forum to ask these kind of questions. Appreciate your thought though. I'm going to go lighten up and go work on my boats now. Have a great day Ron!

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SW Gulf Coast: Sarasota to Keys

I'm not completely useless. I can always serve as a bad example.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2010 12:18 pm 
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Joined: Sun Sep 13, 2009 6:35 pm
Posts: 152
Location: Pensacola Florida
PoleCat,
Way,,,, Way, out of line. If ,,,,,you ever even got in the Mess??? we would have thrown you out for this type of action. Get a grip pal! No reply needed, (Navy Khaki)

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2010 1:17 pm 
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Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2007 7:04 am
Posts: 853
Location: Clinton Lake Kansas
Seems like a bit more buoyancy to the whole platform could help the "problem", agreed?

How about Tandem Island amas on the AI?

Wouldn't this also help the tendency for the amas to bury when driving upwind?

sorry for regurgitating polecats post, I've only sailed the AI once in 12 knots and smooth water, but quickly "tired" of the ama dive

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2010 1:42 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2007 6:14 pm
Posts: 1856
Location: South Florida
Quote:
Matt wrote:

Will we consider an accessory bow plane? Yes.

Will we redesign the bow of this hull? Not likely.

and...

Will we possibly come out with another AI type single with different hull shape? Maybe someday. I have personally pushed this idea.

I love the Island concept and agree it has huge potential for change and improvements.


That's great, Matt. Thanks.

Keith

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:11 am 
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Joined: Sun Aug 28, 2005 8:13 am
Posts: 136
Red ink........ really?

Matt Miller dismissive.......... really?

Going "up the food chain"........ really?

Great communication skills.

You should be embarrassed.

I hope I speak for many when I say your comments are over the top.

If there is a more responsive, more attentive company or company representative out there, I have not found them.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 06, 2010 12:33 pm 
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Joined: Fri Dec 05, 2008 2:32 am
Posts: 1773
Location: Calga NSW, Australia
drgatsea wrote:
If there is a more responsive, more attentive company or company representative out there, I have not found them.
Hear! Hear!

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 06, 2010 8:22 pm 
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Joined: Mon Nov 24, 2008 7:38 pm
Posts: 9
Location: Deltona, Florida
A great company that addresses their customers needs. The hostility is uncalled for! Keep up the great work Hobie and thank you Matt for your faithfulness in tending to Hobie's business online.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 06, 2010 8:49 pm 
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Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2007 9:57 am
Posts: 222
Location: Phuket, Thailand
...A forum that regulates itself, congratulations to all of you...now if we can just promulgate this to the rest of humanity.......

Yes, I have ended up with my ass over the rear hatch too but you have a hybrid boat (a swiss army knife of a craft as someone on this forum once called the AI) theres always going to be compromise if your going to be all things to all to all people.

No worries bringing the risk of pitchpoling to the attention of those who may not be aware of it and there are, as Matt pointed out, ways of dealing with it....though I do beg to differ on the subject of it being possible to flip ANY Hobie...tried real hard with my 18 but never DID get around to going over the falls even with two of us describing huge parabolic sweeps around the mast in our traps. maybe we just werent TRYING hard enough!

Theres no craft that I know of that excites my imagination as much as the AI because in theory, at least, you could take it anywhere...something you couldnt really do on a recreational/racing cat.

Next week I load up my AI (in adventure mode only) onto a yacht (something I could never do with my 18!) and we go NE to some remote islands 400 miles offshore..for a spot of monster pelargic fishing (WE HOPE!!!) and now i am thinking to myself..SHOOT...the weak link in the chain is ME, already have the yacht going out there...younger/braver/sillier might just say go across in full AI mode...probably safer than the motorbike ride from launch site to my room!!!!

This is or these ARE the options you have with a craft like this, if the downside is RISK of a pitchpole but you know or have been told how to avoid it, small price to pay.

By the way, Polecat, IMHO those that talk of THO's or preface any statements with it are not usually so...and that (IMHO) may well go for me too. :oops:


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 06, 2010 8:55 pm 
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Location: Phuket, Thailand
Philip1el wrote:
...Next week I load up my AI go NE to some remote islands 400 miles offshore..
:


Whoops...lucky I'm not sailing out there in my AI....NW!


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 06, 2010 9:14 pm 
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Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2009 5:57 am
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Location: Perth, Australia
mmiller wrote:
Example of a similar issue: The Hobie 16 is the number one selling cat in the World. It is known for small bows and the potential for a pitch pole (bow stuff and capsize). Is it a defect? No... You learn to sail within the design and conditions... its the most popular catamaran in the world still. You can pitchpole any size cat with any size hulls and bows by pushing hard enough.


I hope that isn't really Hobie's attitude, basically if something is selling well then it doesn't need improvement. As we have seen time and again this works for big companies for a while but eventually people will stop supporting. Look at Microsoft and Internet Explorer for example. For years Microsoft refused to listen to users and despite being software that comes with all windows computers we are now seeing a number of other browsers that are rapidly taking over the market. Firefox, Opera, Chrome...etc

Please Matt push for wave deflectors and a new ama design and or ama deflectors as well.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:50 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 12, 2005 10:46 pm
Posts: 2388
Location: Escondido
ChaosDave wrote:
I hope that isn't really Hobie's attitude, basically if something is selling well then it doesn't need improvement.
Surely you're joking! There isn't another company that improves their products like Hobie does. The AI alone has modifications on several of its systems to improve comfort, reliability and performance. Whenever possible they also take pains to insure that these are backwards compatible so the older model owners are not left out or their boats obsolete.

If you look beyond the AI, you'll see this is a company hallmark. Look at the Mirage Drive for example -- a solid record of continual improvements. If you look at the Hobie's other models, you'll find cockpit upgrades, hull upgrades, rudder system improvements right down to the hatches and seats.

There are a lot of considerations in determining if and when it may be reasonable to produce a new item. Some examples -- company resources and priorities, costs of engineering and tooling, existing patents and other proprietary considerations, in some cases class limitations (sailboats especially).

When similar products are readily available (for instance, wave deflectors and Bob's spray shields) why would Hobie commit its resources to jump into those markets?

As we've all seen, the upcoming Tandem Island shows improved versions of several AI systems. I suspect many of these will come back to the AI ultimately as well, just as the Click N Go concept was proven with the inflatables and subsequently migrated into the entire Hobie line of Mirage kayaks.

I imagine Hobie has a "dream sheet" of projects it would like to get involved with when time and resources permit. No doubt, many of these ideas have come from the talented group of users on this forum. In fact, some are already sitting on your AI!

In the meantime, if you want a spray shield, call reconlon -- his wife's price and quality can't be beat -- or make it yourself from his well researched free plans!. If you want a wave deflector, just order it. Better yet, design one yourself and sell it! 8)


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 06, 2010 11:19 pm 
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Location: Perth, Australia
yeh Roadrunner i see what you mean that hobie has not sat back on its laurals in the past with its yaks so i really hope they try and hit this one on the head. In terms of other product already being available, the vast majority of AI users would not be on this forum and would not know about any other options. The wave deflectors that i have seen have all been made for specific hulls by spirit and Finn and while you can adapt them with foam and things i would much prefer getting a proper fit. I'm halfway through a degree in engineering so when i'm finished if hobie has done nothing i may just start making my own!

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 07, 2010 3:17 am 
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Location: South Florida
Philip -- go for it. Remember, no pics, it didn't happen!

Dave -- I'm with you. Get that degree done and start building useful after-market items for the AI.

RR -- You are absolutely right. I have a 2007 and a 2009, lots of nice little improvements in the '09 vs '07, but they have not made the jump to a proper hull/amas for a true sailing AI. Hopefully for future consumers they will, because it ought to be an awsome boat.

Keith

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