Hobie Cat Forums

Hi guys,

I guess this is just wishful thinking from me, but I think it'd be great if Hobie could bring out a new "Island" model about 2/3 to 3/4 size on an A.I. with a proper AKAS/AMAS and sail system.

Something between 3m and 4m in length, with 2m AMAS. I guess a scaled-down A.I. hull would be ideal...

My biggest issue with the A.I. is the size and weight. I know it's possible to car-top it, but it can be tricky and a trailer is just not on the cards for me (and probably quite a few others).

I know you can get sail kits and those amusing little 'floaty-on-a-stick' sidekicks, for the lesser Hobie yaks, but anyone who's tried them knows they aren't a patch on a proper trimaran with a real sail system, as on the A.I...

I personally think it'd be a top seller...

Just my $0.02, what do others think?

Cheers,

Mike.

Mike, roofracking the AI is not that difficult, once you get the hang of it. If you do it properly, the most weight you have to lift at one time is half the hull weight = 16kg. I doubt it would be worth Hobie's while to design and produce a smaller model just to facilitate loading the boat on a roofrack.

_________________

Hi Chris,

I've yet get my own A.I., but I tried to shift a mate's A.I. from the top of his car (Daewoo Nubira wagon) and I was astounded at how heavy it was - I didn't dare attempt to lift it off (in the same way i used to with my Revo).

I'm also curious as to whether it's possible to carry to A.I. inverted on a set of Rhino Aero racks - how far down do the AKAS mounts protrude above the hull?

It's also just not about the roof-racking, it's just general easy of use - the A.I. is rather big and bulky, particular for one person to handle - without being ageist/sexist - particularly for a lot of women and younger folk...

I know a few people who've looked at the A.I. but have been put off by the size bulk of it all. They actually mentioned it'd be great if there was a smaller/lighter model available.

I'm pretty sure it'd do well, but unfortunately (lucky for Hobie!) I'm not the head of marketing

Cheers,

Mike.

how about a vac bagged carbon kevlar hull and fittings. Very light (with the bonus your wallet would be also). Would look great. Any one handy with photoshop?

Mingle's biggest problem is the size of the car, not so much the lifting I believe. With a small car he is worried about weight and overhang.

I agree. I'd like to see something smaller and sleeker. The AI is sleek, but it's still a tank.

_________________
Support your local HOBIE dealer

Lighter would be great. Maybe make the AI out of Thermoformed plastic to keep the weight down, and the price reasonable.

But shorter? Shorter boats of this design won't sail as nicely, and I'm betting that if the AI was 30% lighter it would appeal to a lot of people who think a shorter boat is better. The length really is manageable, once you learn a few tricks.

Instead of trying to make a shorter boat out of the same rotomolded plastic, which probably won't cost all that much less then an AI, (seeing as much of the AI's cost is due to the components that would also be needed on a mini AI) I'd rather see a high performance version made from thermoformed plastic.

Wilderness Systems does this with their Tarpon line of kayaks.
Tarpon 12 Rotomolded - 64 pounds - $919 (Canadian)
Tarpon 12 Thermoformed - 43 pounds - $1519 (Canadian)

I'd be willing to fork out an extra $800 bucks or so, in the future if I could get 35% lighter kayak and ama's.

But until then, I'm happy with my AI as is. It's long enough to be fast on the water, cheap enough to be reasonable. It's just not as light as I'd like.

_________________

Mike, the whole thing gets much easier if you use a Rack and Roll loading bar: http://www.rackandroll.net.au/.
I carry my AI inverted on Rhino Aero racks on my Forester and they clear the roof OK, even when inverting the hull. (The boat needs to be loaded onto the the racks upright, then flipped over.) I imagine it varies from car to car - the Forester has rails to mount the roofracks on, so that would provide more clearance than say, gutter-mounts.

A lot of people prefer to carry the boat upright on cradles. I must admit that if I had it to do all over, I might go for Yakima roofracks, so I could use the Yakima Mako cradles, which enable you to carry two boats fairly comfortably, as augaug has demonstrated.

_________________

Thanks for the comments guys,

It's not so much the car-topping that's an issue, it's just the sheer bulk and awkwardness of dealing with an A.I. - that won't stop me from getting one thought!

I've had a go at loading and unloading the A.I. from a car, and pulling it in and out of the water - it certainly is a heavy lump, but once on the water with the wind behind you, it's a dream...

I've had dreams about getting someone to custom-make an A.I. clone out of carbon-fibre, AMAS and all... I haven't priced it yet, but I'm guessing I wouldn't get much change out and $20,000

Cheers,

Mike.

Aloha mingle

Most of us are willing to trade off the cumbersome loading ritual for the performance that the 16 ft hull gives us on the water.

A shorter kayak will not sail nearly as well, as many experiments with grafting sails of various shapes on kayaks have demonstrated. Smart guys like Mad Maxx can explain it all in painful detail with graphs and equations, but I think, the rudder in particular would be shortchanged. So a long, sleek hull is preferred.

As is, the AI is a little underwhelming as a sailing craft. It could be improved and strengthened in many aspects. But a smaller version would just be slower, wetter and tippier.

To Hobies credit, the TI is closer to the ideal sail yak, but man, talk about heavy! Storing it becomes a larger issue too.

Sounds like what you really need is a trailer, hullivator or other loading assist method to handle the long and bulky hull. Some guys make homemade dollies or use hoists. For me, something as simple as this helps:
http://www.hobiecat.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=73&t=31224&p=123197&hilit=kayak+loader#p123197

_________________
"You can avoid reality, but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality."
- Ayn Rand

Great solution there NOHUHU. Even though I don't have a boot (or trunk as you call it over there) on my 4WD, I can use that setup on the end of the roof to keep the TI on track when loading (on my own).

PS. Great lawn you have there.

_________________
H@mmer
"Intelligence is nothing without imagination"

If you have $10K laying around.................

http://www.warrenlightcraft.com/specs15sail.html

_________________
Support your local HOBIE dealer

Wow, I didn't realize that the "Little Wing 15.5" was only 68 pounds fully rigged. That's impressive! Too bad about the lack of mirage drive!

Oh and NOHUHU, that IS a nice lawn, especially compared to your neighbour's in the background!

_________________

Lookout! The Little Wing Tandem "Sail" is on its way.

http://www.warrenlightcraft.com/specstandem.html

And thanks Mates, it's Zoysia grass. Great for putting. The neighbors house is vacant pending a complete rebuild.

_________________
"You can avoid reality, but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality."
- Ayn Rand

Wow - I did a double-take when I first looked at that... All it needs now is a Mirage drive and I'd have one!

How close is that to an A.I.? I wonder which came first...?

I think a 'mini' A.I. could be just as stable, perhaps even drier with a bit more attention paid to the forward hull design.

Remember the A.I. never really started out a a proper sailing craft. I would expect a clean-sheet design of a new, smaller/lighter boat could avoid many of the compromises of the original...

Cheers,

Mike.