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Island Rudder Replacement Program
http://www.hobie.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=71&t=35376		 Page 4 of 16
Author:  TIDALWAVE [ Mon May 23, 2011 4:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Trial and Error in line connection lengths
After installing the new rudder lines as per instructions (great video by the way!) on my TI, I found that the 'up' line was still so long that I ended up pulling a lot of line out of the 'up' holes. The cinch knot(s) allowed me to untie the new line(s) and adjust the length of the 'old' up line slightly shorter. Now when I pull on the up line the rudder starts to lift immediately rather than having to dump a length of line in my lap before it lifts.
Author:  jms2756 [ Mon May 23, 2011 6:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Island Rudder Replacement Program
reconlon wrote:
jms2756 wrote:
Why wishful thinking? the rudder was/is an issue with the 2009 AI's also, why should they be left out?

some will still be under warranty and others only just out, and the rudder was identified by Hobie as an issue before any were out of warranty!
Sorry I wasn't clear. The transom on the 2011 AI's (where the rudder mounts) is completely different from the 2010 and earlier AI's. It almost impossible to change the older transoms or the newer rudders to be compatible with each other.

I have 4 older AI's and would love the new rudder too! :(


So Matt will there be a replacement rudder for the 2009 AI's? maybe an adapted version of the new one that will fit?
Author:  mmiller [ Wed May 25, 2011 9:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Island Rudder Replacement Program
Only 2011 model Adventures (and newer of course) have the transom fitting that can accept the new larger rudder. No kit or upgrade will be offered for older models.

Its a structural change in the transom... won't work.
Author:  dosjers [ Thu May 26, 2011 5:10 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Island Rudder Replacement Program
Installed the upgraded rudder on Saturday. It took less time than driving to the dealer to have it done. Took the boat out Sunday and it worked wonderfully. It sure is nice to have a rudder that you can raise and lower from inside the boat.

I also sailed with my trampolines installed for the first time. I was at an outing with a group of friends so I was giving lots of rides. The tramps worked great when I took out two people because I always had someone on the windward tramp. Then I took out one person and when I brought her to shore I pulled the tramps off the boat. It felt like the TI was really healing a lot more without someone sitting on the windward tramp. We had winds of about 10 mph gusting to 20+.
Author:  jms2756 [ Thu May 26, 2011 6:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Island Rudder Replacement Program
I have just thought of a question! with the new TI rudder install will I still be able to put a hobie gear bucket/box in the rear hatch?
Author:  TIDALWAVE [ Fri May 27, 2011 6:21 am ]
Post subject:  rear gear bucket
After installing the new rudder, I found that as shown in the rudder video, the rudder lines cross at the rear hatch. You may not want to install the gear bucket with lines in contact with it. The old plastic line tubes were long enough to be held to the side of the hatch opening by plastic clips. The new lines have to be tied to the old at the hatch opening to be able to access them. The new line tubes are thus much shorter. The trade off was simple access to installing the new rudder lines versus having longer line tubes which wouldn't interfere with hatch access but making the new rudder installment nearly impossible.
You could place the new lines on the plastic clips, but the connection knots are located at about the clip position. I suspect that the knots would start to wear fairly quickly if they were pulled back and forth across the clips. The old plastic line tubes protected the lines from wear at the clips.
Hobie created a fast and simple method to replace the rudder versus preserving an open hatch access for the gear bucket and having a very complicated fix.
Author:  Gringo [ Fri May 27, 2011 6:48 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Island Rudder Replacement Program
We took the gear box out after the first trip. We put shoes and an anchor and snorkeling gear and stuff in those hatches, and that box was already in the way. How many little bitty parts do you need to take? Stuff we would have kept in there is kept in a baggie in a dry bag, anyhow.
Author:  edoardotamburini [ Sat May 28, 2011 3:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Island Rudder Replacement Program
Hi there,
received today the Dynamic rudder.

Good job Hobie Cat!
Thanks again!

Edoardo
Author:  whosyerbob [ Sun May 29, 2011 2:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Island Rudder Replacement Program
I installed the new rudder yesterday and it looks like a winner; hope to test it on the water today or tomorrow.

Anyone that watches our videos knows that our TI gets real wet inside the hull; we get lots of water from the hatches and the line holes near the rudder (the line tubes slide in and out very easily). So anything we put inside the hull goes in a dry bag. The exception is stuff we wanted to put in something like a gear bucket, so Cindy crocheted a bag that fits over the mouth of an extra gear bucket that she cut the bottom from. Everything that goes in that crocheted bag is expected to get soaked, so it works out fine for us.
Author:  dosjers [ Mon May 30, 2011 5:22 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Island Rudder Replacement Program
After the first time I used my new rudder the steering lines were loose and needed to be tightened. I expected this because everything needed to tighten up and get seated.

The second time out the steering lines loosened up again which I didn't expect. Has anyone had a problem with this? They loosen up enough that I have significand play in my steering. I tightened the adjustment screws and tied the ends so I don't think the play is coming from the ends at the rudder.
Author:  Yakaholic [ Mon May 30, 2011 1:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Island Rudder Replacement Program
dosjers wrote:
After the first time I used my new rudder the steering lines were loose and needed to be tightened. I expected this because everything needed to tighten up and get seated.

The second time out the steering lines loosened up again which I didn't expect. Has anyone had a problem with this? They loosen up enough that I have significand play in my steering. I tightened the adjustment screws and tied the ends so I don't think the play is coming from the ends at the rudder.


Herb went out with the new rudder on his AI and it worked OK most of the day, but he had to go in early because the steering line got all loose and wobbly. Too much play. The dealer installed the rudder upgrade kit. At the end of the day when I inspected it, the screws were all tight but the left/right lines were loose. Hard to attribute this to line stretch, not sure what would cause the problem.

I have a 09 AI so I have the working/original version of the Twist 'n Stow. So, I can't even use the new rudder upgrade. Currently quite happy with how my rudder works. :D

My observation of the new upgrade. The rudder lines now impede the rear hatch access. That would bother me because I place the Torquedo battery in through the rear hatch. I also observed that the up line now also needs to be cleated in order to hold the rudder up. A harkin type cleat like the one used on the down line would be preferable to the cheap pinch clamp that Hobie decided to use.

The dealer that did the installation made the comment that the rudder upgrade is a "temporary solution". Not sure what to read into that comment other than maybe Hobie is still making improvements.

One has to believe that a factory installed rudder on the newest Islands don't suffer from lines impeding the rear AI hatch. Correct tube lengths used and no "tie on" patches like what is being done on the upgrades in the field. Also, one would think a bungee web might at some point get used to pull the up line back into the hull once the rudder is raised.

Don't get me wrong. Rudder sure looked solid and was much thicker than the original rudders. TI and AI owners that had the stern bolted version of the T-n-S and had to use the bungie hold down for sailing I'm sure are glad to have the new setup.
Author:  Yakass [ Mon May 30, 2011 10:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Island Rudder Replacement Program
Yakaholic, I too noticed fairly substantial stretching after 1st use with new rudder. I then re-tightened at the screws and this time it seems to be holding tension better.

As for your assessment that a Harken wedge cleat (as used on opposite side) would be a better option, you're spot on. I removed my jam cleat after 1st use and installed a wedger instead. It is a lot better and makes it much easier to cleat the rudder into a semi up/down position, which I have experimented with in various usage scenarios.

I really like the new rudder. much better turning, easier operation, better sailing performance. It took about 5 seconds to stop missing twist 'n stow.
Author:  whosyerbob [ Tue May 31, 2011 2:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Island Rudder Replacement Program
Took out the new rudder for the first time yesterday - it works as advertised. Many thanks, Hobie!

I will echo what others have said though; the lines blocking the entry to the rear hatch are less than ideal; the jam cleats aren't the solution of choice (I may have to completely reseat the front jam cleat because the rear screw was stripped before I even messed with it); the lines should all be the same throughout and not knotted together as they are in this replacement kit.

However, critical comments aside - the Tandem responds much better with the new rudder.
Author:  Wile-E-Kayak [ Tue May 31, 2011 8:41 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Island Rudder Replacement Program
Yakass wrote:
Yakaholic, I too noticed fairly substantial stretching after 1st use with new rudder. I then re-tightened at the screws and this time it seems to be holding tension better.

As for your assessment that a Harken wedge cleat (as used on opposite side) would be a better option, you're spot on. I removed my jam cleat after 1st use and installed a wedger instead. It is a lot better and makes it much easier to cleat the rudder into a semi up/down position, which I have experimented with in various usage scenarios.



Yak,

Anyway you can snap a picture of your Harkin wedge. I have not installed yet and want to start the "spot on" way rather than empty holes.

Best,

Wile-E :D
Author:  Yakass [ Wed Jun 01, 2011 5:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Island Rudder Replacement Program
Wile... no need to post photo... all you need to do is imitate the cleat arrangement on the starboard side. Do the same on the port side. Its a really simple mod, and definitely more user friendly than a jam cleat
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