Hobie Cat Forums

It is currently Mon Nov 24, 2014 1:33 pm

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 230 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 ... 16  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Wed Jun 15, 2011 9:08 am 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Tue May 27, 2003 12:44 pm
Posts: 9226
Location: Oceanside, California
We hope to have all the kits shipped to dealers and distributors within a month, so... with sea freight, may be another month after that.

_________________
Matt Miller
Director of Parts and Accessory Sales
Hobie Cat USA


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Jun 15, 2011 5:55 pm 
Offline
Site Rank - Old Salt

Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2008 11:18 am
Posts: 466
Location: Texas
Seems east and west coast have them?
Curious if any have made it to Texas ?
Trying hard to be patient....

_________________
Image
I'd rather be sailing,
Mark.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2011 12:45 am 
Offline
Site Rank - Old Salt

Joined: Fri Nov 21, 2008 3:39 am
Posts: 863
Location: Bairnsdale, Victoria Australia
I really admire the ongoing Hobie tradition of client support you guys display Matt with follow-up when users find weaknesses within the equipment. Well done...Pirate :wink:

_________________
Master of the galleon 'Pirates Lot'


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2011 5:18 am 
Offline
Site Rank - Admiral

Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2010 2:19 am
Posts: 215
Location: Victoria, Australia
Hi Matt, I know you have said there will be no upgrade for earlier versions, but am curious was it something that was discussed?
If an upgrade was made, and the owners were prepared to pay for it, for earlier models?

Could the new model rudder be made to fit if a block was made to mould to the hulls stern encapsulating the rudder pin mount and be attached via a rudder pin and possibly even glue?
Is the hull strong enough for an upgrade in that area if such a block were to be made?

Thanks in advance
Ed


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2011 9:59 am 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Tue May 27, 2003 12:44 pm
Posts: 9226
Location: Oceanside, California
The transom is built differently with molded-in inserts to take the load from the larger rudder. I would bet someone will try this, but not something the factory will do or recommend. The larger rudder is overkill for the AI. It does work better, but is not necessary at all.

_________________
Matt Miller
Director of Parts and Accessory Sales
Hobie Cat USA


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2011 3:19 pm 
Offline
Site Rank - Old Salt

Joined: Fri Nov 21, 2008 3:39 am
Posts: 863
Location: Bairnsdale, Victoria Australia
ELM wrote:
Hi Matt, I know you have said there will be no upgrade for earlier versions, but am curious was it something that was discussed?
If an upgrade was made, and the owners were prepared to pay for it, for earlier models?

Could the new model rudder be made to fit if a block was made to mould to the hulls stern encapsulating the rudder pin mount and be attached via a rudder pin and possibly even glue?
Is the hull strong enough for an upgrade in that area if such a block were to be made?

Thanks in advance
Ed


If it is any consolation Elm, my 2009 model rudder was far better with no tendency to ride up even when not cleated and superior to my existing larger rudder blade. There may have been some tendency to be overpowered in the strong winds but that could be controlled with reducing sail area. The other thing I liked about the the old blade was its shallower length with less chance of striking it on the bottom of launching ramps etc. My new blade has to be watched in that respect and will not stay down unless cleated. The only issue with the old model was with the rudder pins that seemed on other boats to break, though I did not have that problem. If yours is susceptible to breakage then my advice is to shim it so there is very little play between the rudder box and the blade. That should fix it for good and then go out and enjoy. I really can't see any changes in the transom design other than able to use stronger pins is any great improvement, then again I haven't reeived my new rudder set yet....Pirate :wink:

_________________
Master of the galleon 'Pirates Lot'


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Jun 17, 2011 5:11 am 
Offline
Site Rank - Admiral

Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2010 2:19 am
Posts: 215
Location: Victoria, Australia
G'day Matt and thanks, Pirate.
I am not so interested in a bigger rudder, just want to ditch the twist and stow. Personally I think it could be better and saw the new rudder mount system as an option that's all. Cannot remember whether it was port tack or starboard but one was always pretty limp at times even when de-powered in the sail and having to get out and screw in that darn screw was a pain where I sailed (soon hope to get back to).


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Jun 17, 2011 8:51 am 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Tue May 27, 2003 12:44 pm
Posts: 9226
Location: Oceanside, California
Pirate wrote:
I really can't see any changes in the transom design


There is a big difference visually. Older (than 2011) model AIs have a protrusion (roto) molded as part of the boat to afix the rudder assembly (like all other models). The new rudder is mounted on a gudgeon fitting which is bolted to the transom. Pin through molded Poly vs pin through injection molded fitting (gudgeon).

_________________
Matt Miller
Director of Parts and Accessory Sales
Hobie Cat USA


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Jun 17, 2011 8:56 am 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Tue May 27, 2003 12:44 pm
Posts: 9226
Location: Oceanside, California
Quote:
having to get out and screw in that darn screw was a pain where I sailed


We have not used that screw in years...

Do you not have the up / down rudder line system with a cleat for holding the rudder down? The 2007 model still used the black lever and required the screw at times. Since we went to the line "T" handle line system, there has been no problem holding the rudders down.

Read this tech note from 2007: Product technical change - Rudder Up/Down system for 2007-08 Adventure Island and '08 Adventure

http://www.hobiecat.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=68&t=5958

_________________
Matt Miller
Director of Parts and Accessory Sales
Hobie Cat USA


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Jun 17, 2011 3:59 pm 
Offline
Site Rank - Old Salt

Joined: Fri Nov 21, 2008 3:39 am
Posts: 863
Location: Bairnsdale, Victoria Australia
mmiller wrote:
Pirate wrote:
I really can't see any changes in the transom design


There is a big difference visually. Older (than 2011) model AIs have a protrusion (roto) molded as part of the boat to afix the rudder assembly (like all other models). The new rudder is mounted on a gudgeon fitting which is bolted to the transom. Pin through molded Poly vs pin through injection molded fitting (gudgeon).


Agreed Matt. My point was that the changes are apparently made for the new rudder attachments which were really not necessary if you are happy with your existing set-up. I imagine (and hope) that the transom strength itself has been beefed up too to accommodate the rudder set-up, not that there were too many issues in that department in the past either. (happy customer here)...Pirate :wink:

_________________
Master of the galleon 'Pirates Lot'


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Jun 17, 2011 9:44 pm 
Offline
Site Rank - Admiral

Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2010 2:19 am
Posts: 215
Location: Victoria, Australia
Yes Matt, I have the upgraded pull lines with a cleat but I still found when tacking to one side (as said cannot remember Port or Starboard) it was quite poor. If I jumped in the water and wound the screw in then it was ok until the screw pulled (threads are getting knackered) or I was coming back in and again had to bail so I could pull the screw. The new system where the rudder blade is sandwiched would alleviate that problem completely.
I also like the fact with the new system, that it will swing up if it bottoms out. Here when launching at a low tide, I have several shallow sand bars to cross and normally have to steer out over them with the paddle and them fold the twist stow rudder down, cleat, then crawl to the stern or jump in and swim to the stern to wind in the screw.
It was mostly a problem when loaded with dive gear and the AI heavy or when in pretty extreme conditions, in lighter conditions and not so heavy, not to bad.

I realise the changes in the newer models require a gudgeon to be fitted for the rudder to attach to, compared to the moulded rudder mount. But is there a way the new system could be fitted to an earlier model, would it require a different diy custom gudgeon that utilises the original rudder mount. Would the stern be strong enough?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jun 18, 2011 1:36 pm 
Offline
Site Rank - Old Salt

Joined: Tue Oct 31, 2006 6:06 am
Posts: 360
Location: Turks and Caicos Islands
I just installed my new rudder this morning, using the original lines. I did use a few inches of the new lines for the up/down lines. Should be out on the ocean testing it tomorrow.

And I'm not so sure about the new rudder kicking up when you hit something with it. It pretty much seems to need to be cleated to stay down. If it's cleated, how can it kick up? I think there might need to be some bungee somewhere in that whole design.

Also, anyone come up with a suitable substitute for those rudder pins yet? One of the two in my new rudder kit is cracked where the head of it meets the pin shaft. I saw it immediately when I opened the package of parts. No easy way to get another one down here any time soon.

_________________
Island life in the Devil's Triangle:
http://2gringos.blogspot.com/


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 11:18 pm 
Offline
Site Rank - Deck Hand

Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2010 12:12 am
Posts: 6
Location: SF Bay Area, California
Another successful rudder replacement this weekend, using the original tubes, and replacing the spectra line at the rudder with 7/64ths AmSteel Dyneema SK-75 Single Braid from West Marine. The 7/64ths line threads easily through the (original) poly tubing, once you remove the O-rings and endcaps. I don't know how much extra water I'll take on as a result of removing the O-rings, but I think keeping the longer tubes, higher in the stern will be better in that respect. I didn't like the idea of cluttering the rear hatch with multiple control lines crossing it, either.

Except for sizing the AmSteel, I didn't cut a single line. At least in theory, my conversion is completely reversible. By releasing the Spectra from the twist and stow, I got enough slack to untie the steering lines at the rear seat, and the up/down lines at the pulleys. I then fed the Amsteel forward from the rudder, through the tubes, and to the original tie points. With enough slack, you can easily tie to the control lines by pulling them up through the middle hatch. Then tighten up by pulling each line back towards the rudder. For the bungies in the up/down controls, I just tied them into the AmSteel at the same point they were in the original lines.

Why the Amsteel? I'm concerned about chafing the rudder control lines (I severely chafed the original spectra twice before I'd found all the rough spots and sanded them away) and 7/64ths Amsteel claims a 1600 lb breaking strength. It will have to chafe all the way through before I'll break it. Well worth the $10 I spent to get 32 feet.

I already got some chafing/tearing as I tightened the screws on the rudder tie point. Does anyone have a better idea here? I'm using a stainless washer, but it still seems to damage the line.

I haven't spent the money yet, but a Harken cam cleat to match the down pull cleat seems "necessary" to me. I noticed "Rob&Amy" did this. Did you have to move the mesh cover for the storage pocket backwards?

Finally, am I the only one who finds the steering handle a little weird? I always expect it to work like a tiller handle, not a steering wheel. If that's ever bugged you, here's your chance to fix it by just switching the steering lines. If not, you probably don't ever want to borrow my TI.

Dave


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 7:02 am 
Offline
Site Rank - Old Salt

Joined: Tue Oct 31, 2006 6:06 am
Posts: 360
Location: Turks and Caicos Islands
new rudder successfully tested. It seems to have both more throw and more authority.
We took the boat on a little 12 mile round trip picnic run to another island yesterday, And it beaches just fine.

Image

Now, I need to talk to someone about what I am doing wrong with this new GoPro Hero HD camera. I have never been so disappointed in a new camera in my life. SO I must be doing something wrong...
(That photo above was not taken with the GoPro..btw)

uh, that probably should be a separate topic. I'll go start one...

_________________
Island life in the Devil's Triangle:
http://2gringos.blogspot.com/


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:16 pm 
Offline
Site Rank - Old Salt

Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2008 11:18 am
Posts: 466
Location: Texas
Got it! Ready to roll. Looks like Monday will be first time out on the new rudder.

Image
P1030709.jpg by PhotoByMark, on Flickr

_________________
Image
I'd rather be sailing,
Mark.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 230 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 ... 16  Next

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group