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 Post subject: Re: Cost of rescues?
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 2:39 am 
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Joined: Thu Apr 12, 2012 1:54 am
Posts: 20
In New Zealand you are expected to pay $280 per hour if rescued and haven't paid your Coastguard membership fees.
http://northern.coastguard.org.nz/infor ... nfo_id=247

The Coastguard is run as a charity and cost $110 per year compared to $89 per year for the AA which covers roadside assistance services.

If your car breaks down you are expected to pay and hence how can people expect a free service from the Coastguard if there vessel breaks down and no immediate threat to life is present.


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 Post subject: Re: Cost of rescues?
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 5:42 am 
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Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2010 8:14 am
Posts: 87
Hey guys I was the one in the lead here as far as decision making on going out, I feel very bad for making that last minute decision that the storm may or would miss us by 60 miles or so. The forecast for that day was 1 foot seas and winds less then 5mph. Just as Vetgam stated we did not know of the storm brewing in Dallas to the north of our location at Matagorda until we arrived in Matagorda at a bait shop. I now use/have a radar app on my phone, and check the weather even more than I did going forward. I or we have learned a lot for that trip. Also each of us was on different VHF channels to monitor just in case our jetski friends need to contact us. We felt like we got a handle on the situation there at the time, reason why we did not call the Coast Guard, we did come very close to calling, but we monitored the weather station once we were secure at the rig and the weather station stated that the bad weather will be subsiding in the next 1 or 2 hours of that time.

I made this video for our learning experience and for awareness to remind us and others to check all safety before going out into open water.

here is the video re-posted


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 Post subject: Cost of rescues...Redux
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 10:27 am 
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Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2008 4:07 pm
Posts: 400
Location: CLEARWATER, MN
:? I was trying to emphasize the cost of trying to rescue someone. Here are some numbers from a couple of years ago: small helicopter: $1,600USD/hr; Coast Guard Sea Stallion SAR: $4,400/hr; C-130: $4200/hr; Cutter: $1,550/hr. In 2009, US Coast Guard SAR average was $16,340/person. In 2009, 4 guys radioed their boat was sinking in the Gulf but only had a VHF radio and could only give a general location...It took three days and 230 hrs of SAR for mission cost of $1.6million.
The Coast Guard recommends carrying an EPIRB whenever you sail more than 15 miles from shore. Usually cuts the search time down to only a few hours if that.
The National Park Service, which has had massive funding cuts, is talking about imposing rescue insurance fees for hikers who try to climb certain peaks that have been proven to cost millions of dollars for rescues. British Columbia is also contemplating charging rescue fees for certain activities (part of permits). New Hampshire is now starting to impose rescue fees ranging from $120 to $50,000 depending on negligence.

Florida Coast Guard will only tow you in if they feel that not to do so will cause bodily harm.
I was in Florida last winter when a 40 ft sport boat was towed in by a commercial tow/salvage company. The boat's engine seized up but the boat was not in danger of sinking. The CG would NOT tow the boat in...the CG called a commercial tow boat to haul them in. The boat owner was very upset when presented with the bill. His argument was the same old one: "I pay taxes so I shouldn't have to pay to have my boat towed in!" The Highway Patrol will not tow your car back to a repair shop...you have to have AAA insurance or be willing to pay cash. When I talked to the CG they explained that they would always provide carry-back to sailboarders/kayakers/Hobies because the boats were so small.
When watching the Hobie Youtube video and the narrator mentioned that if they hadn't hooked the tower on the first pass, they would have been swept out into deeper water, with high waves, and nearly zero visibility. It brought to mind just how much it would cost the CG to spend the next 12 to 48 hours sweeping the area to try to find the boaters. Everyone always complains about wanting to have their "high" taxes cut but then turn around and expect "free" services because they do pay taxes.


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 Post subject: Re: Cost of rescues?
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 7:50 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2011 1:58 am
Posts: 1502
Location: Forster, NSW, Australia
I am a little uncomfortable that you appear to be admonishing them for their situation.

From what I read,
They carried all the appropriate safety equipment
They went to reasonable lengths to check weather forecasts, swhich in this instance were not so accurate
They scrambled to a "safe" anchorage off the oil rig until the storm abated/passed
They didn't unnecessarily tie up rescue resources.

Sounds to me like they acted totally responsibly.

On one of my first ventures "outside", a rudder line broke inside the hull, so there was no practical wy to restore rudder control. I sailed about 5 miles to the entrance of a safe harbour using my paddle for steering, but my TI would only sail on port tack, and just spun in circles on starboard. When I realised I could not tack and enter the channel, I furled my sail to minimise windage from the offshore wind, and notified Marine Rescue that I would need assistance to return to port.

A trawler undergoing trials was sent out to retrieve me (after an hour or so), but by then I had drifted out to sea. It as a sobering moment when the skipper told the rescure tower that he couldn't find me, to be told that I was beyond the skipper's horizon.

This is why I now have a sea anchor, and have made an emergency rudder which fits in a scupper hole....

I would not like to think that people feel discouraged to post details here of difficult situations they faced, as we can all learn from knowing about it.

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Tony Stott
2012 Tandem Island "SIC EM"
www.scenefromabove.com.au


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 Post subject: Re: Cost of rescues?
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 9:31 pm 
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Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2011 6:02 am
Posts: 325
Location: Cape Coral, FL
Having watched the video, I don't see the danger. Winds were only force five maybe six at the peak of the storm, wave heights were minimal, and it was a fast moving storm. Whether they rode the storm out hanging off an oil rig, an anchor, sea anchor, or hove to it was just a matter of waiting for the storm pass.

The biggest danger was exposure and looked liked they were well dressed for conditions.

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2011 Golden Papaya TI with a 250 square foot spinnaker!
also a more manageable 100 square foot spinny...
&
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 Post subject: Re: Cost of rescues?
PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 8:37 am 
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Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2012 8:24 pm
Posts: 99
Location: Houston, TX
I agree with you kayakman7. You can't sense the risk we where in while watching the video but that's the camera. The fish-eye view of a GoPro with placement in an high position never represents the waves well. Before we could make our way back to the rig and even with the sail furled to 10%, the winds were lifting up the TI amas putting us at a very real risk of capsizing and yet the GoPro makes it hard to even see the waves. It wasn't until we got to the rig that the storm maxed in intensity. Worse than the conditions themselves is the FEAR you have out there looking at a black horizon, not knowing how bad things are about to get, knowing that you can't sail effectively, knowing that you are now on your own and no longer have control of the situation. The lightening didn't help matters that day. For a control freak like myself, it's heart attack material.

I rig my boat differently when I take it offshore vs the bays and lakes. After my first year of offshore sailing, I made the following safety modifications and recommend other carry these items for offshore use...

1. VHF Radios for ALL boats traveling as a group. (VHF radios typically have limits of about 5 miles)
2. GPS (I am adding a compass after this)
3. Safety ropes fore and aft to prevent amas from collapsing (biggest cause of offshore capsizing)
4. Extra aka bolts and rudder pins
5. PLB (personal locator beacon) (sends GPS location and notifies Coast Guard- this as the critical communication tool you need for rescue)
6. Cell phone (connection to provider is often lost offshore)
7. TI amas on the AI for extra stability
8. A quickly deployed backup rudder that works for broken lines as well as pin breakage (I use a quick deploy 6 inch PVC handle connected to backup steering and down cables running to the original rudder)
9. Bilge pump with large sponge in the hull as backup.
10. Extra line and type 4 flotation devices to help rescue others
11. Rig hook
12. PFD with- PLB attached, knife and water proof pouch for my phone
13. Long Philips Screw driver placed in back hatch that can double as a rudder pin in an emergency. (I stick it into the foam inside the hull)
14. Floating sea anchor designed for storm use (purchased today after this last experience)
15. Tools for mirage drive repair
16. First aid kit.
17. Food and plenty of water.
18. Leash with quick disconnect to leash yourself to the boat.

I want to thank all of you guys on this site for the experiences you've shared and the safety suggestions you've made. I've copied many. With everyone's willingness to share their difficult boating experiences, we get a true feel for the capabilities and limits of these boats. It's helped me plan for the worse. Still, I have a healthy appreciation that modifications can only go so far and I can't fool myself into thinking that I'm assuring safety.


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 Post subject: Re: Cost of rescues?
PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 2:12 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2011 1:58 am
Posts: 1502
Location: Forster, NSW, Australia
I am amazed that a piece of PVC shapped as a crook would be strong enough to take the loads of two Islands hanging off the rig in those conditions, or does it have a line passing through it which actually bears the load when brought back to you?

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Tony Stott
2012 Tandem Island "SIC EM"
www.scenefromabove.com.au


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 Post subject: Re: Cost of rescues?
PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 3:55 pm 
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Site Rank - Captain

Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2012 8:24 pm
Posts: 99
Location: Houston, TX
No that's just 1 inch pvc heat molded in our backyard grill. It gives but doesn't break- working like a shock cord itself. I worried that where we drilled through the PVC to attach the rope it might fail but it held up well. The shape seems to be key too.


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 Post subject: Re: Cost of rescues?
PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 7:31 pm 
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Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2011 6:02 am
Posts: 325
Location: Cape Coral, FL
You might want to add a gallon of water per person for offshore cruising. A gallon per day is ideal for normal consume, under survival conditions, it might last three days.

Having been in all kinds of slop, I have learned that a combination of confidence, skill, and a little luck will get you though the most frightening conditions.

Having completed the ec2013, I'm glad I choose not to use my ti. The rudder is just too small to handle really big conditions, a little balance would be nice also.

J

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2011 Golden Papaya TI with a 250 square foot spinnaker!
also a more manageable 100 square foot spinny...
&
the TI3 rear ama mod


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