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 Post subject: How to sail
PostPosted: Sun Jun 08, 2014 3:58 pm 
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Joined: Sun May 04, 2014 11:08 am
Posts: 69
Location: Rochester NY
So I just picked up my TI, my daughter and I took it out on the a small lake. I had a few questions since this is the first time I've ever sailed (or tried to)

1. I sat in the back, since I thought that was more of the drivers seat. It seems like it is easier to sail from the front. I had to tell my daughter to get up and pull the yellow line (furlong?) The she had to get up and attached the black line (pulls the sail out). I should have probably had those things attacked prior to going out. My question is, do you guys route the yellow line (the line that spins the mast) to the back seat?

2. Sitting in the back seat, with the black line hooked up to the cable, the line seems to want to rest on my shoulder (going from the base of the back of the kayak, diagonal to the sail). Is it easier if I have my daughter (10 years old) in the back?

3. There really isn't any directing of the sail correct? You basically open the sail as much as you want (exposing more surface area) and that's about it?

I had a tough time getting the cart under the kayak to drag the kayak to the trailer. My trailer was maybe 10 meters away, so my plan was to beach the kayak (not really beach, it was a boat launch with cement). Pop the cart on and wheel the kayak to the trailer. Lifting the back of the kayak and trying to place the cart in the right position was really tough. I had to have my daughter place the cart as I help the kayak up. What other techniques can I use (other than driving the trailer into the water like you would with a full size boat.

4. If I decided to sail in the front when solo (because of easy access to the trampolines) How do you paddle as you are approaching shore? I will have the trampolines on both sides.


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 Post subject: Re: How to sail
PostPosted: Sun Jun 08, 2014 6:24 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2005 6:29 pm
Posts: 2098
Location: High Point, NC
Do yourself a favor and buy a copy of "sailing for dummies." Don't be fooled by the title, it's a great book. There is a simple chapter on points of sail and sail trim that you will find invaluable and will greatly enhance your capabilities with the TI. You need to learn about proper sheeting - it's not a matter of simply "opening the sail" as the point of sail you're on determines how tight or loose you'll sheet the sail.


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 Post subject: Re: How to sail
PostPosted: Sun Jun 08, 2014 6:43 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2011 1:58 am
Posts: 1605
Location: Forster, NSW, Australia
There is an awesome document available at http://www.norcalkayakanglers.com/index ... ic=39153.0 (the downloadable word.doc version is shown inthe 14th post down).

Firstly, congratulations on your purchase!

As regards sailing from the rear seat, if you send nearly all the black mainsheet through its cleat (so you only have a few inches with the knot sticking out) this will enable you to get enough spare st the resr cleat to tie it to the end of the yellow furling line (using a figure 8 knot on the furling line), making a loop. You can then easily control both from the rear sest.

The mainsheet line will tend to get in the way of the rear seat occupant, in particular when you are sailing close to the wind with the sail in tight. A short person will obviously be less affected.

I don't use tramps, so can't help you with paddling from the front seat.

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Tony Stott
2012 Tandem Island "SIC EM"
www.scenefromabove.com.au


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 Post subject: Re: How to sail
PostPosted: Tue Jun 10, 2014 3:58 pm 
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Joined: Sun May 04, 2014 11:08 am
Posts: 69
Location: Rochester NY
I purchased a sailing for dummies book, good read so far. I still don't get how we sail on the TI as there isn't a boom and the sail doesn't move left to right. I am sure with more reading I would understand more.

I still don't know how to retrieve the boat by myself, specifically getting the cart into position UNDER the TI to pull it out of the water. My two options are to drive the trailer into the water OR remove the amas to relieve some of the weight so I can lift the TI.


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 Post subject: Re: How to sail
PostPosted: Tue Jun 10, 2014 4:15 pm 
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Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2012 5:33 pm
Posts: 4
Location: Chicago, Illinois
My 2 cents on your questions below:

1. (see other forum question on solo sailing for more here), but an easy way to furl from rear seat is to tie the end of the mainsheet line to the end of the yellow furl line.

2. I always ride in back and maybe a slouch a little more, but haven't had a real issue with the mainsheet line hitting my shoulder. I alway put my younger daughters in front seat so they can move out onto tramps whenever they want and/or switch seats with their friends who ride on the tramps.

3. Not sure what you mean re: 'directing of the sail', but the wind will typically shift it into position. The tell-tails on the sail should both stream back telling you the wind flow is optimized.

4. re: cart. Not sure which cart you have. I have the beach cart with the soft wheels. To load in leave back end of boat in the water with the amas out and place the cart in next to the boat in the water with the handle jammed in the sand so it doesn't float away. Then I lift up in the back of the boat, rotating it over the cart and pulling it back into the water enough to properly align boat on cart near where i'd strap it on. Roll up onto beach and complete the disassembly.

4. re: approaching shore. I usually have the tramps out as well. If wind right, I remove mirage drives, raise centerboard, and sail right onto beach. If low wind, I remove front mirage drive and pedal as close as possible with rear drive prior to getting out and dragging up to beach. Half versus full pedals can get you to fairly shallow water.

Hope this helps and enjoy your TI!

_________________
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Forrest D
2012 Hobie Tandem Island - Papaya
Chicago, IL


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 Post subject: Re: How to sail
PostPosted: Tue Jun 10, 2014 8:31 pm 
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Joined: Sun Apr 20, 2008 6:18 am
Posts: 1444
Location: Sarasota,Key West FL
mrasmussen:
I also have a TI and we hardly ever use the scupper cart anymore if we are at a launch or anyplace we can back up to the water. I never put the trailer into the water, I just back it to the waters edge, then lift the front of the boat up and either pull or winch the boat onto the trailer.
Unfortunately when we go down to our key West place we can't take the trailer (no place to put or store it) so we have to car top. We usually launch at Higgs beach down there and have to cross a couple hundred feet of soft sand with the scupper cart. What I typically do is I launch the boat with the wheels in, once I'm out in waste deep water I get out and remove the cart and store it upside down in the rear scupper holes on the back deck. We sail then when we come back I stop in waste deep water and put the scupper cart back under the boat (in the water) then just roll the boat ashore. Since it is pretty difficult to drag the fully loaded boat across the sand I typically remove the AMA's and walk them up to the car separately. Pulling the hull alone thru the sand (way less weight) it's not so bad. It's only hard when the boat is fully rigged, pulling the hull alone on the scupper cart is a snap and pretty easy, and is no more difficult than pulling our old Oasis.
When on concrete ramps I try to not ram the boat into the concrete ramp (hard on the boat), what I do is just pedal up to around knee deep to waste deep water and jump out, there I pull up the rudder, mirage drives, centerboard, etc and put the scupper cart under the boat into the scupper holes. I then just roll it up to shore to the waiting car if there is some distance to go (like when we are in Key West without the trailer), or when we have the trailer I just back the trailer to the shore, then lift the bow and pull the boat onto the trailer. I have a boat winch (about $25 bucks at Harbor Freight) that I mounted to the trailer for those day when I come off the water exhausted and just don't feel like man handling the boat.
I'll be perfectly honest, I have never ever used the paddles on my boat, I always carry one on board as a backup but never used it.
You will be surprised how durable the mirage drives actually are, we seldom pull the mirage drives out when we come ashore (we have mostly sandy beaches here), we just park them up against the bottom of the hull and put the bungy onto the pedal to hold the fins against the hull. The exception being the end of the day when we plan to pull the boat from the water, then we pull the mirage drives before pulling the boat ashore.
Actually it's probably a pretty good idea not to drive the TI up onto the shore like you would a canoe, I usually stop short of shore, get out, pull what I need up (mirage drives, rudder, etc) then walk the boat up onto the shore (either with or without the scupper cart).

The TI has to be the easiest boat on the planet to sail and you will pick up everything you need to know in the first couple hrs. Keep in mind that the TI is a pedal boat first and foremost so anytime you want to maneuver you just pump on the pedals (example: going from one tack to the other). Also keep in mind that if you turn one set of pedal around backwards you can maneuver around docks and harbors easily in forward or reverse by having your passenger pedal on the reversed pedals if you need reverse (a really handy feature).
Also keep in mind in order to steer the boat has to have forward motion for the rudder to work, so even if you sail is stalled and you are in irons (you will learn what that is in the books) you can pedal your way out of anything, so don't try to be a heeman hero and try to sail the TI without the mirage drives in, the boat is designed around them and they need to be used.
Another thing that I see a lot of beginners do wrong is they go out on a fairly gusty or windy day and try to sail with the sail fully unfurled, it's fairly easy to capsize if you do that (we don't want that). One of the strongest features of the TI is you don't have to open the sails all the way, if it's kind of windy just unfurl it partially, it works just as well furled in one or two turns. Actually in higher winds (over 12 mph) you will actually go faster with the sail furled in one or two turns.
Keep in mind if the sail is over powering the boat (one of the AMA's is going under water), you need to quickly release the sail ( or turn higher into the wind (you'll learn that from the book also) to keep the boat from possibly capsizing. Though it's pretty darn difficult to capsize a TI, it will capsize if you do the wrong things in higher winds.
The TI can be sailed just as easily from either seat, and there is no right or wrong seat to sail from, everyone has their own personal preference on that, and you have complete control from either seat.
Hope this helps you
Bob


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 Post subject: Re: How to sail
PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2014 6:56 am 
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Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2005 6:29 pm
Posts: 2098
Location: High Point, NC
The angle of the sail to the wind is controlled by the main sheet. The closer you are sailing to the wind, generally the tighter you will pull in the mainsheet. On a reach, where you're traveling 90 degrees to the actual wind, you may have the sheet/sail out towards the halfway point. Downwind, which will be your slowest point of sail, you use the sail as a bit of a kite, letting it out to catch whatever wind you can. Because it has no boom, this isn't terribly effective as the sail will buckle rather than stand straight out to the wind. You may find you cover more ground and reach your destination more quickly by keeping a bit off dead downwind and sailing at a bit of an angle.


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