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PostPosted: Sat Jan 24, 2009 9:25 pm 
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kepra wrote:
If you start to look over the failures from 06 thru 08, they have mounted up.... Mast, mast receiver, rudder pin, rudder change out, rudder lift kit, storage seal, fin replacments, aka release pins....I don't want to be negtive but 50% of the post on this site are about failures or updates... but reliablity is in question.

As compared with my other half who is still paddling a 700$ model in a stright line. She is starting with I told you so. As the loading weight,time,cost,refits are starting to mount up. I got a lot of money and time into this hobby vs time on the water. ...I do find that the older kayak I have is faster to get in /out of the water. But far less fun.

In 2010 I will try one more model with expectation of no upgrades or failures for five years.


Kepra, your concern is understandable, but the forum is the exact place to bring out problems and pose solutions. So naturally, one hears about problems. But if I have a problem that doesn't mean you have a bad boat. If it makes you feel any better, I've had 2 AIs and no problems -- no rudder problems, no mast problems, no sail problems. This may sound like the exception, but I'm guessing there are a legion of folks out there in the same situation. It wouldn't be very productive if we were chiming in about our lack of issues. :?

The great thing about this is I see some excellent solutions in case I ever do have a problem. As for changes and upgrades, all of us would be driving boats like your wife's $700 straight line model if Hobie weren't improving their products with changes all the time. In fact, Hobie's first AI's were the direct beneficiaries of over 40 significant functional improvements in the Hobie Mirage kayaks since I started using them over 8 years ago. In another 5 years, I suspect we're going to see lots more improvements. This is a great thing if we hope to have better products.

My wife has been telling me that "she told me so" ever since we got married. I'm pleased to be able to make her feel good about her great foresight and knowledge and intend to keep giving her that satisfaction! In fact, I frequently give myself a pat on the back for marrying such an insightful woman. If you're boat is giving you pleasure and she's also satisfied then all is well -- enjoy your AI. Obviously what's fun for you isn't necessarily fun for her. But don't expect 5 years with no problems or no changes! 8)


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 25, 2009 2:39 am 
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Location: Phuket, Thailand
Well said Roadrunner.....now about my mast receiver, what to do???


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 25, 2009 3:39 am 
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Posts: 1687
Location: South Florida
Yes, Kepra, this site certainly brings out the problems people have w/ their AIs. And it is a credit to Hobie for making it available. I have frequently made use of it for helpful information and to complain. My most recent complaint about corrosion has been taken care of by Hobie. I know that Hobie is paying attention to the points I raised. Those of us, who have had problems which were remedied immediately by Hobie, can attest very positively to their customer support.

And, I certainly agree with RR's thoughtful comments. I think there is no doubt Hobie will continue to improve the AI over the next 5 yrs--users on this forum will demand it. But, at the end of 5 yrs, it will be a better boat and more expensive--that is good business and inflation.

Keith

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I sail: Key Biscayne, Everglades to Cape Romano, Ft Desoto, Cedar Key

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 25, 2009 9:17 am 
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Location: Escondido
Philip1el wrote:
...now about my mast receiver, what to do???

Sure wish I could help Phil, but I've never made the conversion. Your idea sounds good, but I would wait for the Hobie folks -- wouldn't want to screw it up! 8)


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 Post subject: New pics on 1st post.
PostPosted: Sun Jan 25, 2009 9:31 am 
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Location: Florida
Added 3 pics, in 1st post, that illustrate what is happening to the sail. You can see the many cracks in the plastic and it feels as brittle as it looks. :shock:

I agee with Roadrunner. I love the Island and without any hesitation would buy the boat all over agian. I wouldn't let a few problems keep me from the huge amount of fun I have had in this boat.

Considering the 2 battens going thru the window and the main sail hem(tack) and clew and all the seems in general, the window is just going to be a b#tch to replace. It is really sewn in there quite extensively.

New sail here I come - :lol:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 25, 2009 11:06 am 
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Location: South Florida
That sure looks like sun damage.

Keith

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"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex ... It takes a touch of genius and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction." A. Einstein


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 25, 2009 1:54 pm 
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Location: Bairnsdale, Victoria Australia
Yakaholic wrote:
This reinforced X-ply monofilm (a clear polyester film with a black thread running through it) is another choice for windows in sails. (It can be used for windsurfer sails.) It is very light in weight 4.2oz, yet quite stable and durable.

Is 5mil thickness what Hobie uses?

http://www.sailrite.com/Monofilm-5mil-X-Ply-54

54" width and sold by the running yard.

-------

My new Hobie Hobby - Sailmaking :lol:


From those photos Yakaholic, looks more like 2mm thickness to me, if that....Pirate


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 25, 2009 4:27 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2008 4:55 pm
Posts: 84
Location: Pensacola, Fl.
<a href="http://www.sailrite.com/Plastipane-20-Gauge-Vinyl-Window-Material-54;jsessionid=0a010b441f437c889c41b2c44d2f95cb88f031f8f5ac.e3iKaNePch4Re34Pa38Ta38Nchb0?sc=2&category=38">Plastipane 20 Gauge Vinyl Window Material 54</a> can be purchased here for $5 per foot but the exact same thing can be purchased from WalMart for $3.24 per yard. I just purchased two yards of it to use for a dragging tarp. I wrap it around the stern of my AI to launch it and to drag it across the sand. I put a bungee cord around it and tie the bungee to the rear crossbar with a short length of nylon cord. I have used this setup twice and it works beautifully. It prevents abrasion to the AI. I am not worried about abrasion to the dragging tarp. If it wears through by the end of summer I will just spend $6.48 for two yards for next year. But I don't expect to have to do that. After dragging it over many yards of sand I have to look hard to even find the scratch marks left.

Ron


Last edited by Darwinian on Sun Jan 25, 2009 5:04 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 25, 2009 4:30 pm 
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Location: Florida
Chekika wrote:
That sure looks like sun damage.

Keith


Agreed. Just like leaving any plastic sheeting in the sun.

However. The only sun exposure is from sailing. Even when boat is beached to picnic or swim the sail is rolled up and the window not exposed to the sun.

I have never placed any chemicals on the sail cloth or window material. It still has the round blue & white "North Sails" sticker on a corner of the window.

Sail has never been left out in the sun - not even to dry. I don't have a garage so the sail is stored in the house - so it is climate controlled. No excessive heat or cold or sun.

When I first purchased the Island I wondered just how long the plastic would last. Now I know. :wink:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 25, 2009 5:45 pm 
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Location: Punta Gorda, FL
Pirate, was that sail ever used when partially reefed around the mast. From what I have seen on mine, that is the most stressful thing you can do to an AI sail, really pulling hard on nasty little creases.

My experience with windows on sails is mostly limited to racing sails, which live hard and die fast.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 25, 2009 7:15 pm 
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Location: Bairnsdale, Victoria Australia
Tom Ray wrote:
Pirate, was that sail ever used when partially reefed around the mast. From what I have seen on mine, that is the most stressful thing you can do to an AI sail, really pulling hard on nasty little creases.

My experience with windows on sails is mostly limited to racing sails, which live hard and die fast.


Your onto something there Tom that I did not consider initially. No the windsurfer sail was NEVER reefed or furled. We had a couple of different size sails and used the one appropriate to the circumstances. Maybe the window thickness needs to be beefed up to cope with the reefing stresses... Pirate


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 25, 2009 7:59 pm 
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Location: Florida
Pirate wrote:
Tom Ray wrote:
Pirate, was that sail ever used when partially reefed around the mast. From what I have seen on mine, that is the most stressful thing you can do to an AI sail, really pulling hard on nasty little creases.

My experience with windows on sails is mostly limited to racing sails, which live hard and die fast.


Your onto something there Tom that I did not consider initially. No the windsurfer sail was NEVER reefed or furled. We had a couple of different size sails and used the one appropriate to the circumstances. Maybe the window thickness needs to be beefed up to cope with the reefing stresses... Pirate


Well, when the wind is higher the Island sail gets reefed. Of course higher wind equals more stress on the sail window and when reefed you are sailing with almost all window and no sail cloth. Some luffing is bound to occur, and stretching as the sail is pulled tight for upwind sailing.

I have always been mindfull to not over tighten the sail or to let it luff any more than briefly or accidentally. I'm not one to brave 25knt winds on purpose - if I know it is going to blow over 20knts I stay home.

Pirate & Tom I believe you may have hit upon a poignant observation. The plastic window is being asked to do quite a chore while reefed. My 2 years has just flat worn it out.

Maybe a thicker plastic or less of it for future sails :?:

Hobie still needs to tell me what thickness they use (5mil? 3 mil?) So I can buy the right stuff and/or give proper instructions to the sailmaker.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 25, 2009 8:15 pm 
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Location: Dallas, TX
Yakaholic wrote:
Hobie still needs to tell me what thickness they use (5mil? 3 mil?) So I can buy the right stuff and/or give proper instructions to the sailmaker.


If you go to a competent sail loft, they won't need input from Hobie. Hobie is in the boat business. Lofts are in the sail business.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 25, 2009 8:40 pm 
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Location: Florida
The Dog wrote:
Yakaholic wrote:
Hobie still needs to tell me what thickness they use (5mil? 3 mil?) So I can buy the right stuff and/or give proper instructions to the sailmaker.


If you go to a competent sail loft, they won't need input from Hobie. Hobie is in the boat business. Lofts are in the sail business.


That sounds a bit uncostomarily unresponsive & unfriendly coming from a Hobie rep.

It is a simple enough question to answer and I don't want to go seeking expensive repairs uninformed.

Hobie may outsouce many of its parts for others to manufacture but it must certainly have a specification for the parts it orders including the thickness of the sail window.

Also, I still may want to buy the material myself to do my own repair - and why buy the wrong material.

BTW I went to 3 surf/sail shops today and NOBODY had Monofilm repair tape.

Maybe Hobie needs to add it to their parts catalog.

BTW if Hobie sells the sails they ARE in the sail business even if they don't repair them.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 25, 2009 8:48 pm 
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Joined: Fri Dec 05, 2008 2:32 am
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Location: Calga NSW, Australia
You would have to wonder if Hobie are the best people to advise you, since the material they used in the first place has clearly failed under normal conditions - you can hardly use an AI without furling the sail.

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