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TI rudder assembly came off
http://www.hobie.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=75&t=29769		 Page 4 of 5
Author:  KayakingBob [ Tue Aug 24, 2010 4:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TI rudder assembly came off
NOHUHU wrote:
Same here, but absent a swell, wouldn't that be the "downwind" side on a port tack? The boat wants to round up so you apply drag to the starboard aft side. Essentially dragging on the side you want to point the boat? ...

Do you ever use the rear Aka to brace the paddle, or run it just behind them, relying on muscle and hull leverage?
I usually put the single bladed paddle on the upwind side of the hull, otherwise it can tire you out quickly. I keep the paddle behind the rear brace, but often hold the paddle shaft and the aka with my lower hand, while "steering" with the upper hand.

If you are going almost strait downwind, then the regular Hobie 2-bladed paddle is best, with just a drag stroke every so often on side the bow is moving away from.
Author:  NOHUHU [ Tue Aug 24, 2010 4:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TI rudder assembly came off
I'll try that too Bob. I have been experimenting recently with both long and short paddles.

Anything that works and spares the shoulder is good. You don't want a rotator cuff tear on top of a failed rudder.

With my tramps deployed, I really need the paddle to be behind the Akas. I had not tried tying it off to the rear Aka yet cuz it seems you often need to switch the rudder from port to starboard as conditions and courses change.

TI Akas have the crossbrace behind the Aka so that gives the person up front a great lever to use. Might work for solo sailors too. Waiting to hear from Mitch and other TI drivers re this.

Anyway, paddle rudders are a fun exercise and I encourage everyone to practice it once on every sail. Twice if you have a TI. :wink:
Author:  KayakingBob [ Tue Aug 24, 2010 5:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TI rudder assembly came off
Honu wrote:
Yes, a new thread with pics of your splash skirt is best. Could you let us know when it is posted (and also in what thread). I am always seated upfront in the TI, and would welcome a drier ride.
Here's a start... http://www.hobiecat.com/community/viewtopic.php?f=69&t=30319
Author:  whosyerbob [ Wed Aug 25, 2010 6:07 am ]
Post subject:  Re: TI rudder assembly came off
I found with my rudder failure experience that the double-ended paddle to use as a rudder-hack was best for me. The double blade allowed me to instantly change sides as needed, something I found to be important when the TI was moving around 8.9 mph. I also found the paddle worked best for me on the downwind side, with the blade in the water as far back as I could place it. I haven't yet tried it from the front seat, but should given the interest and the ongoing problems.

Also, I heard yesterday that Hobie has stopped all new TI deliveries to the dealers until they get the rudder issue(s) resolved.
Author:  Honu [ Wed Aug 25, 2010 3:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TI rudder assembly came off
Hobie should be applauded for their recognition of the seriousness of the rudder situation.
Author:  NOHUHU [ Fri Aug 27, 2010 1:26 am ]
Post subject:  Re: TI rudder assembly came off
whosyerbob wrote:
I found with my rudder failure experience that the double-ended paddle to use as a rudder-hack was best for me. The double blade allowed me to instantly change sides as needed, something I found to be important when the TI was moving around 8.9 mph. I also found the paddle worked best for me on the downwind side, with the blade in the water as far back as I could place it. I haven't yet tried it from the front seat, but should given the interest and the ongoing problems.

This was my favorite technique on the AI too.

"Pop" goes the rudder -and my hard/flat paddle is always assembled so I can whip it back there in a rush. Closest to the old rudder will give you the easiest time steering with it - and I keep it leashed.

The plan is, when I am out of danger, I'll roll the tramps and switch to the T-handle and steer/paddle home or attempt a pin repair on the water.

On the TI, you might experience trouble getting the long paddle under and around the sail when you are in the front seat. A half paddle is quicker.

Let us know how it goes.
Author:  KayakingBob [ Tue Aug 31, 2010 9:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TI rudder assembly came off
Honu wrote:
Yes, a new thread with pics of your splash skirt is best. Could you let us know when it is posted (and also in what thread). I am always seated upfront in the TI, and would welcome a drier ride.
Here it is: http://www.hobiecat.com/community/viewtopic.php?f=69&t=30319

NOHUHU wrote:
Bob- when they are ready, can you post picts of those tramps in a new thread?
And here it is: http://www.hobiecat.com/community/posting.php?mode=post&f=69
Author:  Doug Skidmore [ Wed Sep 01, 2010 2:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TI rudder assembly came off
I just wanted to clear any confusion on the length of the bolts used to fasten the gudgeon bracket to the hull of the Tandem Island. With Matt Miller out of town I felt I should chime in.

It appears that in some of our production that 1/2" screws were used in lieu of 3/4". These are shorter than what our specs call out and should be replaced. If only four threads show when removed from the boat as seen in the above posts, it is the wrong screw. 8 or 9 threads should be showing.

We are preparing a kit to send N/C to all TI owners to replace these screws if they are too short. It will also include some red loctite which should be used to secure them to the boat. We take this kind of thing very seriously at Hobie and apoligize for any inconvenience that may have been experienced.

Doug Skidmore
Author:  KayakingBob [ Wed Sep 01, 2010 2:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TI rudder assembly came off
Thanks for the heads-up, and for the great and ever-evolving products!
Author:  NOHUHU [ Wed Sep 01, 2010 2:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TI rudder assembly came off
Mahalo for the update, Doug.

Good timing to let us know this before the long Labor Day weekend.
Author:  Honu [ Wed Sep 01, 2010 9:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TI rudder assembly came off
Thanks Doug. This should solve the problem of the rudder assembly separating from the hull.

Having our rudder come off a mile and a half offshore really showed us how much we depend on it to keep us safe, and provide a sense of security and well being on the water.

Since this thread was started, another thread popped up which addressed several instances of the rudder snapping off under normal conditions and use.

Could you please address that issue in the other thread. This revelation has shaken my wife's confidence and she is hesitant to use the TI. We have yet to try steering the TI with a canoe paddle, but fear if we cannot master that, our TI will not be used as much as we had hoped.
Author:  Doug Skidmore [ Thu Sep 02, 2010 3:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TI rudder assembly came off
I will have to investigate the situation on TI rudders breaking and get back to you as I am not as familiar with this issue as the situation with the screw size mishap. I can say that we are in the process of reviewing the whole rudder system on this boat and will have some news and information in the very near future.

Again sorry for these problems and we are in the process of understanding them and resolving them as quickly as possible.

Doug
Author:  Paul67 [ Thu Sep 02, 2010 6:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TI rudder assembly came off
Doug,

Will we need to 'apply' for the kit or will it be sent to everyone?
Author:  captain-max [ Thu Sep 02, 2010 6:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TI rudder assembly came off
Thanks for the update Doug. Hobie's support of their products was a big reason I was confident to 'buy Hobie'.

Re the rudder snapping problem, when I closely inspected my rudder on a clear day, I could see curved radial lines coming from a point on the rudder where I think the plastic may be injected into the mold. In the pic below, the straight lines roughly illustrate the lines I can see, although they are actually curved, not straight. At the centre of the circled area is a 'rough' rectangular patch on the forward edge of the rudder, maybe the injection point?

From the pics I've seen of the snapped rudders, I'm wondering if this is where some sort of stress fracture is beginning?

Image
Author:  TxYackMan [ Thu Sep 02, 2010 7:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TI rudder assembly came off
Doug,

Look forward to hearing Hobie's solution to the TI steering problems.

Mark.
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