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PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2011 4:54 am 
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Location: Täby, Sweden
Does anyone know how to repair the cup that holds the cord fitting for the front hatch. There is a manufacturing fault on my TI which Hobie Europe was told about in August last year. In April they came up with a solution which is impossible to apply as there is not sufficient material in the damaged part. I need help as the ice has gone, the boat is on land and I do not wish to wait another 9 month for Hobie to react. Hobie US says this is to be solved by Hobie Europe. (A TI cost some 9000$ in Sweden).

The problem is described on attached sketch. The measure "TO SHORT FOR THE CORD FITTING" on the sketch is 10 mm (3/8"). The photograph shows how the boat was delivered without a bottom of the cup. All water from the drain around the hatch goes into the hull and that is lots.
Image
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Bo Karlberg
Taby
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Sail Tandem Island No P1787 in the Stockholm Archipelago (some 40,000 islands and rocks)


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2011 5:09 am 
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The simple solution is to simply put "goop" into the opening and on the threads and screw the fitting back in. I have used "3M Marine Sealant, Silicone" here in the States.

Keith

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2011 8:06 am 
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Chekika wrote:
The simple solution is to simply put "goop" into the opening and on the threads and screw the fitting back in. I have used "3M Marine Sealant, Silicone" here in the States.

Keith

It is not that simple as the cup is bottomless and the fitting goes down under the thread in the boat. The fitting is 5/8" high and the thread in the hull is 3/8". A lump of silicone would not work when pulling tent and sleeping bags out of the hold.

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Bo Karlberg
Taby
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Sail Tandem Island No P1787 in the Stockholm Archipelago (some 40,000 islands and rocks)


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2011 2:23 pm 
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Location: Sollentuna, Sweden, Europe
Hello Boka1942, sorry to hear about your problems. I live in Sweden to, not far from you, and we have the same dealer (Seafari). I have an Adventure kayak.

As I see it you have 2! problems.

One is leakage and maybe that is the easiest one to fix. The other problem is more serious one in my opinion. The front hatch is quite big and you need to trust the bungees to keep it proper locked down, especially when sailing fast and in choppy conditions.

I will try to contact you by email for a more detailed description of the problem. I am just interested, my kayak have a lot in common with other Hobies (of course!).
And I really like to see the TI!

Thomas
Sollentuna


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2011 2:57 pm 
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Kal-P-Dal wrote:
Hello Boka1942, sorry to hear about your problems. I live in Sweden to, not far from you, and we have the same dealer (Seafari). I have an Adventure kayak.

As I see it you have 2! problems.....

...

Thomas
Sollentuna


Exactly, there are two problems and both worries me.

I am waiting for your e-mail.

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Bo Karlberg
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Sail Tandem Island No P1787 in the Stockholm Archipelago (some 40,000 islands and rocks)


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2011 3:26 pm 
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Since you don't like my first simple idea, I'll give you another one slightly more complicated.
1. Get a pvc cap of the type used to cap the end of a pvc pipe. It needs to be large enough to slip over the sides of the damaged threaded cup, from inside the hull.
2. Liberally add an adhesive, like West System G/Flex epoxy, to the cap. You might search the forum to see if there is a better adhesive, but I think G/Flex is commonly used.
3. Slide the pvc cup, partially filled with adhesive, up onto your damaged cup--before hand, you are going to have to figure some way to hold it there for an extended period to allow the adhesive to set up.
4. Before the adhesive sets up, take your cord fitting, wrapped with Teflon tape around all threads & on the bottom, and screw it into the damaged opening. Hopefully, the Teflon tape will keep the adhesive from adhering to your cord fitting.

I wonder, since this is clearly a defective hull with a serious potential leak, have you put in a warranty claim for a new hull?

Keith

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Last edited by Chekika on Sun Apr 24, 2011 3:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2011 3:31 pm 
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Location: Melbourne, Australia
Bugger that... If it was me, I'd make sure my dealer fixed it, or replaced the hull.

After spending so much on a T.I. I'd expect it to be 100% fit for purpose and, if this is a manufacturing defect, it obviously isn't

Mike.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2011 3:52 pm 
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Location: Central Coast NSW Australia
Boka,
It's a shame Hobie Europe aren't much help. :( They seem to have a different attitude to Hobie US and Hobie Aus.
If you want to get sailing then I'd try the fix and argue warranty later.
I'd be going with Keith's solution. I see in a previous thread of yours regarding this problem Roadrunner has already suggested that fix based on an earlier fix for cracked seat cups from Yakaholic. Remember this?
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=25029&p=106230#p106230
Scotchweld DP8010 would be what I would use as it does stick well to the hull. Roadrunner fixed his cracked cam columns with it.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2011 10:56 pm 
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If this was happening to me in Australia, I'd be complaining to the Department of Fair Trading that I had been supplied with faulty goods. It's amazing how a call from the Department can focus the attention of a retailer.
Do you have something similar in Sweden?

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2011 1:51 am 
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Struth, Where is quality control? That should have never left the factory and I would be screaming for a replacement hull. Personally I would not even attempt to patch it and would be on the dealers front door, day and night until it was replaced. If you do attempt to patch it, make sure you have plenty of photos before you attempt any patch and if there is a consumer protection organisation in Sweden, I would be calling them as well.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2011 10:53 am 
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Just to make clear my dealer, the only one in Sweden, has made her best to get Hobie Europe in Holland to sort the matter out. I do not wish to start consumer actions against the Swedish dealer as the problem is created on the continent and across the pond.

The Dutch solution (after some eight months) was to put in a threaded plastic plug in what remains of the cup and screw a new cup on to it. This solution would only leave less than 3 mm (1/8") deep cup which is no good as the cord fitting is 16 mm (5/8") high.
Just before Easter I have asked Holland for a better solution but I cannot see any but replacing the hull.
I have attached a detailed sketch with the right proportions (almost) to illustrate the seriousness of the problem. Silicone will not solve any problem.

What I find most irritating is that the hull left the factory although they knew it was faulty. Instead of melt it down they tried to cover up by a most inferior repair. Further I am not happy with the problem pushed over to Europe as the hull was actually manufactured in the US. There were a number of other smaller manufacturing misses as well which I have fixed myself.

I sent the first mail about the fault on 9 August 2010 when the boat was only a few weeks old. On the 22 August 2010 I discovered the extent of the fault and informed the dealer in English so the information could be transferred to Hobie Europe straight away. Photographs of the mess was also attached and the the shallowness of the cup was explained together with information about the destroyed thread.

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Bo Karlberg
Taby
Sweden
Sail Tandem Island No P1787 in the Stockholm Archipelago (some 40,000 islands and rocks)


Last edited by boka1942 on Mon Apr 25, 2011 3:03 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2011 2:44 pm 
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Bo, it seems to me that it is the Swedish dealer who is responsible for this problem. She supplied you with the boat and it was her responsibility to ensure that it was supplied in good condition. If Hobie Europe is being unhelpful, that is her problem, not yours. She should simply supply you with a new hull and sort it out with Hobie Europe herself. Don't they have consumer protection laws in Sweden?

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2011 3:23 pm 
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chrisj wrote:
Bo, it seems to me that it is the Swedish dealer who is responsible for this problem. She supplied you with the boat and it was her responsibility to ensure that it was supplied in good condition. If Hobie Europe is being unhelpful, that is her problem, not yours. She should simply supply you with a new hull and sort it out with Hobie Europe herself. Don't they have consumer protection laws in Sweden?


Yes, we have a good law of contract written some 100 years ago and also consumer laws and a state run consumer arbitration body. However, I do not wish to start proceedings that may take years to sort out and squeeze a small company who has done it best. It is the manufacturer who has failed and should correct his mistakes. The dealer is fully informed about the "progress".

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Bo Karlberg
Taby
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Sail Tandem Island No P1787 in the Stockholm Archipelago (some 40,000 islands and rocks)


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2011 4:04 pm 
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Bo, if that small company had "done its best", they would have inspected the boat thoroughly and made sure it was delivered to you in good condition.

You purchased the boat from the dealer and they are the ones with whom you have an implied contract, not Hobie Europe or Hobie USA, who are not within the jurisdiction of Swedish law.

Often, a quick phone call from the relevant authority is enough to remind a business of their legal obligations, without the need to resort to protracted legal proceedings.

Hobie's quality control is not always flawless, but they normally compensate for this with their very supportive dealer network. That seems to have broken down in this case.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2011 5:34 pm 
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Very good point Chris. If you buy a can of Coke and it's flat, your first point of call is the shop you bought it from, not the manufacturer. It's no different if you buy a Hobie or a Coke.
Well that's the way it works here and I'm sure it's no different in your country.
Your fight is with the dealership, with the support and backing of your own countries Trade Practices Act. Your dealers fight is with Hobie.

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