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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 1:34 pm 
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Just thinking worse case scenario when out on the water, if something should happen and the hull completely fills with water will a PA sink? Or are their built in floats inside the hull to keep it somewhat afloat? I've read some guys put those long pool floats in their PA's just incase.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 1:40 pm 
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Positive foam flotation inside is standard with current production (since approx 2 years).

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 2:48 pm 
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That's reassuring, do you know how much weight the floats will hold up? I'm putting an order in with my Hobie dealer next week, so I'm figuring out what I want to do to my kayak in the meantime.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 4:21 pm 
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Matt,

Out of interest, how much extra weight is supported by the standard foam? Most of us accessorise our PAs, so at what point should we be adding extra floatation to keep the boats afloat when full of water?

cheers,
Graeme


Last edited by Kalgrm on Sun Aug 04, 2013 9:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 6:03 pm 
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From what I could find on line, the USCG boat builders regulations state:

BOATBUILDER'S HANDBOOK
Flotation - Applicability

Since the regulation is divided according to boat type, the applicability for the various types is discussed in each subpart. The exceptions, however, apply to all subparts and are as follows:

Sailboats, canoes, kayaks, inflatable boats, submersibles, surface effect vessels, amphibious vessels, multi-hull boats and race-boats need not comply.

So, based on the above regulation, the floatation Hobie adds is a bonus for all of us who purchase their product.
Matt might know the answer to the question posed by Graeme and I would venture to guess, when swamped, Hobie's flotation will keep the top rail of the cockpit above the swamped water line.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 8:02 am 
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It is important to remember that any additional gear, tackle, etc., that you attach to or inside the boat may reduce the boat's ability to stay afloat. Unless those items themselves will float, it's not hard to overcome the boat's floatation.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 8:26 am 
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Tom Kirkman wrote:
It is important to remember that any additional gear, tackle, etc., that you attach to or inside the boat may reduce the boat's ability to stay afloat. Unless those items themselves will float, it's not hard to overcome the boat's floatation.


Sure definitely. Just wondering if anyone has put it to the test of how much extra dead weight if any it will support before going completely under.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 10:10 am 
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My guess would be 600 pounds since that is the max capacity that Hobie rates the PA14 for. But then that's an assumption on my part. I'm just curious if the other Hobie models or other kayaks get so much attention to weight and whether they will sink. It just seems to me that good common sense should prevail based on the type of fishing you do and the conditions (body of water/weather) you fish in.

All of this really boils down to each of us individually and trying to find a definitive answer might be a challenge. If you wear a life preserver and have insurance (like I do), then you would have a greater piece of mind when out fishing.

Just my thoughts...

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 10:39 am 
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Unless the hull is punctured, there is the option of bailing out the interior of the hull.....I carry a hand operated bilge pump....Hobie sells one for $20, P/N 72020032.....is cheap insurance and easy to store on board.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 10:57 am 
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One the hull is flooded and submerged to the top rails, it's not likely to carry much more weight before going to the bottom.

I suppose someone with access to a controlled depth waterway (3 to 5 feet would be more than enough) could do a test and find out for sure. I'm guessing that less than an additional 25 pounds would put it on the bottom. Once the boat is no longer able to displace any more water, it has reached the limit of its floatation ability.


Last edited by Tom Kirkman on Mon Aug 05, 2013 12:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 11:45 am 
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I carry a Attwood Water Buster pump that uses D batteries to pump the hull out if need be. Hope I never have to use it! I think a pool would be the best place to try to sink a PA.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 12:37 pm 
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My dollar store carries pool noodles, for, you guessed, $1. Stuff the hull full of them (be careful with control/electrical lines, if any) and she will never sink. She takes about 25 of em, in 6' length. This adds just a few pounds (2?) of extra weight.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 5:40 pm 
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I've practiced rolling my older model PA14 over and getting it right-side-up so I know how to do it if it ever happens while fishing. One of the biggest chances for submerging a PA is when it is turned over. The front compartment IS NOT water-tight and the longer it is turned over the more water leaks inside and the heavier it gets. If turned over for an extended period of time I imagine most of the bottom compartment could fill with water since it is open the entire length from the front storage to the back. I'm not sure if the few small foam chunks in the bottom would support that kind of weight? It may be worth adding foam in the bottom compartment? I like the pool noodle idea mentioned above! It wouldn't weigh much and would likely be a lot safer than the small amount of foam that currently is in the bottom.

I made the mistake (once) of leaving the back drain plugs open. My PA14 felt a little weird and not as stable...especially when I stood up. It also didn't steer like it should...so I knew something was wrong! 2 hours later when I got to shore there was a bunch of water that came out the plugs! Luckily I wasn't in deep waves or it could have been a bad deal!


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 07, 2013 7:35 pm 
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setlab wrote:
Just thinking worse case scenario when out on the water, if something should happen and the hull completely fills with water will a PA sink? Or are their built in floats inside the hull to keep it somewhat afloat? I've read some guys put those long pool floats in their PA's just incase.


I started a post like this back on 7-7-13. Here is what I found when I tried to sink my PA-12 in my pool
This is a cut and paste from my post. I hope it help.

I've been searching the forum to find out if the PA-12 will sink if completely full of water. I wanted to know if a catastrophic happened while on the water if staying with the kayak would be worthwhile. I couldn't find the answer, so today I put PA-12 (2012 model) to the test. I put it in my pool, opened all of the hatches, pulled the drain plugs and did everything possible to sink her. I wasn't able to sink her. I forced all of the air out of the hull and climbed on top of her and she still wouldn't go down and I weigh 275#. It's probably because of all the foam pieces inside the hull.
So now I know that if I do happen to capsize and fill the hull with water, I can stay with my kayak and use it for floatation along with my PFD, until help came or I made the decision to swim to shore.
A least now I know what I will be dealing with in the worst case scenario, Plus I now know there will be the possibility of recovering my PA after the event.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 07, 2013 7:44 pm 
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svendawg...thanks for your real time experiment.......I would hazard to guess the 2013 PA-14 will perform the same if tried to sink it.
I found my PA-14 to contain several high density foam blocks.
This is most reassuring!

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