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PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2014 7:41 am 
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I have been working with a great customer support company with a problem I have. The rudder system cord is run around a pulley system inside the hull. I cord under tension has pulled open a large ripped hole in the hull. I contacted the Hobie Dealer about the problem. They researched the problem submitted picts of the hole and the hull number to Hobie see if it was under warrenty. Not covered.

The company rep responed with this statement:

"Thanks for your reply. We submitted the information we had from you to Hobie last night. Unfortunately, this is not covered under a warranty. These holes appear when it is overpulled or left under a lot of tension for a long period of time. It will need a repair. You will beed to have someone weld it closed, then cut out some plastic and weld that over the top. This will provide something sturdy to mount the block to. If there's anything else I can look into for you, please let me know."

I was wondering if anyone else has had a problem with this same issue? If so did the repair, as suggested above, solve the problem?

The other reason for posting this infomation is to alert the general public of this problem and how to avoid it happening to you if it has not happened at this time. Release the tension when not in use. I stored my PA 14 with the rudder tension left on the rudder.

I would recommend that HOBIE add this infomation in their manual about rudder tension and the possible results if they do not release the tension "over long periods of time".

Matt, do you have any advice for me as a long time owner of Hobie products. I have four at this time. PA 14, Outback, i9s and i 14T. I am not a handy man to get the suggested repair job done. AND I am not sure the patch will work. I do not care what the finish job looks like, but I am concerned with the PA turning over and filling with water much quicker then without the hole. I would like to hear from you on this matter. You are the person from the company to give the best advice and reasonable suggestions in the many years of me reading the blog.

Thanks for a reply.


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PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2014 7:56 am 
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Location: Lake Park, GA
I store both of my PAs with the rudder raised (tension applied due to the spring loading). It would be helpful to know if this is a recommended action by Hobie or not. You would think that this is the logical storage methodology. I can store them with the rudder down as they are stored on the trailer, but would like to know what the recommendation is. No issues so far with any stress or damage storing the PAs with the rudder in the "up and secured" position.

It does seem like an odd occurrence in your case. Hope you get a solution.

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2013 Pro Angler 14 - Dune
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PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2014 9:23 am 
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Was the PA was not within the warranty period?

Warranty is not always about replacement though, as repair or replace is the text in the policy. This is a repair issue due to the fact that it is both possibly user induced and above waterline. A plate of any material can be used to enlarge the contact area for the turning block. This can be welded, riveted or bolted. What ever works easiest. Welding is not required. You can "sandwich" the area with two plates.

Holding the rudder up takes very little tension on the up line, but it is possible to load up the line and when left for long periods as described... damage could be caused as the material "creeps" or stretches under constant load. This is also why we warn about hanging a kayak from the handles. They can take periodic loads, but not constant loads.

I will remind tech staff of the issue for inclusion in manuals if not already done.

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PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2014 11:10 am 
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Location: Waverley,Nova Scotia,Canada
WOW!!! That's the kind of service other companies would do well to emulate!!

Ask a question about a problem with a product and get a sensible, (not ass-covering bafflegab) direct reply from a company rep - and all on the same day. Good on you HOBIE and And BRAVO ZULU to you mmiller!!

Regards.....


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 6:11 am 
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I'm kind of still confused about Matt's answer. Should the rudder be stored up, or down? I store mine up. I just want to avoid any possible damage to my hull. Any clarification would be appreciated.

Jeff

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Pro Angler 14 in Dune
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 6:34 am 
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777,
I think his answer included user error was the problem. And because I stored my yak with the rudder up it caused the end results of the ripped hole in the side of the yak. So do not store the yak with the rudder in the up position.

Matt is the best in the business. I have always enjoyed reading his answers as a company rep.

Now I wish I could get someone to repair as he described in the explaination above. I am not a repair men. And my arms are not long enough to reach the area inside the hull to do what he has suggested.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 9:13 am 
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So..... down it is. Just don't forget to raise the rudder before you launch like someone I know :oops:


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 12:09 pm 
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Just playing devil's advocate here, but if there is no documentation on how to store the rudder in the manuals, then it seems to me this should be covered under warranty, assuming the boat is still within the warranty period. How can it be user-induced if Hobie did not provide the user with the knowledge to avoid this situation?

I have had zero issues with either of my Hobie kayaks, but if I had the issue that the OP had, I would most definitely not be anywhere close to as calm as he is regarding this situation. Just my two cents. I have to go lower my rudder now...:)


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 2:35 pm 
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Guess we also need to lower the rudder when transporting. A Pro Angler on a trailer banging down the road would surely put additional stress on the rudder system if it was in the raised position :?:


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2014 5:53 am 
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islandspeed2001 wrote:
Guess we also need to lower the rudder when transporting. A Pro Angler on a trailer banging down the road would surely put additional stress on the rudder system if it was in the raised position :?:


That is what I plan to do to keep the tension from continuing to pull the hole open even more. I have a trailer and it will be high enough to keep the tip of the rudder from hitting the road. So well, live and learn.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2014 9:22 am 
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I lowered mine yesterday and will keep them that way when on the trailer. I have to remember to put them up when launching if I don't back the trailer in the water now.

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2013 Pro Angler 14 - Dune
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2014 7:34 am 
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I have received great service from Matt and Brendan at the national service center. i wanted to let everyone who had read this post to know what I found out from the best of the best in service.

Here is Brendan response to my request:

Ed,

I’ll send you the parts. For warranty, we either repair or replace depending on what is necessary. This sort of cracking doesn’t require replacement, so we are able to cover the repair. If you’re able to take it to ACK, they are probably capable of doing this for you, but I’d check first. I can cover their work if they do it for you. You would need to arrange with them for a time to have this done.

This wall is unavoidably thin just because of the way the kayaks are made. The plastic flows towards the outsides more and will tend to collect in corners and in the contours more. We can control it some with heat and heat deflection, but there are limits, so this doesn’t seem to be a defective kayak.

Brendan

You can see Hobie will stand behind their product 100 percent. The rip or hole was not below the water line and so they are willing to pay for repairs and send me the repairs parts. This is more then I had expected when the process began. ACK was my dealer and they helped as far as they could then help me to take the next step to get the national folks review my problem.

The only thing left unresolved is the Hobie Manual. When It comes out the next time, it may or should have the tension cord info to outline what the owner should do when stored for long periods of time.

Good Luck and in this case NOT TIGHT LINES.... Loosen those pull cords in storage!!!!


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 08, 2014 8:50 am 
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Can some one post a picture of the damage prone area or where I should look? I've had my PA14 for a few years and always have the rudder up unless actually in motion.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 08, 2014 1:47 pm 
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eatfishpaddle wrote:
Can some one post a picture of the damage prone area or where I should look? I've had my PA14 for a few years and always have the rudder up unless actually in motion.


I can not post pictures on this site, but here is a description of the area.

When you sit down in the PA 14 and look at the pull cord side of the yak. Right below the black board on the rail you will see a silver screw. If there is a rip/hole there that is where the pull pulley is located inside the hull. It will start with a crack in the hull and then open up to a rip as the time goes on. If you will give me an email address I will send pict to you via email tomorrow morning.

Good Luck


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 08, 2014 9:19 pm 
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Sounds like a fender washer under the head of the screw would solve the issue??
On my PA-14 there are 2 machine screws 1" on center apart...I assume this is the area your failure occurred....yes?

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