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 Post subject: Mast collar slipped
PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 4:19 pm 
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Location: AUS: Sydney midweek - Murrumbateman weekends
On return from my twilight sail in 10 Feb the furling ring and mast collar appeared to be out of place. I was sure that I had seated the mast before I set off. The reason things didn't look right was because the loading on the sail had caused the adhesive on the collar to released allowing the collar to slide up approx 40mm.
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How can I best fix this?


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 Post subject: Re: Mast collar slipped
PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 4:39 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 27, 2003 12:44 pm
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Location: Oceanside, California
There have been a couple threads on this:

http://www.hobiecat.com/community/viewtopic.php?f=75&t=13068&p=73301&hilit=mast+collar#p73301

Quote:
G'Day Mike,
I experienced a similar problem which was fixed by my dealer using Spabond epoxy.
More info on this problem here:
http://www.hobiecat.com/community/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=8017&p=52120
http://www.hobiecat.com/community/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=11497


Basic answer is that the collar is glued on and can be re-glued.

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Hobie Cat USA


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 Post subject: Re: Mast collar slipped
PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 8:48 pm 
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Location: AUS: Sydney midweek - Murrumbateman weekends
Thanks Matt, sorry I started a new thread unnecessarily - I obviously did't put enough effort in searching the forum.

Det


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 Post subject: Re: Mast collar slipped
PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2010 6:51 pm 
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Location: AUS: Sydney midweek - Murrumbateman weekends
Repair successful.

Process followed:
1. Chipped off old epoxy with chisel and then rasp. Cleaned with water and dish washing detergent.
2. Cleaned epoxy out of inside of furling reel with 1/4" chisel, roughed up with edge of rasp (diagonally across grooves). Final clean with water and dishwashing detergent.
3. After allowing 2 hours to dry wiped down with clean rag damp with methylated spirits and left to dry for 2 hrs.
4. Prepared epoxy (2 teaspoons, 1 each of base and hardener) and mixed in approx 2 teaspoons of fibre glass powder filler until consistency of warm butter.
5. Marked bottom location of furling reel on mast with pvc tape.
6. Applied epoxy mix to area of mast over which the furling reel sits on mast mast with icy pole stick.
7. Slid furling reel down epoxied mast, feeding displaced epoxy between mast and furling reel until reel reached tape marker. Then pushed the reel down another 2mm and applied a small bead (~2mm) around interface between top af reel and mast. Then pushed the reel back up to align with tape marker.
8. Removed excess epoxy from bottom of reel then cleaned up bottom of furling reel with rag dipped in hot water. Dried with rag and applied duct tape to bottom of reel and mast to stop reel from slipping.
9. Placed the mast upright for epoxy to cure.
10. Installed the mast on the boat 3 days later for test run - so far so good.

I am expecting the 2mm bead of epoxy around the top of the reel to help stop it slipping up.


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 Post subject: Re: Mast collar slipped
PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2010 10:44 pm 
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Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2009 5:57 am
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Location: Perth, Australia
cheers for the instructions might come in handy if this happens to any of us.

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 Post subject: Re: Mast collar slipped
PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 4:38 am 
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Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2007 4:07 am
Posts: 598
Location: Punta Gorda, FL
I did not notice any problems with my boat the last time I was out, but apparently there was one!

I had the sleeves off the masts because they got wet the other day, and noticed that the furling drum on my mast had slipped about 2" up. I checked my wife's mast, and it is still secure. Thanks, okz00k, for the detailed repair description. I will use West System epoxy because that is what I have on hand, and will post pix of the process.

Question for Matt and the group: would it be a good idea to wrap the mast above and/or below the furling drum with a single wrap of fiberglass cloth soaked in epoxy?

20 knots of wind out of the west today, and the harbor temperature is in the upper 70's, so going through waves is fun again. Gotta get my boat fixed! :mrgreen:


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 Post subject: Re: Mast collar slipped
PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 8:40 am 
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Location: Oceanside, California
If the drum were to slip again... you would not be able to reposition it and re-glue. Just do a good job with the epoxy and should be good to go.

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Hobie Cat USA


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 Post subject: Re: Mast collar slipped
PostPosted: Sat May 01, 2010 3:07 am 
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Location: Punta Gorda, FL
Thanks, Matt. That's pretty much exactly what a friend who builds CF masts told me.

Now another question occurs:

Why is there a metal pin in the base of the mast at the top of this thread? The only answer I can come up with is NOT GOOD, but it doesn't look like a broken off pin.


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 Post subject: Re: Mast collar slipped
PostPosted: Sat May 01, 2010 11:21 am 
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Location: Canyon Lake, Tx
Tom Ray,
Same thing happened to mine...I epoxied and then put a stainless hose clamp above the furling drum to keep it from slipping up again if the epoxy fails

Ron

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"Anything's gonna happen,
it's gonna happen out there"


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 Post subject: Re: Mast collar slipped
PostPosted: Sat May 01, 2010 3:02 pm 
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Location: Central Coast NSW Australia
Tom Ray wrote:
Why is there a metal pin in the base of the mast at the top of this thread? The only answer I can come up with is NOT GOOD, but it doesn't look like a broken off pin.

Tom,
That's the original V1 mast design. The pin fits into a hole in the bottom of the mast holder. It was re-designed in 08(?) because of problems with sand filling up the hole, making mast insertion difficult. :)


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 Post subject: Re: Mast collar slipped
PostPosted: Mon May 03, 2010 3:35 am 
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Location: Punta Gorda, FL
Thanks, Stringy. I can see how that design would be a problem! Further proof of my theory that the first thing that should happen to any prototype boat is that it should be covered with salt and sand, then the designers should have to clean it and leave it totally dry. I mean with no little puddles anywhere. Dry. /rant

I epoxied my furler to my mast last night. Pics to follow.

I had seen the hose clamp solution, and thanks for bringing that up. I will probably do it to mine. I was thinking of cutting an old bike inner tube to pad the hose clamp and give it extra grip.

The thing about the hose clamp is, while it will keep the furler from riding up the mast, but will do nothing to make it turn if the epoxy slips. In other words, suppose my epoxy fails when I am trying to furl in a strong breeze, and all that happens is the drum rotates, but I still have full sail?

That's exactly what my wife is worried about. Hers has not failed, but what if it fails in a bad way, at a bad moment? Should I break it and fix it? One of my main boating mottoes for many decades has been, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it!" Do I violate that rule?

Speaking of failure modes, it looked to me like the glue broke on mine. The epoxy was still firmly bonded to the mast and to the drum. It was kind of a pain to get it off!


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 Post subject: Re: Mast collar slipped
PostPosted: Mon May 03, 2010 5:07 am 
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Location: Central Coast NSW Australia
Tom Ray wrote:
In other words, suppose my epoxy fails when I am trying to furl in a strong breeze, and all that happens is the drum rotates, but I still have full sail?

When my drum failed, the ridges of epoxy still stuck to the mast prevented the drum from spinning. All the pics I have seen have those similar ridges so I'd be surprised if the drum would spin freely. If it did I guess you would have to unsheet and furl the sail by hand-turning the mast. :)


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 Post subject: Re: Mast collar slipped
PostPosted: Mon May 03, 2010 6:18 am 
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Location: Punta Gorda, FL
Yes, mine was pretty firmly stuck to the ridges, and I actually had to tap it with a piece of wood to get it the rest of the way free. As I said above, I did not even notice the problem when sailing, though I assume that's when it happened.

Image

The thing is, I removed those ridges from the mast, plugged the bottom, and injected liquid epoxy to fill the entire void between furler and mast:

Image

So there are no more ridges. Good news is, the ridges are what broke in the first place. The bad news is, they served as an emergency brake, now I have none.


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 Post subject: Re: Mast collar slipped
PostPosted: Mon May 03, 2010 6:48 am 
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Location: Canyon Lake, Tx
Would it be possible to use a stainless rivet with the epoxy to hold the drum to the mast?...if you look at the Hobie Bravo images it looks like they used rivets...

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"Anything's gonna happen,
it's gonna happen out there"


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 Post subject: Re: Mast collar slipped
PostPosted: Mon May 03, 2010 9:17 am 
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When I had to re-epoxy one of mine, I added a bead of epoxy where the mast meets top and bottom of the drum (or collar). One of the new masts came in without much "glue" showing (a gap at the top), so I also added the bead of epoxy to it too. I have not had another problem with any of them.

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