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 Post subject: Tiller Crossbar
PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 3:29 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jan 08, 2006 1:20 pm
Posts: 407
Location: West Maui
I'm getting a brand new 20 ready for it's first time in the water. I found the hole in the tiller crossbar for the tiller extension is drilled about three inches offset of center. Is this correct or is it a manufacturing error and the tiller crossbar needs to be replaced?

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 9:59 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jul 02, 2005 9:47 pm
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Location: San Diego
Total defect, send the whole boat back. The weight difference will really cause this weight sensitive boat to list! :)

Did you really take the time to measure where the tiller yoke hole was drilled? :?

Did you measure the rudder tow, rudder rake, rudder cam spring load, the mast rake, the diamond wire load, the amount of prebend, the spreader rake, positive mast rotator load (both forward and loading on bows), Downhaul, outhaul, camcleat springs... ...wet sand the hulls, rudders, boards?

This tiller has an adjustment on one end. Maybe the hole was drilled in the center of the aluminum part. This may not be centered, and may not be perfect, but I wouldn't return it unless it is hanging up on the mainsheet while sailing.


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 Post subject: off center
PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 10:20 am 
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Location: Oceanside, California
Mike has it right. There is a long adjustment screw in one end of the tiller crossbar. How "centered" the yoke hole is depends on the adjustment of this end fitting. Even if off center, the yoke location will have no effect on the sailing.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 9:02 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jul 31, 2005 4:43 pm
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Location: Tulsa Oklahoma
with the boat assembled with the rudders on and tracking with very little toe-in the tiller attatchment will almost be centered. :lol:

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 Post subject: Tiller Crossbar
PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2006 8:34 pm 
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Location: West Maui
So far, I've gotten three answers to my question. One from a factory employee saying there's no problem, one from an owner who gives a clear, concise description of his measurements and one from dope in San Diego that feels happy faces, useless rhetoric, and senseless clap trap suffice for an answer to a problem.

I did some additional research and have determined that the hole for the tiller extension yoke is drilled in the proper position. The offset problem is caused by the port (adjustable) and the starboard (non-adjustable) ends being swapped causing the three-inch offset. This one must have been put together late Friday.

I’d swap the two end pieces but the starboard (non-adjustable) end is pop riveted into plastic and I’m afraid I’d ruin it.

Matt Miller, can you let me know how to contact you so I can get a replacement piece for the starboard (non-adjustable) end? It would be much easier than shipping a replacement tiller crossbar.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 10:24 am 
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Location: St. Louis, MO
Play nice. Everyone who replied gave you valid answers. The Hobie community is full of very knowledgeable, friendly, and helpful people.

Here are a few things to think about.

1) It doesn't matter if the hole is in the center of the tiller crossbar. It will work the same from both sides of the boat. Heck, you don't even need a tiller extender to steer. Just grab onto the cross bar.

2) Why don't you just turn the tiller cross bar 180 degrees. That way the port end will become the starboard end and vise-versa.

It sounds like you did your research late on a Friday. You are right to be worried about using tools. It's probably best you stay away from them, lest you hurt yourself.

While trying to be a smart a$$ don't act like a dumb one.

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 Post subject: Off Center?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 10:36 am 
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Location: Oceanside, California
Ok... we need to review what is off center.

I just accessed the plan for the Hobie 20 tiller crossbar. The hole for the yoke is supposed to be centered in the aluminum extrusion. The plan shows that the end connectors are equal distance from the yoke when threaded in all the way. If extension is required... the yoke starts to be off center (related to the end connectors) until maximum adjustment is made in the end fitting. The difference can get close to 3".

If the tiller yoke is off center in the aluminum... we should probably replace the tiller crossbar.

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 Post subject: Tiller Crossbar
PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 11:12 am 
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Location: West Maui
Just talked to Matt Miller to review measurements. Matt determined that the tiller crossbar was drilled incorrectly and will ship a replacement. Hobie does stand behind their products and will take care of issues.

Hobie Nick, it does matter if the yoke is three inches off center. If the traveler is centered and the skipper is forward on a port tack, the tiller extension will contact the main block.

If the tiller crossbar was flipped 180 degrees, the problem would shift to the starboard side.

Until you made the crack about tool use your responses were well reasoned. Why did you close with a dumba$$ remark?

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 11:44 am 
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Location: St. Louis, MO
Sorry about that. I hate when people start to tear into someone on the board without provcation. When you made the San Diego Dope remark it kind of set me off. I apologize. I should have acted more maturely.

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Nick

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'84 H16
'82 H18 Magnum
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 Post subject: Tiller Crossbar
PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 12:36 pm 
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Location: West Maui
Apology accepted. My remarks about our San Diego correspondent were out of frustration. I asked what I thought was a straight forward question about a possible problem and got a response that went well beyond reasoned and reasonable comments on the issue.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2006 12:47 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jul 02, 2005 9:47 pm
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Location: San Diego
Maybe, once you get on the water, you will loose some of that anger and move closer to the middle of drums and a little further from death.

By the way, it's birth, 8kts, 10kts, 25kts and happy happy joy joy...

If done right, there is no end (death), just a new generation of happy sailors.

I would use more happy faces and the like here, but for some reason the happy faces really bother you. I wouldn't want to do that since my last attempt at humor hit you like a brick instead of making you see humor in what I saw. I used the happy faces before, because I really had a chuckle picturing someone measuring the tiller crossbar and taking time during the middle of the day, to post about it instead of sailing.

I would have drilled a new hole and gone sailing.

the "dope" in San Diego.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 9:14 am 
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Joined: Tue May 27, 2003 3:16 pm
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Location: San Diego
:D I like your smilies Hammond :wink: keep em coming :P

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 9:57 am 
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Location: Clear Lake Iowa
I would have drilled a new hole too. What a black cloud that hangs over this thread. Too much :evil: and not enough :D


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 12:11 pm 
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Location: San Diego
Maybe there was no drill available, or duct tape. There isn't much that a good hammer and a roll of duct tape can't fix.

By the way, I put together a really neat/cheap spinnaker launcher for the New Years Day Race. Stainless steel trash can (bed bath and beyond), swimming pool hose clamps (home Depot), home made nylon sock (cool looking, semi functional, more on this) attached with duct tape (white, it looks more nautical), an old windsurfing mast (Aluminum, blue anodized, didn't really match the sail, but my niece thinks it is a nice blue), windsurfing mast base and extention, and assorted line and Harken rigging(several hundred dollars in ratchet blocks), and a borrowed tiger spinnaker. I took the ratings hit, and the wind shifted big all day long so I never took the sail out of the sock during the race. It did see the light of day on the way to the start, but once retrieved, there it stayed.

What I learned;
1-buy a proper launcher, it's cheaper and will save you time
2-Little girls (my niece and her friend) can not launch the chute, but can steer the boat while I launch and fly the chute-although this can be exciting once the chute is up and pulling hard. (sheet out the main and pull on the tiller!! OK, less pulling on the tiller, point towards that building...) As long as you don't capsize, the "crew" will think it is really fun.
3-The spinnaker sock should be made of non-stretch material like dacron sail cloth, not elastic nylon. This prevents the "swelling" of the sock past the hard portion of the retriever when filled with the kite. The swelling is what causes the spinnaker to be difficult to relaunch. This is why the hard tube launchers work better than most sock type launchers.

By the way, triple trap in gusty conditions is very fun, especially when you go from sheeting out, to teabagging, to sheeting out again. SDYC's race comitee hooted and hollered for us as we finished flying a hull with three on the wire.


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