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PostPosted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 1:53 pm 
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Location: Long Island NY
Quote:
Do you know the wind speed ?


I'd say mid 20's mph

Quote:
reckon at 30 knots tacking would almost be a backwards step


I would say, it all depends on the water condition as tacking and making foward progress upwind, depends on being able to hold a point. With the chop the way it was, that was almost impossible. I had to run very close to the point of the sail luffing to make upwind progress which slows your speed considerably ... and not being able to hold a point makes it even worse.

I'd say that it took about 15 tacks running at least a half mile in each direction to make it 3/4 mile upwind although more than a few of those runs were a good ways off max foward progress tack line to optimize speed and fly !

Quote:
Now I'm green with envy Alan. My 'better half' convinced me it wasn't the best idea to tempt Earl in our TI. I should have listened to the little red guy on my shoulder! Looks like fun!!


Funny bit here - I was disgnosed with walking pneumonia the monday before, was on 2 different antibiotics, home from work on rest orders from the Dr ... and to top it off, my wife is nurse ! I went to for a follow-up to the Dr. on Fri and she said I was doing wonderfully - I asked her if she would give me clearence to sail the next day and when she said yes, I had her write me a prescription as I KNEW my wife wasn't going to allow it :lol: should have seen wifes' kisser when I wipped out the Dr's orders to "go play, be outdoors, and even sail ... just be a boy"

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Any guide for a newbie on when to reef and how much?

What about downwind also??? Reef as well?

Has anyone been crazy enough not to reef in 20 plus knots?? If so what was the result?


basically what I've found (and I'm a may 2010 newbie myself) is that when you've got too much sail out you loose rudder effectiveness and the boat turns into the wind despite how much opposite rudder you try to give it - all the way to full.

This is when less is more - and I read it on the forums but didn't believe it or try furling until about the 6th or 7th time out in winds over 15-17 mph. I was fighting and fighting, and not able to hold a point nor able to give enough opposite rudder to keep from pointning further into the wind ... and then I remembered reading " REEF THE SAIL !!"

It works, AND you go faster. You can now hold a point and make effective tacks to gain upwind position. Also, rudder pressure on the handle is greatly reduced.

How much ? there is no set rule - its a trim change that will vary, but, for starters bring it in to where the first (highest) stay is about to wrap around the mast. If rudder control is still sluggish, take in another round or two.

You'll know when you find the sweet spot as you'll be flying - prolly faster than with full sail - and you'll have regained full control, which is indeed a good thing.

I do have a Q. for the resident experts though - at least 3 times I heard some wicked creaking / almost a popping from what I thought was the front X-bar either at its anchor pts or the aka attachment points ? I've got a bit of egging out of the pin holes as my boat is a well used '07 ... upon inspection I dont see anything new ? checked the x-bar attachment pts, mast cup, and a few other places with nothing screaming "Fix ME !!" ... except the rudder pin

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Alan W.
'07 Hobie Adventure Island #1
'07 Hobie Adventure Island #2 Golden Papaya AI LadyJane
'06? Hobie Outback SUV


Last edited by PassWind on Wed Aug 08, 2012 7:13 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 2:17 pm 
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Location: Brisbane, AUSTRALIA
Thanks for advice Allan.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 3:11 pm 
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Location: Saint Johns, Florida
My advice is to reef as soon as there is enough wind to cause you to think about it. Sailing on the edge is a rush but if you're new at it you can get in trouble and then it's a lot harder to reef.

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Jerry D.
St. Johns, Florida
2010 TI
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 6:05 pm 
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Location: Maui, Hawaii
Check the 4 screws in the bottom of the mast cup, if yours is a newer model with them, I'll bet some are loose or gone. That could be the sound you were hearing, the mast base shifting that bracket about.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 6:49 pm 
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Location: Fair Haven, New Jersey
RE: I would say, it all depends on the water condition as tacking, or making forward progress upwind, depends on being able to hold a point. With the chop the way it was, that was almost impossible.

I am still sore from sailing my TI in Sandy Hook Bay on Saturday in the after effects of Earl.

When I first set sail the winds were 15+ knots gusting to 20. I had some adventures and mishaps sailing in those winds (too much now to detail considering the point of this post.)

My point: When I tried to get back to my point of embarkation I found myself in some difficulty, I could not tack into the wind. I could not make headway getting back to the beach.

By now the winds picked up, the waves were rolling, lifting the TI out of the water. My sail was reefed, the mast was bending in he wind, but I could not make any headway. (At one point there were rocks behind me, with waves crashing into the shore, and my TI was slowly drifting backwards.)


To get out of this mess I almost had to sit above the rudder, and took a beam reach getting me way out from shore. I was out nearly two miles in turbulent water and wind, until the beach where I launched was a little past perpendicular; this is when I made a starboard turn around and headed for shore on another beam reach ( I had difficulty turning to port throughout the day).

When I finally landed at the beach of the Catamaran club where I keep my TI, I calmly disembarked giving the impression that I was just landing after another causal sail.

The truth is that I was all too happy to be on dry land; I am thankful for the experience, I remain impressed with the seaworthiness of the TI, but it will be some time (if ever) if I go out in those conditions.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 7:13 pm 
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Location: Maui, Hawaii
I haven't been out enough in my TI to tell yet, but in the AI here in Maui...

at 25mph winds it's difficult to get the nose across the wind to change tack

at 30mph I can make no sailing headway, even talking a couple if miles out and back, no gain.

The other big problem, is ANY goof, or a few seconds of inattention, is lost ground, difficult to make up.

I would think in the TI, those numbers might be a little bit higher, but similar.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 5:07 am 
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Location: Port Macquarie, Australia
That's interesting Bob. I'm having a ball on rivers in 25 knots, but I better make sure I don't get too cocky in those wind strengths offshore... quite a different matter! Once you can't make headway upwind... :shock:

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 30, 2010 5:02 am 
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Location: Weymouth, Dorset.UK
Hello there,
If I may add my twopence worth? If you raise your hand and push the sail shape from the old windward side as you go through the eye of the wind, you will tack easily every time.

Similar idea to backing a sail on a dinghy, it pushes the nose of the AI through the eye of the wind and works from light winds upwards, everytime. 8) and smooth use of the rudder will aid good tacking, slamming it full over straightaway, will only put the brakes on.

I have noticed that when going upwind, sheeting in hard (stiffens up the leech and helps windward ability) till the sail is nearly flat makes the AI sail very close to the wind and after tacking it will sail at the same angle but no lower, to sail at a lower angle you need to sheet out to relieve the pressure, probably caused by the long slim hull and the centre of pressure. Of course, to sail at such a high angle and still be powered up, you need as much sail as possible. Always the old argument-pointing versus speed!

Have fun.


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