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PostPosted: Sat Oct 02, 2010 5:49 pm 
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Bob, I just came from the Hobie shop and saw a stainless version of that same lynch pin on the new HD cart. Are you due some royalties here? :wink:

I should point out that my carts are the older Trax models with EZ-on balloon wheels. It has the axle with the steel groove ends and no existing holes. It does not have the open tube axle w/ 2 holes found on the latest version (Trax 2?)

Thinking about it, the older axles appear to be solid or at least thicker-walled than the new HD cart. Can anyone confirm this?

Hope I have the right model information here. The cotter clip advice still applies.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2010 4:24 am 
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NOHUHU wrote:
Thinking about it, the older axles appear to be solid or at least thicker-walled than the new HD cart. Can anyone confirm this?


Nohuhu,
As far as I'm aware the Trax1 and 2 carts (with the balloon tyres) have solid 1/2" bar axles with a groove at the end. The HD cart and standard cart share basically the same frame and both have a 1/2" tube axle with a hole at the end.
The HD cart is only HD as far as the wheels go. The pneumatic wheels have a higher capacity rating. To make the pneumatic wheels fit the 1/2" axle a thick walled aluminium tube hub sleeve is slipped over the 1/2" tube.
More info here:
viewtopic.php?f=69&t=21856


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2010 4:21 pm 
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Unless I'm mistaken my previous Trax2 cart had a wider profile (axle) than the HD cart. It's a shame as the wider cart makes for a far more stable pulling platform when pulling over large rocks and/or uneven ground which can be quite precarious with the narrow frame of the HD. Therefore I'm wishing I would have kept my Trax2 cart and simply modified it to fit the HD wheels. Oh well! :roll:

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2010 4:30 pm 
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The HD cart is just a Trax2 cart with the heavy-duty rubber wheel tires.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2010 7:42 pm 
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I'm with ReefWraith on this.
I think you'll find Bob that the HD cart is just the standard cart frame fitted with the pneumatic wheels. In the above post I linked to Matt seems to confirm this.
Well... at least it was at the start of this year when I checked out the carts thoroughly at my dealer. The HD cart definitely had a hollow tube axle same as the standard cart. The Trax has a much wider solid axle.
I can't confirm this now though as our local dealer has shut up shop. :(
I ended up with the Trax2 and put HD wheels on it. Best of both worlds! :wink:


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2010 6:25 am 
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Maybe it changed, or my dealer did it, but I bought both the Trax2 and the new HD and they have the same frame, just the inserts and HD wheels added. I have one of each cart except the original with the hard plastic wheels, and pick and choose depending on the days plan, or if all the boats are going out then I need to use them all.

I prefer the rubber tires except in sand, but also prefer the older frame for the AI's so it will fit in the front hatch, and a slightly trimmed Trax2 frame for the TI.

I have been having problems with the HD tire tubes leaking. I think the stems are hitting something when rolling and causes it to fail at the base of the stems.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2010 9:10 pm 
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I think Stringy has it right. It's enuff to drive you nuts, but I'll take a crack at this:

TRAX carts are made by Wheeleez for Hobie and have the scupper "Plugin" design made to fit Hobie hulls, but are OK for many other brands as well. (I use them with Feel Free kayak models).

STANDARD HOBIE CART
Image

HOBIE TRAX CART (Retired)
Came in a narrow Image and a wide model Image
Each had slightly different Twist-lock PVC tires. I own both types. The wheels are interchangeable.
The wide version came with post collars. There is no "cart keeper" pin on the narrow model.

HOBIE TRAX "2" CART
Larger, polyurethane twist-lock tires. Cart rated at 176lbs. Still features a 1/2" stainless steel solid axle.
Image

HOBIE HD CART
Designed for the TI. Foam filled rubber tires rated at 200lbs per. Tubular 1/2" axle, with 2 sets of holes for lynch pins. Does not take twist-lock inflatable tires.
Image

HOBIE HD CONVERSION KIT
Fits standard cart only and allows you to upgrade to the HD wheels. Not compatible with the TRAX carts. Except with Stringy's clever mods. http://www.hobiecat.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=69&t=21856
Image

If I have this right, the TRAX models have a solid axle w/ notched end Image
The HD model has a tubular (hollow) axle requiring pins. Image

And I now have a headache,..

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 11:14 am 
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It depends:
Just how soft is your sand?


The sugar white sand in the Florida panhandle (Destin area) is some of the "softest" sand you'll find in the world. Certainly softer than anything I will ever have to cart a kayak across. (The sand is comprised mainly of quartz - each grain of sand ground to an oval.)

To pull only my AI across soft dry sand, I wound up buying a Wheeleez cart that uses their 30cm tires (lynch pins secure them to the cart).

Image

It's not a plug-in (it straps down the hull instead) because I tend to worry a bit about the stress the scupper holes would endure over a long period of time. It was quite a tug, even with those larger 30cm wheels. With the recent posts about some owners getting cracks originating around the bow's handle screws, I now will worry about the increased chance of stress cracks caused by lugging my AIs across our soft sand. (I doubt I will ever attempt taking my TI across the soft sand in my section of Florida, but will stick to ramps and "hard" sand launches.)

And it's not that I haven't bought just about every Hobie cart they've ever offered. ...with the standard frame, and the wider base. ...with the twist locks and the cotter pin retainers. ...with the hard wheels and the pneumatic. ...fat tires, and even fatter tires.

Really, really soft sand is just plain brutal, IMHO, if you're going to use a cart to haul the AI or TI. I've wondered, though, about adapting my Hobie Wave's Cat Trax to accommodate an AI or TI... Hmmmm...

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 4:31 pm 
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Nohuhu,
Thanks for that definitive cart report! :shock: I agree with your findings. :wink:
I didn't know about the foam filled tyres. I thought the HD wheels were all pneumatic?

toomanyboats,
I wheel my AI (as an Adventure) 8kms a week and have done so for almost 3 years. For a year before that I did the same with an Oasis. After many hundreds of kms I have had zero scupper tube or handle padeye problems. My route is along a road, a footpath and rough grass/dirt. I have to negotiate two very steep and long driveways where I am pulling very hard just to get the kayak moving. I have added an extra bow handle which helps.
I think that in most cases the scupper and padeye problems are like the cracked hulls -material defects caused by the imprecise roto molding process.
Handling misadventures probably account for the rest.
If the cart is properly inserted (all the way through) and supports the hull evenly (using balls) then the scuppers are the strongest part of the hull and the best way to transport the kayak. I have an under hull cart as well but it does distort the hull and moves around a bit. I don't like using it long distances.
The scupper cart is definitely my prefered cart. :)


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 7:18 pm 
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You are probably right there too Stringy.

The Austin dealer's site lists them as foam that will never go flat (tuff tire) but their own review and pictures suggest the pnuematic rubber version. Pictures and descriptions so far are pretty crappy.

Time for Matt to weigh in. This is not helping my headache. :cry:


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 8:39 pm 
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And of course you are. :)

Matt had previously indicated these HD wheels have inflatable tubes, so they do not appear to be the Wheeleez Tuff Tire (filled with foam).

According to him, both the HD cart and the HD upgrade kit use tubes.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 8:13 pm 
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Hmmm.... while I hate to add to your headache NOHUHU, I just received my new replacement HD cart courtesy of my local dealer. I'm happy to report it was the new wider base, and the new lynch pins (instead of the less than reliable cotter/clip pin). However, it also has tires made by wheeleez that clearly state "foam filled 700gr." Therefore it appears as though Austin Kayak (and you) were right on this one... at least for the new carts! :wink:

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 9:31 pm 
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Hmmm......now I'm getting a headache! :wink:
Is the axle solid or tube, ReefWraith?


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 6:46 am 
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stringy wrote:
Hmmm......now I'm getting a headache! :wink:
Is the axle solid or tube, ReefWraith?



Sorry for the cerebral pain Stringy! :wink: The axel is the smaller solid version, not the larger tube. This was a cart just received from Hobie this week. Perhaps they have changed a few things (again) with their carts? All I know it that I'm thrilled with the new lynch pins! This will make water removal and insertion of the cart MUCH easier! :lol:

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 1:26 pm 
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Thanks for that info ReefWraith. 8)
Any chance of a pic of how the wheel is secured to the axle?
I take it that a hole has been drilled through the solid bar, that the end isn't grooved and that the wheel has a 1/2" hub that doesn't require a reducing spacer? :roll:


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