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 Post subject: Mast rake question
PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2011 1:28 am 
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Joined: Fri Jul 08, 2011 1:03 am
Posts: 3
First off, let me begin by saying that a new sailor.

I bought a used Hobie Wave to learn on that doesn't have the seven hole adjusters to connect the shrouds to. It has two hooks that close on each other and then a boot slides down to keep the hooks closed.

Image

Note: I couldn't get the image to embed of my shroud hooks but here's a link to what it looks like in flickr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/16424675@N ... otostream/

I recently ordered some parts from murrays.com and they talked me into ordering some 7 hole adjusters. Now that they are here, I realize that adding them will change the mast rake forward.

I have no idea what the mast rake on this boat should actually be or how to set it properly. My understanding is that it's preferable to have the mast rake set slightly aft so there is slight weather helm.

It seems to me that the only way to use these 7 hole adjusters would be to get shorter shrouds.

I would appreciate any advice on how to set get the proper mast rake for a beginning sailor with this boat.


Last edited by quiethorse on Fri Jul 08, 2011 1:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Mast rake question
PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2011 10:17 am 
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Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2010 8:15 am
Posts: 500
Location: Saint John, NB Canada sailing on Washademoak Lake
What was the reason to get the 7 hole adjuster in the 1st place? What problem were you trying to solve?

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1978 Hobie 16 Keoke, sail# 36 84
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 Post subject: Re: Mast rake question
PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2011 1:14 pm 
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I needed to order a rudder cam kit and one of the bridle snap hooks was broken. The salesman at murrays.com said that the new waves have 7 hole adjusters and they are nice to have.

Then when the got here I realized that adding them will lengthen the overall length of the shroud.


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 Post subject: Re: Mast rake question
PostPosted: Sat Jul 09, 2011 5:05 am 
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Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2007 7:58 pm
Posts: 428
Location: Indianapolis, IN
It sounds like what you have there is a Classic or SE Wave, whereas the adjusters are part of a Club Wave. I think you would have to swap out the shrouds to the shorter Club style to use the adjusters.

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 Post subject: Re: Mast rake question
PostPosted: Sat Jul 09, 2011 7:22 pm 
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Joined: Sun Mar 16, 2008 10:46 pm
Posts: 466
Have no experience with adjusting rake on Classic. With a quick read of manual (online under Wave FAQ), it is different from the Club setup. Also, if you google Hobie Wire Guide, you can compare shroud, forestay, and bridle lengths between the two models.

Mast rake is what I call one of those "spin zone" topic of discussions -- everybody's got a spin. Basically (that is, at the very least and no super-fine tuning involved), you rake back when the wind is up to keep the bow up. But the more you rake back, the tougher it is to quickly come about. I have raked way back in heavy winds and did not like that lack of responsiveness when coming about. So I set the mast back up to 7. My weight is 230 though. The wind and your weight factor into forestay setting.

Some say to rake back as much as you can in order to give the rudders more bite so that they act like centerboards. Isn't there a guide published somewhere on this? I can't remember where I have seen it...


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 Post subject: Re: Mast rake question
PostPosted: Sat Jul 09, 2011 9:33 pm 
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What does "mast back up to 7 mean". I've read about why people adjust the rake of their mast. I'm looking for some king of guideline to help a beginner sailor know how to go about adjusting this properly for different conditions. I don't know if such a thing exists but it would be helpful if I could find tips on rigging the boat.


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 Post subject: Re: Mast rake question
PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2011 5:07 pm 
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Quote:
What does "mast back up to 7 mean".
I had put a 12-hole adjuster on my Club Wave and I had the mast raked back to the tenth hole from the bottom for a windy day of sailing. But, I did not like the slow tacking ability that was the result of having the mast raked back to the tenth hole. So, the thimble went back to the seventh hole, making the mast raked back less. (The pic at the top of page 9 of the manual shows a 7-hole adjuster with the forestay pinned at the fifth hole.) Someone talked me into buying a 12-hole adjuster over the 7-hole.

There is no exact rule that I know of to pre-set for a particular day's sailing. You rake back for higher wind to keep the bows up so they don't submarine and you don't pitch pole. Because the more wind, the more the bows get pushed or driven down. Rake back too much, the bows are too high up out of the water and won't grip enough to tack quickly.

IMO, it is a matter of the balance that you like best after experimenting. Having the adjuster at the five hole is probably a good average place to start. Hopefully, others will chime in with some advice too...

BTW, since you have a Classic, I would talk to a Hobie dealer since he has better info about parts.


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 Post subject: Re: Mast rake question
PostPosted: Fri Sep 02, 2011 4:08 am 
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Joined: Thu Jul 03, 2008 11:18 pm
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Location: Slovenia
All three adjusters on my wave (1x forestay, 2x shrouds) are originally 10 hole adjusters. My current setup is 8th hole from the bottom on the forestay and third hole from the bottom on shrouds adjusters. On one of the race in the gulf of Pag island this summer I recorded the track with my GPS device. All the time I was sailing close hauled and pointed to the wind as much as possible. When I analysed the track afterthat I was really surprised how close to the wind I could sail. I could constantly sail 45 degrees upwind because my zigzag (tacking) was at perfect 90 degree angle. The sailing speed was around 6 knots. I did not have any problems to come about.

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 Post subject: Re: Mast rake question
PostPosted: Mon Sep 05, 2011 7:04 am 
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Joined: Sun Nov 04, 2007 7:58 am
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JJ wrote:
There is no exact rule that I know of to pre-set for a particular day's sailing. You rake back for higher wind to keep the bows up so they don't submarine and you don't pitch pole. Because the more wind, the more the bows get pushed or driven down. Rake back too much, the bows are too high up out of the water and won't grip enough to tack quickly.

IMO, it is a matter of the balance that you like best after experimenting. Having the adjuster at the five hole is probably a good average place to start. Hopefully, others will chime in with some advice too...


Conventional wisdom amognst racers is that you rake back until you can't fully tighten the mainsheet, and then go forward a hole or two. With a Hobie brand sail and a ten hole adjuster, I think you would be in the 9th or 10 hole.

At the same time, most of us have the shrouds very loose. This allows the sail to go farther forward downwind.

I personally have been experimenting with a little less rake, but can't seem to make up my mind what is best.

Experienced sailors don't have any trouble tacking with the rake fully back. However, you have to hit it exactly right every time. As JJ says, forward helps tacking.

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