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PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 11:12 am 
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damnfingers wrote:
So, if I were to get a Revo, why would I pick the 13 over the 11?


The Revo 13 should be faster (2ft longer, 1/2" narrower), has more capacity (350lb vs 300lb). I'm sure there's more to it, but those should be more than enough reasons for some people to get the Revo 13.

I'm currently shopping for either a Revo 11 or Revo 13 and would like to demo both. If they feel about the same or close enough, I'll go with the Revo 11, which is 30lbs lighter than my Oasis and that alone is a huge plus for me.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 12:12 pm 
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"I'll go with the Revo 11, which is 30lbs lighter than my Oasis and that alone is a huge plus for me."

Amen Brother! :mrgreen:

Lighter and shorter equals easier to handle, transport and store on land.

I guess that I'm just an old wimp, but our 2009 Oasis is a beast when it is out of the water.

My Freedom Hawk 12 even with its pontoons on, can be handled so much easier than our Oasis when it is out of the water.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 2:15 pm 
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damnfingers wrote:
So, if I were to get a Revo, why would I pick the 13 over the 11?
That's an excellent question. Each boat offers advantages, depending on one's circumstances, priorities and preferences. For the sake of comparison, let me include the Adventure. These three (Revo 11, Revo 13, Adventure) are in the same design family (similar tri-lobe hulls, with forward decks and larger bow hatches). Along with the tandem Oasis, they share certain common traits (opposed to the Outfitter, Outback, Sport group) -- good seaworthiness, quieter running, very good speed/range (for comparable length).

But each has its own distinct ride, feel and physical characteristics.

Revo 11: lightest, shortest -- easiest to carry, load, transport and store. Liveliest, most responsive handling. Most "fun" IMO. Some limitations on height and weight, less stable than the Revo 13, about .25 MPH slower cruising than the Revo 13.

Revo 13: Best all-around boat (pedaling, paddling, sailing) in one package. Best primary and secondary stability of the three. Highest load capacity (rated at 350# but can easily handle 400# IMO). In addition to weight, can take a taller person than the Revo 11. Better paddling and sailing than the Revo 11.

Adventure: Longest, fastest, smoothest riding, quietest, best in bad weather, best paddling, arguably the best sailer (has daggerboaed capability). Largest, longest cockpit of the three. Can be wettest riding, less stability than the Revo 13, largest turning radius, front hatch not easily accessible on the water. Length can be problematic for storage.

I don't really see much overlap between the three models. There was a void in the smaller, lighter segment that the Sport has been partially filling until now (especially after losing the Classic in 2007). The Revo 11 adds a great alternative for someone who desires or requires a smaller, lighter boat but wants good performance and capabilities. It's a lot of boat for its size! 8)

PS. Some users feel that they need the most stable platform possible and make their decision accordingly. Although the Hobies differ in comparative stability, all Hobie kayaks are very stable boats -- it's one of the first requirements the design engineers consider. So the descriptions here are for relative comparison only.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 31, 2011 8:30 am 
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Thanks Roadrunner...great response!


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 14, 2011 8:43 pm 
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Mary Skater wrote:
It would be good to see pictures of the Revo 11 with the SideKick kit fitted.

I know of someone with a Sport....I thought the best place for the Sidekicks would be behind the seat, closer to the centre of gravity of boat plus paddler. His reply to this was,
Quote:
On the Hobie Sport that I have, if you try to fit them aft of the seat, the fittings that hold them to the hull end up being in exactly the same spot as the buttons on the arms to adjust the position (high, mid, low).

...is there more flexibility in where you fit the Sidekicks than the Sport owner thinks?
Mary, here's a more definitive answer. A friend just installed the Sidekick on his Revo 11. As you can see here, there is no interference between the aka buttons and the cross bar mounting brackets (holes highlighted) when fitted behind the seat.
Image

As you can see, it works well:
Image
8)


Last edited by Roadrunner on Thu Oct 20, 2011 5:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 15, 2011 8:38 am 
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Thanks, Roadrunner, that's very informative.

I'm very keen on the Revo 11, for its light(ish) weight and suitability for my kind of paddling. I'm not in a position to get one now, but come summer of 2013, I think that will be on my shopping list.

Mary


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2011 1:52 pm 
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Just got my Revo 11! Awesome little boat. Perfect size! Lightweight! And look how good it looks on the roof of my car... I may leave it on there as a decoration. :lol:

Highly recommended.

Image

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2011 11:16 pm 
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Chexone wrote:
Just got my Revo 11! Awesome little boat


Congrats!! Wish my local dealer had them already...

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2011 3:49 pm 
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How would you compare the Revolution 11 to the Outback in terms of dryness in wind blown waves and boat wakes? Great review.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2011 1:06 am 
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Thanks Tex. I think this depends on direction. On the bow, the Revo 11 has a distinct advantage.

Against wind and chop, the Outback with it's blunt bow has a tendency to pound, sending spray in all directions while the wind carries it to the cockpit.
Image
Any water breaking over the concave foredeck is also funneled into the cockpit, although unless it carries a lot of velocity, this drops out harmlessly through the drivewell.

The Revo 11, with less tendency to pound, creates less spray and shoots it out the side more when it occurs.
Image

As wind and chop swing around off the bow, both kayaks can get splashy. On the beam, the slab sided Outback with its trays acting as additional buffers, probably has a small advantage.

Nosing into steep boat wakes, both kayaks can take water over the bow and into the cockpit -- more so with the Outback. On a beam wake, the Outback responds with more roll (due to its beamier, more stable hull) and therefore has less user control, but more freeboard for slightly better dryness if you don't fall out. Both boats are reasonably dry however -- overall, I'd say it's about even on wakes.

As to traveling through wind, chop and swell, the Revo 11 has the advantage in terms of performance and handling. It slows less, drifts less, turns better and retains better roll control. With weather situations where you can travel directly upwind the Revo 11 is definitely drier; in beam weather, you'll pick up spray in both boats, depending on weather severity. Both boats are pretty good regarding solid water coming over the side rail.

Hope this helps. 8)


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2011 8:10 am 
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The Outback (newer models) has better primary stability, but less secondary stability.

The Revolution has less primary stability, but greater secondary stability.

Consider a flat board versus a log, both floating in the water. On calm water, the flat board has the better stability. But as the water begins to get choppy, the flat board will conform to the waves and roll to whatever extent is needed to thus conform to whatever surface is underneath it. The log, however, simply rises and falls on the choppy water. It doesn't roll (or at least not nearly as much as the flat board is going to).


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2011 10:11 am 
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Thanks Roadrunner for the detailed explaination of the differences between the two boats. Thanks also to Tom for the tutorial on primary/secondary stability, I've seen that mentioned but didn't really understand the difference. I think there are a couple of Revo 11s in our future.

:D


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 01, 2011 12:04 pm 
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Ricky wrote:
damnfingers wrote:
So, if I were to get a Revo, why would I pick the 13 over the 11?


"I'm currently shopping for either a Revo 11 or Revo 13 and would like to demo both. If they feel about the same or close enough, I'll go with the Revo 11, which is 30lbs lighter than my Oasis and that alone is a huge plus for me.
"

It may be even lighter than 30#'s, and the 11'6" makes it a lot easier to handle, lift, turn than the Oasis. My 12' Freedom hawk without the pontoons is a little over 9' and about 50 pounds. It has no side handles, but I can still load and unload it on/off my pickup with or without the bed extender. I can lift it with the front or rear handle, and put it into the limited storage space through two standard double doors of our car port, or I can put it up on my Jon boat for storage.

I could never do that with our Oasis. Even with help in our limited driveway and carport space, the Oasis is a beast to manuever and move.

The Revo 11 should be easier to do all of the above at home and at the lakes/rivers re getting it into the water and back on the truck. Last but not least, I will not have to use our Malone trailer to get to and from the water areas. I may not have to use the bed extender, that I will not know until I try to load it in my truck bed.

We love our Oasis in the water. However, there is a different emotion :evil: about it when we are moving/lifting it, turning it, or whatever on land at home or by the water.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 01, 2011 12:16 pm 
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As usual, a great job re explaining real world on the water.

With our fairly predictable winds, on our local river and two of our lakes, I will be returning with the wind, average speed 10-12 mph to my back on most trips.

How does the Revo 11 perform in that situation, and do you have any tips re keeping upright and reasonably dry?

Thanks
Dave

Roadrunner wrote:
Thanks Tex. I think this depends on direction. On the bow, the Revo 11 has a distinct advantage.

Against wind and chop, the Outback with it's blunt bow has a tendency to pound, sending spray in all directions while the wind carries it to the cockpit.
Image
Any water breaking over the concave foredeck is also funneled into the cockpit, although unless it carries a lot of velocity, this drops out harmlessly through the drivewell.

The Revo 11, with less tendency to pound, creates less spray and shoots it out the side more when it occurs.
Image

As wind and chop swing around off the bow, both kayaks can get splashy. On the beam, the slab sided Outback with its trays acting as additional buffers, probably has a small advantage.

Nosing into steep boat wakes, both kayaks can take water over the bow and into the cockpit -- more so with the Outback. On a beam wake, the Outback responds with more roll (due to its beamier, more stable hull) and therefore has less user control, but more freeboard for slightly better dryness if you don't fall out. Both boats are reasonably dry however -- overall, I'd say it's about even on wakes.

As to traveling through wind, chop and swell, the Revo 11 has the advantage in terms of performance and handling. It slows less, drifts less, turns better and retains better roll control. With weather situations where you can travel directly upwind the Revo 11 is definitely drier; in beam weather, you'll pick up spray in both boats, depending on weather severity. Both boats are pretty good regarding solid water coming over the side rail.

Hope this helps. 8)

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 01, 2011 9:57 pm 
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GS, I assume you're referring to the potential for broaching in a following sea or chop created by wind?

Good rudder authority is the key to controlling the stern in a following sea or chop. Using the large rudder, I've never had a problem downwind with control, wetness or balance with any of the Hobies. With the large rudder, you'll find the Revo 11 to be much quicker in helm response than your Oasis, as it is shorter and carries much less inertia. I can't imagine that you'd have any problems.

You mentioned some concern about keeping upright. Shaggrugg made a comment in another post about the tippiness of the Revo 11 compared with the Outback. A local friend made a similar comment the first time he got in the boat. Owning a Revo 13, he noticed the difference immediately. The second time he tried it, he sat sideways and rocked the boat in shallow water to get a feel for the ultimate stability of the R11 and then understood the difference. After the third time, he sold his Revo 13 and bought a Revo 11 (ease of loading had become an important issue for him). Anybody who feels uncomfortable with the initial "tippiness" of the R11 should try that exercise. Personally I love the control that it gives in rougher water; IMO, this dynamic between initial and secondary stability is instrumental in its seaworthiness. 8)


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