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 Post subject: Re: TI insurance
PostPosted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 12:11 pm 
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Joined: Sat Feb 20, 2010 12:34 pm
Posts: 253
Come on Bob, we can get a 454 in a TI. As an engineer you know, if we have the wherewithal for the undertaking, all projects only need time, money and skill. When deficient in one and the other two must compensate.

Besides you have a hull number and a properly registered boat IAW with the strictest interpenetration of Florida law so, while not a subject of this conversation, I don't think you are off base.

Plus swimmers are not our biggest danger but power boats and jet skis.

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 Post subject: Re: TI insurance
PostPosted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 2:11 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2011 1:58 am
Posts: 1474
Location: Forster, NSW, Australia
Bob, you still seem oblivious to the real hardship a paralised victim could face in the absence of third party insurance. In fact your cavalier suggestion you would give them a sandwich every day is extremely callous to say the least.

Maybe things are different in your neck of the woods, but here in Australia EVERY boat insurance policy includes third party insurance cover with a default amount of $10 million (and for negligible cost), and despite your cynicism, there is no big line of greedy lawyers waiting to rip people off, just a bit of compassion for people whose lives have been turned upside down by unfortunate events.

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 Post subject: Re: TI insurance
PostPosted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 4:05 pm 
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tonystott wrote:
There is no big line of greedy lawyers waiting to rip people off.

Maybe not in Australia but the US, Yes.
Liability and frivolous lawsuits are the biggest dangers in new product development and operating a business here in the States.
Bob's reasoning for not having insurance is spot on... but also highlights the flaws in that the insurance is not there to protect you but to protect you and your assets from the lawsuit resulting from an accident.
Sadly, his level of debt does not protect him from the courts which may take everything.
He is lucky that Florida is a more conservative and sensible system than say California so if the situation were to unfortunately develop he has a better chance but it will still require the cost of a lawyer to defend himself.

Australia is a great place but live in the US for awhile, we may have a similar language but it is different beast.

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 Post subject: Re: TI insurance
PostPosted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 5:56 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2011 1:58 am
Posts: 1474
Location: Forster, NSW, Australia
Well I was amazed to discover that third party insurance cover is not heard of in the States. Here it is pretty well normal (automatically included in car registration and property insurance, as well a marine insurance). Payouts seem to just reflect the likely ongoing costs of caring for the patient (like modifications to make a house access friendly, cost of a full-time nurse etc). There must be lots of wretched souls in the States living in squalor as a result of unfortunate accidents where nobody helps pay the bills.

So here, I can insure a TI and trailer for $200 including up to $10 million cover in the event I cause serious injuries to someone.

Then again, we also have universal basic health cover (I got a new hip last year and it cost me nothing). Think I'll stay here thanks

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 Post subject: Re: TI insurance
PostPosted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 11:07 pm 
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Joined: Sun Apr 20, 2008 6:18 am
Posts: 1239
Location: Sarasota,Key West FL
tonystott :
Actually my wife spent most of her career legally representing the people in the situation we are talking about (she is retired now). It is very sad at times how these people are exploited mostly by their own families and Lawyers (more so when a great deal of money is involved). She worked 30 years for a non-profit organization legally representing these people (disabled and elderly).

I didn't know you were in Australia, it's completely different here. The US has it's obvious problems but we do have a very good system in place called MedicAid that takes care of people in this situation very well. I talked to my wife at length about the subject and she agrees the victim of an unfortunate grocery store or Kayak incident would be well taken care of in the USA as long as there are people like her protecting them legally from exploitation and theft from their families and the 5 out of 10 Lawyers who exploit these kinds of circumstances (Lawyers are not neccessarily a good thing here). The exploitation is amplified 100 fold when a great deal of money is involved (thats why I reacted so much to your $10 million figure).

Bringing people food is something we used to actually do on a regular basis, it's a system called meals on wheels, my wife and I (mostly her, I helped once in a while) would drive around to 20 or 30 of her charges delivering hot meals donated by local restaraunts 2-3 times per week. With some of these people it could be the only hot meals (and visitors) they get because their families ignore them and their needs (very sad sometimes). She (and me once in a while) would enjoy sitting down with them and chatting for a while, sometimes this is the only interaction they have with the outside world and people. So I don't consider bringing someone food and sitting down and spending time interacting and talking with them as being callous. It may be the only interaction with anyone for most of these people (most are quickly forgotten by their families), and I already do it with people I didn't even hit with my grocery cart.
I honestly didn't mean to offend anyone, I didn't realize you weren't in America, it's just different here. Most of us here feel the same way I do about insurance. Over here $100-$300k liability is more than sufficient, and of course I have liability on all my cars and powerboats, I just never thought about getting liability for a kayak before. Fly4v is correct when he says most of our insurance over here is to cover liability from the Lawyers and scam artists than the victims (who are taken care of well).

Fly4v:
I got a line on an L6 454 new in the crate, am looking for a roots supercharger and jet drive. Still trying to figure out how to shield the Plastic hull on my TI from the headers. (just kidding)
Bob


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 Post subject: Re: TI insurance
PostPosted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 9:26 am 
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Joined: Mon Jan 09, 2012 9:12 am
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I have a question: How do you know how much TI coverage you will need?


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 Post subject: Re: TI insurance
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 8:19 am 
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Joined: Sun Nov 20, 2011 11:52 am
Posts: 142
BoatUS

http://www.boatus.com/Insurance/

Value $4,058 (what I paid for it)
Deductable $250
Theft Deductable $500
Boating liability: $300,000
Medical $1000/25,000 person/family
Sporting equiptment $250, $50 deductable
Uninsured boater protection $300,000
commercial towing: $250 per max $500 a year.
Angler package $5000 worth of fishing gear loss.

$76/year

Thinking Ill go ahead and get it, peace of mind.


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 Post subject: Re: TI insurance
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 1:54 pm 
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Joined: Mon May 26, 2008 1:55 pm
Posts: 85
Location: Burbank, Ca
I fall into the categories of:
1) On my truck, falls under auto insurance (Just as my Lance Camper does on truck number two)
2) On my property, falls under home owners.

For long excursions, camping trips, etc I have a 15' Master-lock Python that I run under the Xbars and to my truck, a picnic table, whatever is going to take too much time and can't be moved. I ALWAYS use it during transporting to and from!

The long length gives me the ability to secure it to nearly anything and there are longer versions.
NEVER buy one in a store! They wanted like 90 bucks for the thing locally. I got a brand new one on e-bay for 21 then found another on Amazon for 14 all in the same length.

As a retired Police Officer I can say this for fact: If easy, they will take it. If too hard, they will find the easy button and move on

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 Post subject: Re: TI insurance
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 6:45 pm 
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Joined: Sun Nov 20, 2011 11:52 am
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Crazy4DaRiver wrote:
I fall into the categories of:
1) On my truck, falls under auto insurance (Just as my Lance Camper does on truck number two)


Might wanna check on that, from what I heard (from my insurance) is that unless you have a specific policy for the boat (any boat) your vehicle insurance only covers the LIABILITY side of the boat, I.E. if you boat flies off the trailer and does damage, that is covered, but the damage to the boat itself is not.

I have Allstate, other insurances may be different.


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 Post subject: Re: TI insurance
PostPosted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 1:09 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 18, 2010 2:31 pm
Posts: 2679
Location: Kailua 96734
I agree with the Nut. I just had this conversation with Liberty mutual, who covers my home and new auto.

Contrary to my preconceptions:

My homeowners insurance covers my yak if it is stolen or vandalized while on my vehicle or at the beach.

My car insurance only covers damage to vehicles, individuals or property caused by the vehicle and installed accessories. The AI itself would never be covered for physical damage or replacement cost.

BTW, racks are covered as "installed" accessories- but with a $250-500 deductible, it's like they are not covered at all. If they are stolen - tuff.

So what about liability and damage while transporting the yak or on the water? - I think only boat owners insurance would cover those but I need to continue researching this. My guess is that once you strap down that hobie, or hook up a trailer, you need specific boat insurance.

Anyway, guessing is not a legal strategy, so I better find out for sure.

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