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PostPosted: Fri Jul 06, 2012 6:38 am 
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I recently bought a '79 freshwater Hobie 18, which had been in covered storage for 17 years.  I took it out on its maiden voyage last weekend, and Wow, does that boat fly!  

I do have a few questions though, mostly about maintenance and upkeep of an H18, and a few about operating.

1) being a '79, is there anything I need to update structurally?  I've read that they were strong boats, but it looks like the shroud anchor plates need updating?  How crucial is this?

2). The rudders toe out on the boat, and the tiller bar is too short to adjust them to parallel each other.  Is this by design?  What can I do to fix it?  On that note, what's the best way to eliminate slop on a boat with the old style rudder castings?

3) Saturday I was in 25 knots of wind, gusting to 35 (I know, that's crazy for a first time on a new boat).  Sunday was probably 15-20.  Somewhere in there, I completely bent the mast rotator.  I had it cleated tight to the boom, but I'm assuming now that was incorrect.  Can someone explain the function of the mast rotator and how to use it?

4) the trailer supports the boat on 2 rollers per hull.  I know rollers are less than ideal, but the boat is still in fantastic shape.  What problems can I expect if I don't change to bunks?  Is 2 supports per hull enough?

5) The main traveller was very difficult to get to slide along the track, despite a clear track and new bearings.  Is there any way to lubricate this so it travels a bit easier?

6) where is the shock cord attached to the out haul car supposed to tie off to/cleat to?  The mast rotator?

Thanks in advance for your help, I can't wait to get back out there! 

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 06, 2012 7:39 am 
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1)  Updating the shroud and front crossbar anchor plates, while not necessarily required on the older boats, is still a good idea.  It is relatively cheap insurance against hull failure.  I would recommend doing it.

2)  Not sure you've got your terminology correct.  Toed-out means that the leading edge of the rudders is farther apart than the trailing edge.  Therefore, if the rudders are toed-out, then you would want to bring the tiller arms in closer together, meaning you want to shorten the tiller crossbar, not lengthen.  You want the rudders to be parallel to 1/8" toed-in.
Shim the rudders on the old-style castings the same as you would on all the other systems.  Flat plastic shims at the pivot bolt holes between the casting and the rudder blade and also with bushings between the casting and rudder pins.

3)  The rotator allows you to adjust the angle of the mast for a more streamlined entry to the wind.  It also has some effect on the mast bend.  As a general rule of thumb, set it so it  points near the leeward shroud while sailing upwind.  Also, there is a "new" one-piece rotator bar which is stronger than the original two-piece rotator bar.

4)  I would definintly put bunks under the front rollers as a minimum.  These can be very simple- just a 10" long piece of 2x8.  Nail two strips of wood on the bottom side so it doesn't roll out from under the boat, and throw one or two pieces of carpet on top.  This will distribute the hull weight across a much larger area of the hull compared to a single roller.

5)  Spray the traveller and track liberally with silicone lube.

6)  The outhaul shock cord ties off to the mounting bracket for the outhaul cleat.  You will have to disassemble the boom to access it.

sm


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 06, 2012 10:18 am 
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Congratulations on your new boat! In addition to what SRM said, I would also strongly recommend purchasing new Shroud Anchor Pins from your Hobie Dealer (Part#20100000). Older or heavily used pins tend to break resulting in an unpleasant demasting. If you do buy new shroud anchor pins, it is worth noting the corresponding nut listed in the Parts Catalogue (#8050321) IS NOT THE CORRECT NUT.

The correct nut is Part#8050311 5/16-18 NYLOCK This information came directly from Matt Miller of Hobie USA and I can confirm that they work. If your dealer trys to sell you 8050321 he's going to end up having to replace your brand new pins just like mine did (that nut will seize up after partial installation and you won't be able to remove it). Those nuts will not work, period. Good luck!!


Last edited by BrianCT on Sat Jul 07, 2012 11:20 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 06, 2012 11:21 am 
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Make sure the rudders are doing what they are supposed to (kick up when needed, adjusted, lubed). Lots 'o threads here about that.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 06, 2012 12:58 pm 
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Location: Lake Lewisville, TX
#2. Toed-out. Any chance the rudders were mounted backwards (wrong side)after trailering.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 06, 2012 9:22 pm 
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srm - you are right, I meant that the trailing edge is toed out, so therefore the leading edge toes in. I measured 81 1/2" at the leading edge and 83 1/2" at the trailing edge, so the rudders toe in a whopping 2". It looks like the tiller tube may be slightly bent on at least the port side. I believe the tiller tube changed with the 1987 re-design, so I probably can't replace them?

BrianCT - How often would you say those need replacing?

divimon2000 - The rudders do not kick up on their own. I've been working on this one. The older rudder castings are a bit of a pain, I've filed down as Matt Miller recommended and I'm trying to get the adjusting screws out. I can lift the rudders manually, but I expect I'll rip off the rudder or break the hinge before it kicks up on its own.

H18 - nope, the thinner trailing edge is definitely on the aft side of the rudder, but I mixed up the terminology, the rudders actually toe in by 2".

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 5:31 am 
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SabresfortheCup wrote:

divimon2000 - The rudders do not kick up on their own. I've been working on this one. The older rudder castings are a bit of a pain, I've filed down as Matt Miller recommended and I'm trying to get the adjusting screws out. I can lift the rudders manually, but I expect I'll rip off the rudder or break the hinge before it kicks up on its own.

You may have done all you can then. Same with mine.

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 12:07 pm 
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#2. Sorry, I should not have said backwards. What I meant is that when my rudders are straight, the tiller arms toe in, or are slightly bent inwards, so they don't catch on anything. So you can manuever and not extend the tiller arms outside either hull. The pre-bend in the tiller arms was intentional once upon a time. If so, it does matter which rudder goes on what side, if your tillar arms are pre-bent. They must bend inwards. You may have the left rudder on the right side, and the right rudder on the left side. It only takes about one minute to check. Or, just look and see if they bend inward or outward.

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 12:10 pm 
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SabresfortheCup wrote:
srm - you are right, I meant that the trailing edge is toed out, so therefore the leading edge toes in. I measured 81 1/2" at the leading edge and 83 1/2" at the trailing edge, so the rudders toe in a whopping 2". It looks like the tiller tube may be slightly bent on at least the port side. I believe the tiller tube changed with the 1987 re-design, so I probably can't replace them?

BrianCT - How often would you say those need replacing?

Depends on a number of things, including how often you sail, the type of conditions you sail in and whether or not you store the boat with the mast up (and for how long). As a general rule of thumb, replace them if you don't know how old they are and then replace them every 3 or 4 years thereafter. I had an old pin break when an over-exuberant beach helper wrenched on it with the beach wheel line while helping me get the wheels in place. The mast came down but thankfully no major damage or injuries.


divimon2000 - The rudders do not kick up on their own. I've been working on this one. The older rudder castings are a bit of a pain, I've filed down as Matt Miller recommended and I'm trying to get the adjusting screws out. I can lift the rudders manually, but I expect I'll rip off the rudder or break the hinge before it kicks up on its own.

For what its worth, mine don't kick up reliably either. If you sail in waters with submerged objects (rocks, stumps, etc.), I would continue to try and address. In my case I only have to worry about the sandy bottom of the Long Island Sound. I simply unlock the rudders manually before reaching the shallows.

H18 - nope, the thinner trailing edge is definitely on the aft side of the rudder, but I mixed up the terminology, the rudders actually toe in by 2".

Take a look at the underside of your tiller crossbar. Is there a screw or nut there? If yes, you might be able to loosen and then slide the tiller connectors out 1" each side to make parallel. That's the way my Kisme-style adjusters work. Also, looking from the rear of the boat - If your tiller arms are like mine they should have a slight inward bend.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2012 10:40 am 
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H18 wrote:
#2. Sorry, I should not have said backwards. What I meant is that when my rudders are straight, the tiller arms toe in, or are slightly bent inwards, so they don't catch on anything. So you can manuever and not extend the tiller arms outside either hull. The pre-bend in the tiller arms was intentional once upon a time. If so, it does matter which rudder goes on what side, if your tillar arms are pre-bent. They must bend inwards. You may have the left rudder on the right side, and the right rudder on the left side. It only takes about one minute to check. Or, just look and see if they bend inward or outward.


Wow, you were exactly right. It was hard to see the bend in the tiller arms until I switched the rudders. The previous owner must've taken them off at one point and put them back on wrong. Switching them made them oh so much easier to raise and lower, and eliminated the excessive weather helm!

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 10:04 pm 
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So I'm getting a feel for the boat, and I've started diving right in to replacement parts and upgrades, which I'm learning is a "slippery slope." There is so much that could and probably should be replaced, but I wasn't figuring on pouring in $5k+ right away.

Reading the forums, I apparently need to worry about replacing shroud anchor plates, anchor pins, shrouds, trap wires and forestay, diamond wires, doing a bottom job (with new fiberglass) and change the rollers to bunks. That list right there will cost me close to the cost of the boat ($1500), and nothing aside from the bottoms (and rollers) looks to be in anything but good condition. Perhaps it was naive of me, but I thought that I could get away with a year or two without replacing major components if I bought a boat in decent shape.

In all, I'm feeling rather overwhelmed. So instead of asking what I should worry about replacing, I'm asking what should be my top concern, and what can wait until I get my feet on the ground. The foremost task in my mind is the rollers. The rigging and shroud anchors will cost roughly $800, and I figure that no one standing rigging component is more important than the other, so I might as well replace it all together. However, they've already withstood 25 knots of wind and a capsize/righting, so I expect that those will at least last the rest of the season.

(the boat is a fresh water '79 with some bottom wear but otherwise in great shape. Stored outside on the trailer under covered storage for 17 years, all aluminum mast and most likely all original standing rigging, new running rigging.)

I bought the boat to have fun, but I also want to make sure I take care of it and keep it around for a while. Unfortunately, I've been so concerned about the latter that I haven't gotten around to the former yet!

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2012 3:36 am 
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Diamond wires and trap wires do not need to be replaced periodically. They only need to be replaced if they show damage like frayed wire strands or severe kinking. Shroud anchor plates do not need to be replaced unless they are damaged however they should be upgraded to the latest design if that hasn't been done already.

A bottom job is only necessary if the fiberglass on the bottom of the hull is severely worn. Anyway, a bottom job is a relatively inexpensive repair if you do it yourself, it is just somewhat time consuming.

Adding bunks to the front of the trailer can also done extremely cheaply. I've use a piece of 2x8 cut down to about 10" long, thrown a few pieces of carpet on it and set it on the roller. Screw on a piece of wood in front and behind the roller so it can't slip out and it's done. Simple, cheap, and effective.

The only thing you really need to worry about is the standing rigging- shrouds, bridles, forestay, and anchor pins. At the very least, I would give all of those components a good inspection and replace if damaged. Also take into consideration where and when you're sailing. If you're on an inland lake in the summer with plenty of other boats around, taking a chance on using the rigging you have may be acceptable. If you plan on sailing at the coast in the spring or fall, you probably want your gear to be in top condition.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2012 6:41 pm 
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Thanks sm. I'm curious, you only mentioned the front bunks. I thought the rear bunks/rollers were of just as much concern with the mast resting on the rear cross bar, AND the added stress when stepping the mast.

As for the rigging, I know that it's smart to replace them, but I just don't think it'll happen this year. I figure they must be pretty old... when did Hobie last use white molded covers on the wires? I'm sailing on Lake Erie, but not in overly rough (>2-3ft) conditions and never alone.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2012 7:06 pm 
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Cradles or bunks on the rear trailer crossbar are also a good idea. However, the front tends to carry substantially more load most of the time. The only exception would be when stepping the mast (the added weight from the rear mast support is negligible). My preference is to step the mast with the boat off the trailer whenever possible anyway. In any case, I would consider bunks for the front to be required and bunks for the rear preferred but not required.

The advantage of having rollers on the rear is that they make it easier to move the boat on and off the trailer. On my trailers, I keep the rollers on the rear crossbar and use a cradle that I can slip between the roller and the hull after the boat is on the trailer. This allows for the best of both worlds.

sm


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 31, 2013 1:20 pm 
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Alright, spring’s just around the corner so it’s time to start thinking about the Hobie! I still need to work on the following:

The mast step – it’s the old style, and I think it’s loose. It doesn’t feel loose, but the step is somehow lifted up about a quarter inch off the crossbar.

The trailer rollers need to be swapped out for bunks. Tried 2x6's, didn't really work.

The hulls – bottoms are a bit worn, and there are a few good scrapes and digs I want to fix. One small soft spot (about silver dollar size) near a nasty chip under the rear crossbar on the starboard side, and a much bigger one on the deck, aft of the rear crossbar (stbd hull). Also some delamination in the lip of the stbd hull at the aft crossbar. No substantial leaks. Not sure if I need to add glass or not on the bottoms, but I definitely need some gel coat.

The anchor plates – these are also old style, and I’ve noticed a few gel coat cracks in the lip. Something to worry about?

The crossbar anchors – again old style, more gel coat cracks in the lip, and some potential delam in the lip of the fore crossbar (stbd hull, inboard)

The rigging – still haven't replaced it yet, I believe it's all original. The standing rigging was stored in an attic for 17 years, but probably still needs to be replaced. I have a “spare set” but that also seems quite old.

Those are my biggest concerns. I’m still new to the game here, so if this were your boat, what would your priorities be?

I’m thinking

1) mast step
2) crossbar delam
3) soft spots
4) bunks
5) bottoms & soft spots
6) anchor plates
7) pins & rigging
8) crossbar anchor plates

For the mast step I’ll follow srm’s procedure (Thanks srm!), I figure I’ll just buy the Hobie bunks for the trailer, but the hulls seem like they’ll be a lot of work and I have no experience with fiberglass and gel coat. That said, it doesn’t sound too difficult, just time consuming.

Pictures here: http://s1285.photobucket.com/user/Micha ... 20Pictures

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