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 Post subject: Spinnaker rigging / gear
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 8:40 am 
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How difficult would it be to pull together the parts / rigging to set up a Spinnaker - for an H21SE that doesn't have one?

I'm currently looking at buying a used H21SE - but there is no spinnaker coming with it - and I would want to add it on after the fact.

What gear / rigging would I need? Any suppliers out there that you would recommend working with?

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Andy Gardner
Hobie 21SE "Lickity Split"
Cowan Lake Sailing Association
Foster, OH


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 5:13 pm 
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Matt would be able to respond easier than me, but I think all 21 SE's were provisioned with a spinnaker. Some people installed a spinnaker pole vs. the planned rope system as shown in the instruction manual. Also, I believe some have gone to a asymetrical spinnaker vs. a symetrical spinnaker. Mine came with the original symetrical spinnaker and I have yet to use it as I have not had spinnaker experienced crew on board yet. It's hard to be the captain and crew...... 8)


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 7:34 pm 
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The original little bubble spinnakers were only used the first year. After that, everyone went to a pole with asymetrical kites. The boats didn't come standard with gear (that anybody used-I think I may have the original stuff still in the plastic bag that it came in) other than swivel blocks on the front crossbar that no one used either after the beginning. The halyard tang came on the mast, and a cleat for the halyard (that everyone changed) but you had to rig up your own system beyond that.

Tack line goes from tack of kite to end of pole and back to cleat on front crossbar. Ratchets at the back of the wings. Most had the sheet turn 180 at the back ratchet, and back through another ratchet under the wing about in the middle of the wing. Most of the time the front ratchet is kept on, except in light air. The sheet only makes a 90 degree turn around it, so it'll slide through without too much trouble even left on. The crew will need both on to hand hold the 550 sq. fot. sail, unless the crew is a real beast. My wife can handle it fine any time we can fly it with the two ratchets. Sheet continues across the tramp through the same setup on the other side of the boat. Both ends of the sheet fasten to the clew of the kite. Halyard goes up the mast to a bullet block at the tang, and fastens to the head of the sail. Most put a swivel cleat low on the mast.

After heading downwind, pull tack out, halyard up, sheet in, and haul ass.

Most let the sheet go around the front to gybe. A few pulled it through.

There are all sorts of one halyard systems that connect the halyard and tackline, so you just pull one line. Look on F18s for all sorts of ideas for setups.

The chutes we used in the Prosail series were huge compared to most asymetricals today. Some you couldn't even pull the foot all the way tight, and the foot of the sail went from the end of the pole, all the way to the back of the wing. They were good for going low, but not nearly as efficient as what's used on F18s for sailing high.

We launched the chute off the tramp from all sorts of bags. I have one on each side of my tramp with a half circle hoop for the opening. Each hoop has some of the same nylon rod used for breakable rudder pins bent in a semi-circle, and sewn into the bag front. The back of the bag is mesh so water can flow through. The hoop is held under a shockcord whose ends go through grommets in the tramp. No need to flip the hoop out from under the shockcord to launch the sail. Pulling the sail out automatically opens it. At takedown, flip the hoop back to open the bag, gather the big sail down between your knees on top of the bag, flip the hoop back over, slam the shockcord over the hoop, and that's it. Really takes less time than typing it out.

The newer short footed ones can be pulled back into a tube carried along side the pole ala F18s.

They're really not hard to handle at all, once you get the hang of it. My 105 lb. wife can handle ours with no problem. It's just a little scary for a first timer to hand the sheet to the skipper, and scamper across the tramp to grab the foot of the sail the first few times when it's blowing for takedown. Crew dumps tackline, as does skipper the sheet, when crew has sail foot in hand. Halyard is best thrown overboard to stream straight back at takedown to prevent tangles. Halyard end takedown lines on the newer high aspect kite setups are a lot easier and quicker, but the old one line at a time system was not bad. It's what every boat in the Prosail series used. Imagine 20 boats screaming to a mark with no penalty for contact, for prize money.

The boat is really stable, and not twitchy at all like a lot of lighter, new boats. It'll handle the kite fine in pretty strong wind with both crew on the wire. Watch for puffs, and head up before one gets to you, then bear off with it when it hits. You bear off if you become overpowered to keep the hull from going too high. This boat is most fun barely flying a hull with the kite up, and both on the wire.


Last edited by Tom King on Wed Jan 18, 2012 2:08 pm, edited 5 times in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2012 7:38 am 
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thanks for the most excellent reply... :)

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Andy Gardner
Hobie 21SE "Lickity Split"
Cowan Lake Sailing Association
Foster, OH


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2012 2:00 pm 
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I just noticed you saw it, and I went back and added some things here and there in an edit to make it a bit clearer.


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 9:46 am 
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Okay, I finally had an experienced crew to set the original 031 spinnaker to the boat. That freaking thing is huge! We were flying dead downwind in 5 knots of breeze!

The boat came with a 12' spinnaker pole and it has a symmetrical spinnaker and we were never able to fully fill the sail while tied to the pole. I think I need to rig with the old line system so I can pull the tack to windward.

I am not racing and therefore, do not care about perfect performance, but it would be nice to sail this spinnaker. Can anyone provide advice on rigging this symmetrical spinnaker? has anyone used the line system vs. spinnaker pole system?


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 8:05 pm 
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Even with a chute on a cat, it's still faster not to go dead down. I can't picture why it wouldn't fill, unless it's being shadowed by the main, too low, with no flow over it. Head up and the boatspeed should go way up to more than compensate for the extra distance covered.

I remember those chutes. Prosail furnished everyone with the same one the first season. Everyone still used a pole. As big as it looks, it's still a little bubble compared to the ones we used in following years when there was no upper size limitation. The later ones were not only larger, but cut much flatter. The foot would go all the way from the front of the pole, to the back of the wing, and the foot was still not pulled tight.

If this was not one of the first stock spinnakers, but one made for a monohull, forget all of the above. It's probably made too full for a forward apparent wind.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 08, 2012 8:20 pm 
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Thanks Tom,

This is boat 031 and I believe this was the original spinnaker that might have not been used much as it looks pretty much new. It is a Hild Sails, Inc. City Island NY spinnaker.

The wind was below 5mph and it seemed to never fill the leading edge. This seemed to not be result of the heading direction as we were heading up and down and still could not fill the leading edge. a heading direction

I have only sailed monohulls with a spinnaker and therefore am only familiar with the one in the attached picture.Image

You would generally pull the pole until it was perpendicular to the wind direction. The deeper you wanted to go (best for the monohulls) the farther aft the pole would go and if you were on the typical broad reach on a triangular course the pole would be at the forestay.

It seemed like I needed to head further downwind, or similar to the monohull scenario, I needed to pull the tack to windward to allow us to not go directly down wind. I just could not get the leading edge to fill completely. Frustrating. :cry:


I was not able to get any video but will next time.......


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2012 3:10 pm 
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Sometimes, in really light air, you have to jerk the sheet a bit to uncurl the luff with momentum. The original setup without a pole, just had two tacklines going through a block on each hull. You could pull the tack more to one side, but it quickly proved to be better to just use a pole.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 11, 2012 4:33 pm 
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I just set mine up with a furling asymetric up at the end of the spinny pole. Works like a freakin' charm. I feel like we're sailing in the ACWS or an Extreme 40. SWEET!! Strongly recommend this.

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David Gauci


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 15, 2012 5:06 am 
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dgauci wrote:
I just set mine up with a furling asymetric up at the end of the spinny pole. Works like a freakin' charm. I feel like we're sailing in the ACWS or an Extreme 40. SWEET!! Strongly recommend this.

Can you post links to all the parts you ended up purchasing and the size of the spinnaker you're using.

Some pictures with the bag out and pictures of how you rigged it up would also be very helpful.

I want to get one setup on my boat too. :)


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