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PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 10:40 pm 
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Location: Vancouver Island, Canada
Hey fellow Wave owners.
When I bought my Wave from a local registered Hobie Dealer, I assumed that the serial number of my Wave would be registered with Hobie HQ.
It seems that is not the case. I chose to buy a traveller kit and a Spinnaker Kit from a dealer in Seattle, WA, due to the lack of interest from the local dealer on Vancouver Island who couldn't be bothered to answer my phone calls due to his interests in his own Sailing School.
When I ordered my parts from the Seattle Hobie Dealer (close to $1000US), my ownership of the vessel was not questioned. The parts were sent to me as requested within two weeks.
My point is: If there is no double check on who actually owns these boats, how can any Dealer simply order (and deliver) the parts for any person who claims to own that boat. There was no background check done on my boat from the Seattle Dealer.

It seems there is a huge flaw in the method that Hobie supplies parts due to lack of concern of ownership.
As a habit, I always remove a critical part of any boat that I own to insure that it would not be worth a dishonest persons time to steal the boat.
However, if Hobie and their Dealers could not care less by selling parts to make that vessel complete, I believe that I am wasting my time.

This message will be passed on to Hobie central.

As you, the owner of your Wave, I would hope that you feel concern for this obvious flaw in the Hobie parts (and registration) system, and voice your concerns.

Trinomite

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2012 6:09 am 
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Location: Ottawa, Canada
If I go in and want to buy a driver side mirror and a tail light assembly for my car I have maybe half a dozen outlets within a kilometre that will supply them. Hail damage, thanks for asking. Why should Hobie Cat be more strict?

I don't know if it's relevant but my car has a sticker on the drivers side window that says various parts are uniquely identified and registered. Might be true.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2012 8:01 am 
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Location: Saratoga Springs, NY
This is not, and should not be, Hobie's job! Can you imagine the nightmare of trying to keep track of all the used boat sales, and who the legal owner of each boat is? And what about the used part sales when boats get parted out? Not to mention that Hobie would be putting themselves in a position of liability if they did sell parts to the owner of a stolen boat. If you're worried about theft, register/title your boat with the proper authority where you live. You have the documents proving that the boat was legally sold to you (bill of sale, etc). If it's stolen, report it to the police (and let your local dealers/communities know to keep an eye out). Don't count on Hobie to do your job for you.

If they'll only sell parts to an owner in the system, how do you suggest they handle people buying parts for someone else (as a gift or something)? And how do they make verify they identity of the buyer, when many sales are over the internet or phone?? Personally, I'd rather be able to call up my dealer and order the parts I need, and have them shipped to me immediately, than have to go through a big process and wait while they verify my identity.

The point of removing a critical piece to the boat is to slow down the casual thief/joyrider, not a serious thief.

If you've ever owned a boat by another manufacturer, you'll realize that the level of support we get from Hobie is light years better than most Manufacturers. And i don't think that any other small boat manufacturers attempt to do what you're asking.

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Last edited by SNovak on Wed Aug 01, 2012 8:51 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2012 8:27 am 
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Anyone who has read "Trinomite" posts in the past would know he has an interesting perspective on a LOT of things.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2012 8:52 am 
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Location: Saratoga Springs, NY
mmiller wrote:
Anyone who has read "Trinomite" posts in the past would know he has an interesting perspective on a LOT of things.

On re-reading the last part of my post, It did come across much harsher than intended (Sorry, Tri). Edited to make the point I was trying to make clearer and less confrontational...

Steve

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2012 3:54 pm 
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Location: Vancouver Island, Canada
Hey Steve
No worries I have a relatively thick skin ;)
I must admit, this was not one of my better thought out posts.
I agree with you, it would be a logistical nightmare for Hobie to track all of the boats especially those that have been sold privately.
In truth, I don't have an answer to limit the possible theft of The Wave as they are notoriously easy to steal due to their lack of any 'hard points' for attaching security devices, which can be defeated by taking the boat apart.
I also forgot the method of how I bought my parts: Good Old Credit Card, which is highly traceable.
However, in this age of coded inventory, making note of a stolen boat, can't be that hard?
After a very complete search on the web, it seems that Kayaks are stolen far more often than Cats due to the much larger number of kayaks available. Cats tend to be rather 'awkward' (compared to Kayaks) to steal unless the Cat sits on a trailer with all the parts attached. That theory and a good home owner's insurance policy will just have to make do.
One relatively secure method of defeating a large bolt cutter is to use the thickest 'Life line' material that is used on large sailing yachts. This vinyl coated multi stranded stainless steel material needs a special tool to cut it. Two sets of swages and it will be far more durable than a standard security cable.
...now if we can only find a place to secure it on the Wave, other than the usual sling around the X-Bars?
May I suggest that we can also use the Hobie Forum and open a new Subject Title: 'Stolen or Missing Boats' for any Hobie Vessel. This way, no burden is placed on Hobie, but allow anyone the ability to post their concern to be shared with the Hobie Community at large.
Best Regards
Tri

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Last edited by Trinomite on Wed Aug 01, 2012 4:33 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2012 4:12 pm 
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Joined: Mon Oct 10, 2011 10:24 am
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Location: OC, MD
I live in Maryland.
It cost me 5% of sales price and $24 (+$2 for title) to register my boat (required).
The dealer and Hobie corp guys were very helpful in getting me a MSO (Manufacters Statement of Origin) so I could jump through the state's hoops to prove chain of title all the way back to the company.

Since not all states require registration, anyone can steal my boat and sell it in a state that does not require registration.

_____

As to purchasing parts, my other boat has gone through a few design modifications. So when ording parts they alway ask for year/hull number to make sure the parts are correct.

Is anything needed other than indentifying Hobie Wave club or classic model to order parts? Or have some parts changed over time within the same model?


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2012 5:29 pm 
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Location: Vancouver Island, Canada
Hi IWright
To my knowledge nothing has changed.
Thanks for your insight into the Maryland system of boat registry. It's probably as good as it gets. As you mentioned, other states do not have the same laws thus making it easy to transport a stolen boat across state lines. However, as far as I know (as a Canadian) that is a Federal offence in your country (transporting stolen property over a state line).
In Canada, I cannot own the beach in front of my property as it is the property of the Queen of England. As this is where I keep my boat for the boating season, I have extra concerns of theft of my vessels. This sparked the post that I started.
Regards
Tri

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 10:38 am 
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Trinomite wrote:

When I ordered my parts from the Seattle Hobie Dealer (close to $1000US), my ownership of the vessel was not questioned. The parts were sent to me as requested within two weeks.
My point is: If there is no double check on who actually owns these boats, how can any Dealer simply order (and deliver) the parts for any person who claims to own that boat. There was no background check done on my boat from the Seattle Dealer.

It seems there is a huge flaw in the method that Hobie supplies parts due to lack of concern of ownership.


This idea is totally insane!

I don't have to own a Corvette to buy any parts I want for one.

Why would a Hobie dealer have to check who you are and verify that you own a particular boat, to sell you parts?

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Wave #100
H20 #287 "Tallahassee Lassie" (down in FLA)


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 4:06 pm 
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Location: Vancouver Island, Canada
Mugrace
Insane? Hardly. Every current boat that Hobie produces and sells is in their database, or there would not be a code or SN attached to it. As I have mentioned in the response to my initial post, I realize that it is very difficult to charge Hobie with keeping track of all boats, due to the after market of private boat sales. I also mentioned that by listing any stolen or missing vessel on a separate part of this Forum may help to track down any vessel that has gone missing.

I'm not sure where you keep your boat, but if it is ever stolen, I'm sure that you would appreciate that the Hobie Community is keeping an eye out for it.

Regarding your 'non-ownership' of a Corvette, I do own a current Mercedes-Benz. If it was ever stolen, nobody could buy a part for it as their dealer network would spot it as a listed stolen vehicle, after a phone call to the dealer, (or so I have been assured by Mercedes-Benz).

Mugrace, you for one should be more concerned than anyone on this Forum about theft, simply by the love and care you spent on your very special Wave (and a considerable amount of cash outlay that you can never recover unless your craft is a scheduled insurance item).
Instead of negativity, why not offer suggestions that could support any system that could stem the tide of stolen vessels. You know as well as I do, the more custom the boat is, the more appealing it may be to a thief!

Regards
Tri

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2012 3:58 am 
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Trinomite wrote:
I'm not sure where you keep your boat, but if it is ever stolen, I'm sure that you would appreciate that the Hobie Community is keeping an eye out for it.

Regarding your 'non-ownership' of a Corvette, I do own a current Mercedes-Benz. If it was ever stolen, nobody could buy a part for it as their dealer network would spot it as a listed stolen vehicle, after a phone call to the dealer, (or so I have been assured by Mercedes-Benz).


I too have a MB and I get parts all the time at my local dealer and also:

http://www.autohausaz.com/

I do not need to give them my VIN if I don't want to.

Quote:
Instead of negativity, why not offer suggestions that could support any system that could stem the tide of stolen vessels. You know as well as I do, the more custom the boat is, the more appealing it may be to a thief!

Regards
Tri


Stolen vessels should be reported to the local authorities.

I don't think it is Hobie's responsibility to create a stolen boat network.

That smacks at too much big brother oversight.

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Wave #100
H20 #287 "Tallahassee Lassie" (down in FLA)


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2012 5:04 am 
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Location: Indianapolis, IN
I don't think boat theft has reached the point where that level of suspicion is warranted. Autos are stolen for the large resale market, especially for high-dollar cars where "exclusive" dealers gouge you for over-priced parts. Used boats and parts are readily available from lots of sources, cheap.

I have boat insurance on my Wave through Allstate. If it gets stolen, I get a new boat. Mine is tied down, but unlocked, on the beach...hint, hint :wink: :wink: .

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2012 5:06 pm 
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Location: Vancouver Island, Canada
Mugrace72 wrote:
Stolen vessels should be reported to the local authorities.

I don't think it is Hobie's responsibility to create a stolen boat network.

That smacks at too much big brother oversight.


Mugrace
Just for the record, I hate the 'quote system' simply to prove a point as the original points get diluted as a result, imo.

Unless the owner of a stolen vessel lives in a friggin cave, of course that vessel will be reported to the local authorities. In your country, that info will be noted and passed on to the US Coast Guard. Considering their chores with Homeland Security, I doubt that either authority will ever recover the stolen boat unless luck is on everyone's side.
Please note, I did not ask Hobie to 'run' a stolen boat network but simply to start a new header. Any input to that site would be placed by owners who have lost a boat, as a heads up to the Hobie Community at large. If you will look at other supportive websites, (especially ones that deal with boats large enough to be the owner's home), stolen boat reports are very much a real concern. Either way, even losing a 13' foot boat is an affront to your rights to own property without having it stolen.

I also checked again with my present MB service center as to how far they will go in insuring that parts will not be sold to a stolen MB in 2012. It seems they have changed their tune due to the after market of parts. All they can guarantee is that any security feature of the MB will be checked for ownership, license and insurance papers. (same as any other car dealer).
It may seem that there is little interest in stopping any theft of any product as the Insurance system will simply replace it and add to the profit margin of the manufacturer...(however, as the insurance claims add up including the premiums), there will come a point where nobody will touch you as one is `broadcasted`as an insurance risk to the entire Insurance System.
As most people use their home owner`s policy to insure their boats(and other toys), a cancellation of a home owners policy could have some very serious consequences!

Regards
Tri

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2012 6:53 pm 
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Trinomite wrote:
Mugrace72 wrote:
Stolen vessels should be reported to the local authorities.

I don't think it is Hobie's responsibility to create a stolen boat network.

That smacks at too much big brother oversight.


Mugrace
Just for the record, I hate the 'quote system' simply to prove a point as the original points get diluted as a result, imo.



I agree.

Hope to see you at a Wave regatta.

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Wave #100
H20 #287 "Tallahassee Lassie" (down in FLA)


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2012 7:12 pm 
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Location: Vancouver Island, Canada
Hi Jack
I'd love to sail with you. (You'll win, lol), and I wouldn't mind a bit just to see your boat fly. :shock:
Alas, the distance is on the diagonal across the entire continent. :(
Maybe someday soon, friend.
Cheers
Tri

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