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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 7:27 pm 
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Location: Portland, OR
With a lot of help from forumites here, we just bought a 1981 Hobie 16 in (relatively) good condition. However, basically ALL of the boat is original - rigging, etc.

As has been suggested in these forums, I plan on replacing on the running rigging, standard rigging, etc. But while we're at it, I also wanted to see if it would make sense to update things like the mainsheet system, jib halyard, jib cars, main traveler, etc, etc.

I took it into the only nearby Hobie dealer, but while they were helpful, they've only been a dealer for a year, and admitted that they really are doing a lot of this "for the first time". They have exactly one partially assembled Hobie 16 in stock. So I'm counting on all of you for some guidance and expertise.

Here are some questions, in no particular order: your feedback and comments would be greatly appreciated!

Standing Rigging
Go with the standard coated wire, or Heavy Duty?

Mainsheet System
Several Hobie "pros" have recommended the Harken low profile 6:1 system, using 57mm blocks 2604 and 2629. Any reason why the lower cost 40mm blocks 2640 and 2612 wouldn't work (just about) as well? Are there Garhauer, Ronstan or Lewmar fans out there?

Main Traveler
The swivel cam and traveler car need to be replaced. Does it make sense to upgrade to a Harken or Ronstan set-up, and if so, do you have recommended part numbers?

Jib Cars
I'm struggling using the Hobie catalog to find the right parts to upgrade here. The swivel cams and cars both need replacement (the original track is OK). Same question: what parts do I need to order? Would it be Hobie part 1075? And can I, without too much hassle or cost, add the traveler adjustment system, so that the cars don't have to be adjusted manually?

Jib Clew Blocks
The clew blocks are shot. Are the Harken blocks from Murrays.com here http://www.murrays.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=28-0371&Category_Code=C-J&Store_Code=MS as good as any?

Downhaul
Any recommendations for upgrading the downhaul? Is the Power Pak overkill, and if so, what would be a reasonable upgrade from the ancient existing setup?

Trapeze Kit and Harnesses
Any recommendations? We're looking at the "deluxe adjustable trap rig" from the Hobie catalog, but are there better, or more cost effective, setups? What about harnesses? We will not be racing, or sailing in extreme conditions (famous last words)...

Cleanup
The previous original owner abundantly coated most of the mast, as well as the thru-hull fittings, with a greyish sealant, that is now ugly and rubbery. The Hobie dealer recommended removing this with acetone and a putty knife, and then re-sealing with clear 3M 5200. Thoughts or suggestions?

Thanks for all your help!

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1981 Hobie 16 Tequila Sunrise


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 11:12 pm 
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Good post, I have some of the very same questions for my (first ever) 1977 H16, that I just picked it up a few weeks ago.

Looking fwd to recommendations of elder hobie-iers.

Naz


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 6:00 am 
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Location: Detroit, MI
OK, here goes, with priorities assigned (1=high, 5=low)
jimrude wrote:
Standing Rigging
Go with the standard coated wire, or Heavy Duty?

Unless you plan to do hard-core ocean racing, standard coated wire is fine. Replace the shroud anchor pins and bow tangs. (Priority 1)

jimrude wrote:
Mainsheet System
Several Hobie "pros" have recommended the Harken low profile 6:1 system, using 57mm blocks 2604 and 2629. Any reason why the lower cost 40mm blocks 2640 and 2612 wouldn't work (just about) as well? Are there Garhauer, Ronstan or Lewmar fans out there?

57 mm blocks are far too large. The current stock system (Harken 194 / 344) is quite adequate. Harken no longer makes the 194, so finding one may be problematic. Go through your dealer, as rumor is that Hobie Cat has stock. The 344 is a 29 mm carbo. The 2612 is an acceptable replacement for the 194. (Priority 3) There are less expensive alternatives, but Harken is the best, period. And they're made in the USA.

jimrude wrote:
Main Traveler
The swivel cam and traveler car need to be replaced. Does it make sense to upgrade to a Harken or Ronstan set-up, and if so, do you have recommended part numbers?

Replace the traveler car with the Hobie stock system. (Priority 1 if the existing one doesn't roll smoothly). If you want to burn some more money, replace the existing track with the deep-profile Hobie track (Priority 5) and "new" stock traveler. Make sure you get the right traveler car! (old stock has small, stainless "pin" bearings; new has larger brass wheel bearings). The swivel cam is a simple bolt on replacement - either Harken 240 or the Ronstan equivalent (Priority 1 if the old cleat doesn't work well).

jimrude wrote:
Jib Cars
I'm struggling using the Hobie catalog to find the right parts to upgrade here. The swivel cams and cars both need replacement (the original track is OK). Same question: what parts do I need to order? Would it be Hobie part 1075? And can I, without too much hassle or cost, add the traveler adjustment system, so that the cars don't have to be adjusted manually?

The Tren-Tec "plastic knuckle" cars are the way to go. Harken 240 replaces the swivel cams. Use Harken 468 cleats with the 476 base for the traveler adjustment system cleats (Lance cleats are an acceptable, less expensive alternative). (Priority 2) Use Harken 233 micro blocks for the traveler adjustment system turning blocks.

jimrude wrote:
Jib Clew Blocks
The clew blocks are shot. Are the Harken blocks from Murrays.com here http://www.murrays.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=28-0371&Category_Code=C-J&Store_Code=MS as good as any?

The stock system is two Harken 224 micro blocks hung off a small shackle. That's all you need. (Priority 2)

jimrude wrote:
Downhaul
Any recommendations for upgrading the downhaul? Is the Power Pak overkill, and if so, what would be a reasonable upgrade from the ancient existing setup?

The 6:1 downhaul is not necessary unless you plan on racing. (Priority 5) A Harken 225 micro block hung from a shackle to give a 3:1 purchase will work just fine. (Priority 3)

jimrude wrote:
Trapeze Kit and Harnesses
Any recommendations? We're looking at the "deluxe adjustable trap rig" from the Hobie catalog, but are there better, or more cost effective, setups? What about harnesses? We will not be racing, or sailing in extreme conditions (famous last words)...

You do not need a "deluxe system" unless you have money burning a hole in your pocket. Use the stock system with the addition of J&H handles. (Priority 2)

Trapeze harnesses are a personal thing. I've used The Hobie Convertible harness in the past and was quite satisfied. You can get much more expensive options. (Priority 3).

jimrude wrote:
Cleanup
The previous original owner abundantly coated most of the mast, as well as the thru-hull fittings, with a greyish sealant, that is now ugly and rubbery. The Hobie dealer recommended removing this with acetone and a putty knife, and then re-sealing with clear 3M 5200. Thoughts or suggestions?

First of all, if you ever want to take something apart, don't use 5200. It's a permanent adhesive, not a sealant. As for your existing stuff, it's probably just old silicone sealant. Acetone is useless. The only way to get it off is to scrape and gentle wire brushing. Then re-seal with clear silicone. (Priority 4 unless you've got leaks, then Priority 1).

One thing you have not considered is that with new rigging, new low profile main and jib sheet systems, you'll be wanting to carry a lot more mast rake. An old jib is not shaped correctly for this (too long in the foot). You should seriously consider getting a new jib (one that's less than 10 years old).


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 6:03 am 
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Location: Virginia Beach VA
Sounds like you have done all the research and know more than your dealer. I would say upgrade all that you can afford. The standard rigging is sufficient...been working for decades. I use the 40mm triple upper. I wouldn't recommend 40mm for the lower mainsheet block. I think that is mostly for dinghy's. Adjustable traps are nice if you want to pay the price. I've set my stock trap adjusters (rope locks) and haven't moved them in four years so....your call. Not sure what a power pack is but if it is like 8 or 10:1 it is probably overkill for an '81 H16 downhaul. Jib clew blocks with bearings look good. I might order some myself. :D Most here will tell you not to use 5200 for anything you might want to disassemble later. It is pretty permanent.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 6:44 am 
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Location: St. Louis, MO
+1 for NOT using 5200. I will add that you should also not use silly-cone for a sealant either. The issue with it is once you put it on, you will not be able to remove all of the residue in the future either chemically or mechanically. This will prevent the new sealant (including silicone) from adereing to the surfaces. Go with Boat Life or another polysulfide. It can be removed later without leaving a residue.

You also asked about Garhauer, Lewmar, and Ronstan. Ronstan makes some decent small boat gear. Lewmar makes some nice keel boat hardware, but I am not too sure about small boat. Garhauer is awesome hardware for larger keel boats. Mostly used by cruisers for it's durability and quality. Racers find it too heavy and bulky. Thier smaller stuff is almost overkill for my 30' keel boat.

I had Harken all over my H16 and it was top notch.

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Nick

Current Boat
In the market
Previous boats owned
'74 Pearson 30
'84 H16
'82 H18 Magnum
St. Louis, MO


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 8:05 am 
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Location: Saint John, NB Canada sailing on Washademoak Lake
Matt(mbounds), it's a a 1981. Can he still use the Trentec jib car?

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Marc...
1978 Hobie 16 Keoke, sail# 36 84
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 10:24 am 
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Location: Central Oregon
Quote:
The Tren-Tec "plastic knuckle" cars are the way to go. Harken 240 replaces the swivel cams. Use Harken 468 cleats with the 476 base for the traveler adjustment system cleats (Lance cleats are an acceptable, less expensive alternative). (Priority 2) Use Harken 233 micro blocks for the traveler adjustment system turning blocks.


Anyone have a pic of this setup handy?

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1980 H16
1997 Wave


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 1:30 pm 
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Location: Bend, OR
Great detailed pics in this post. That's my plan for upgrading the original setup on my boat.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 4:17 pm 
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The second set of swivel / cam cleats for the traveler control system is total overkill and a waste of $. All you need is what comes stock on the boats (either lance cleats or the small Harken cam cleats w/ fairleads.

The Tren-Tec cars were designed for the riveted stainless track that's on pre-1995 boats.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 4:41 pm 
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Location: Portland, OR
MBounds wrote:
The second set of swivel / cam cleats for the traveler control system is total overkill and a waste of $. All you need is what comes stock on the boats (either lance cleats or the small Harken cam cleats w/ fairleads.

The Tren-Tec cars were designed for the riveted stainless track that's on pre-1995 boats.


Since my local Hobie dealer doesn't seem to know where to start, would you mind listing the parts needed to convert an '81 boat with the riveted stainless track?

Thanks!

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1981 Hobie 16 Tequila Sunrise


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 5:58 pm 
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Traveler control system using Tren-Tec cars:

1 set Tren-Tec traveler cars
2 Harken 233 micro blocks
4 3/16" x 1/2" stainless or monel pop rivets (for mounting the micro blocks)
2 Lance cleats
4 small, counter sunk head stainless screws (for mounting the lance cleats)
~ 25' 3/16" dacron double braid line, cut in half.
~ 4' 1/4" shock cord

Install Tren-Tec cars in the tracks
Tie one end of the pieces of 3/16" line to the outer hole in each car
Position the micro blocks on the corner casting to provide a fair lead back along the front crossbar behind the tracks. Tape in place temporarily with duct tape.
Position the lance cleats between the inboard end of the track and the mast step.
When you're happy with the position of everything - drill holes and attach the hardware.

Tie the two inboard holes of the two cars together with the shock cord.
After threading the control line through the turning block and the lance cleat, tie the loose end in a bowline around the shroud, or put a small grommet in the tramp by the shroud (where new tramps have them for the trapeze) and put the control line through it and tie a stopper knot.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 6:55 pm 
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MBounds wrote:
Traveler control system using Tren-Tec cars:

1 set Tren-Tec traveler cars
2 Harken 233 micro blocks
4 3/16" x 1/2" stainless or monel pop rivets (for mounting the micro blocks)
2 Lance cleats
4 small, counter sunk head stainless screws (for mounting the lance cleats)
~ 25' 3/16" dacron double braid line, cut in half.
~ 4' 1/4" shock cord

Install Tren-Tec cars in the tracks
Tie one end of the pieces of 3/16" line to the outer hole in each car
Position the micro blocks on the corner casting to provide a fair lead back along the front crossbar behind the tracks. Tape in place temporarily with duct tape.
Position the lance cleats between the inboard end of the track and the mast step.
When you're happy with the position of everything - drill holes and attach the hardware.

Tie the two inboard holes of the two cars together with the shock cord.
After threading the control line through the turning block and the lance cleat, tie the loose end in a bowline around the shroud, or put a small grommet in the tramp by the shroud (where new tramps have them for the trapeze) and put the control line through it and tie a stopper knot.


Thanks for the detailed explanation. I assume I can use the Harken 150 Cam with X-Treme fairlead instead of the lance cleats, right?

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1981 Hobie 16 Tequila Sunrise


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2012 5:45 am 
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The Harken 150 is too large. Harken 474 (micro cam w/extreme angle fairlead)


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2012 10:16 am 
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MBounds wrote:
The Harken 150 is too large. Harken 474 (micro cam w/extreme angle fairlead)


Thanks!

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1981 Hobie 16 Tequila Sunrise


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 04, 2012 8:39 am 
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Location: Oshkosh, WI
I rock original everything... just replaced some wires and lines on my '82.

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1982 H16 (C:\Worthy)
Yellow/White Prism type sails


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