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 Post subject: Tracking straight
PostPosted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 2:19 pm 
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Joined: Fri Feb 15, 2013 1:59 pm
Posts: 18
Location: Northern Colorado
I am fairly new to kayak fishing and the Marige Drive system. As much as I love the kayaks, I am having a hard time adapting my fishing technique to what I think might either be something I am doing wrong, or maybe even an oversight by Hobie?

Historically in my personal pontoon or my belly boat I have been able to troll with 2 rods at the same time. No this is not a line tangle question nor do I want to even go there...I hold both rods out to the side and use my fins to steer and keep me tracking in a straight line.

Is it me, or am I the only one who thinks the Pro Angler 12 has a mind of it's own if you don't always have one hand on the rudder toggle? Can the Pro Angler track straight for longer than 50 feet in perfect conditions if you don't have a hand on the rudder?

Looking forward to hearing from those of you who have much more time on the water than I do.


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 Post subject: Re: Tracking straight
PostPosted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 4:17 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 27, 2003 12:44 pm
Posts: 8918
Location: Oceanside, California
The Pro Anglers have high freeboard, so affected by wind. Rudders are forward of aft most position and are wide for their length. The combination is stable and maneuverable, rudders don't catch fishing lines.

Imagine a short wheel based 4x4 vs a longer touring car. You can't set the steering on even the best driving vehicle for much distance without input. A 4x4 needs constant input.

The PA like a 4x4 is sensitive to steering input. You can over steer the PA causing a snake wake feel. Make small adjustments, so the rudder has time to react. Too much and the rudder loses water flow, then steers hard over once it re-attaches.

Another issue is that the MirageDrive is well forward. If you slow or stop pedaling, the boat will turn as the drive system becomes drag.

Keep a steady pace pedaling, make finer adjustments to steering... those help.

Will it track like an 18' touring yak? No, but if you want to turn fast... yes it will.

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 Post subject: Re: Tracking straight
PostPosted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 6:57 pm 
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Joined: Thu Feb 14, 2013 1:43 pm
Posts: 15
Location: Satellite Beach, Florida
I'm a new owner of a 2013 PA 14. I was getting more rudder to the left than the right and when I checked the factory rigging it was off causing the imbalance. You may want to check the rudder alignment. You might also check on the free upgrade of the rudder pulley that may solve the tracking problem.


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 Post subject: Re: Tracking straight
PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 8:58 am 
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Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2012 11:35 am
Posts: 218
Location: Ogden, Utah
As with all engineering, the end design is a result of compromise. All the good things about Pro Angler steering have a cost, and the cost of tight, responsive turning is a small loss of directional stability. They could easily design it to track like a falling cannon ball - but then it wouldn't turn well or at all.

In my Prangler 14, I need to make frequent small corrections to hold a track. Wind or even subtle shifts of my weight will cause a turn to develop. A very small correction applied promptly will keep it on track, but that does require a hand on the tiller most of the time. It's a lot like flying a jet, where you don't actually move the stick, but "think" a correction - and it happens.

Mine had more turn to the right than the left, btw. Left turn was inhibited by the tiller handle hitting the rod storage fixture. I simply changed the rigging by a fraction of an inch so the tiller handle has more "throw" to the left. It sits a bit off center when the rudder is actually straight, but that's immaterial.

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 Post subject: Re: Tracking straight
PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 2:09 pm 
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Joined: Fri Feb 15, 2013 1:59 pm
Posts: 18
Location: Northern Colorado
Thanks for the feedback guys!
I will take all this into consideration.

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 Post subject: Re: Tracking straight
PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 1:03 am 
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Joined: Sun Jul 31, 2011 3:01 am
Posts: 127
yeah its all about small corrections...I troll 2 rods consistent no tangles 200ft + :idea:


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 Post subject: Re: Tracking straight
PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 7:54 am 
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Joined: Fri Feb 15, 2013 1:59 pm
Posts: 18
Location: Northern Colorado
Jude,
Is it accurate to assume you have 1 of those rods in a holder so you can toggle as needed?

If so can you advise on the best holder/mount set up?

I appreciate all the feedback!

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 Post subject: Re: Tracking straight
PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 7:58 am 
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Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2013 2:26 pm
Posts: 46
I don't know if this will help you... but I think of the hand steering on a PA like the trolling motor control on a small boat in wind. You have to make those small corrections from in time to time to keep your place in wind, or even to stay parallel to the bank(shallow bass fishing for example) in no wind. Over correcting will cause that snake-like trail.

I haven't been in a PA yet. My observations are strictly from watching videos and reading others posts around the internet, as I prepare for my first day out. So, I could be way off in the way I think of the steering in a PA. :wink:


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 Post subject: Re: Tracking straight
PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:04 am 
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Joined: Mon Apr 26, 2010 6:06 am
Posts: 732
Location: Amelia Island, FL
If you are using the Mirage Drive, the PA will track fairly well. However, if you are drifting with the current or have the wind pushing you from behind, the PA will want to "swing" on you. One way to eliminate this is to keep the fins up against the hull when not using them. This will eliminate the pivot effect.

Like mentioned above, the steering issue is something that comes with the PA 12. It's a trade-off on fishing from the worlds best fishing platform or having some minor issues with the steering. Me? I will be fishing from my PA :D


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 Post subject: Re: Tracking straight
PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 10:41 am 
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Joined: Fri Feb 15, 2013 1:59 pm
Posts: 18
Location: Northern Colorado
Islandspeed,
Your suggestion to run the fins against the hull is one I have not tried yet.
I just found some open water (without ice that is) yesterday and am looking forward to testing this in the next few days.

I will post my findings..

Thanks again to all those who participate in this forum!

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 Post subject: Re: Tracking straight
PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 11:37 am 
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Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2013 11:47 am
Posts: 63
The PAs are the best fishing platform ever built. I cast about half the time for warm water species, bass, walleyes, perch, crappie, etc. The rst of the time I troll, one rod in rod holder, the other in my right hand for quick response.

My left is on the steering handle, usually full time, making small corrections. It is like steering a small plane, Do not over correct, and give it time to react. Also, watch the top of the water ahead. Lots of times you can "read" the wind incoming or quartering.The wind is not consistent, it has holes and eddies just like water. Anticipate. If you are rounding a corner as an example, your wind will be different. Also, a tail wind is more difficult to judge than an incoming. Much easier to steer into the wind.

Also, don't over pump your drive unit. Use only enough force to make your PA respond to what you want. The more you use your unit, the more instinctive it becomes, a combination of thrust and steering, but mainly, anticipation.

I have used about every type of rod holder, but really like my current units, Cabelas Quick Draw. They make more sense when you have them in hand then trying to explain, but they allow you to lift the rod straight back, then up, which keeps the line to the fish taut. Super idea, simple, and it works.


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 Post subject: Re: Tracking straight
PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 2:42 pm 
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Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2008 9:14 pm
Posts: 99
Location: Gales Ferry Connecticut
I think the PA 13 has a tracking issue that will require some re-engineering of the PA13. Prior to my PA13 (2012) I had a PA14(2009) It too had tracking issues. The rudder cam had to be replaced with a larger cam and the whole steering system had to be replaced... After those were accomplished the PA14 tracked and turned great.

I see a lot of the same issues going on now with the PA13. I also see the same excuses and comments.

Mark my words. eventually their will be a modification to the PA13 steering system witch corrects the problem.

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 Post subject: Re: Tracking straight
PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 6:51 pm 
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Joined: Mon Apr 26, 2010 6:06 am
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Location: Amelia Island, FL
salmontim wrote:
I think the PA 13 has a tracking issue that will require some re-engineering of the PA13. Prior to my PA13 (2012) I had a PA14(2009) It too had tracking issues. The rudder cam had to be replaced with a larger cam and the whole steering system had to be replaced... After those were accomplished the PA14 tracked and turned great.

I see a lot of the same issues going on now with the PA13. I also see the same excuses and comments.

Mark my words. eventually their will be a modification to the PA13 steering system witch corrects the problem.


Yeah, the PA 13 is a piece of **** but the PA 12 is one cool fishing machine :mrgreen:


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 Post subject: Re: Tracking straight
PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:57 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jul 31, 2011 3:01 am
Posts: 127
Jude wrote:
yeah its all about small corrections...I troll 2 rods consistent no tangles 200ft + :idea:


i run 2 scotty powerlock surface mounted rod holder on the boards... surface mount keep them above the shins...left hand steady on the rudder


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 Post subject: Re: Tracking straight
PostPosted: Tue Mar 19, 2013 4:13 pm 
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Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2013 1:34 pm
Posts: 5
Location: Seal Beach, CA
I'm a former float tuber also, soon to be kayaker.

I think the other thing is just a mental adjustment. You are used to being in the water, with your fins in the water. Even if you aren't conscious of it, you're making constant adjustments with your fins and torso to keep your tube on track or aligned properly for your trolling. It's practically instantaneous.

With the kayak, I think right now, there's a bit more lag going on between what you see & feel the boat doing, registering and processing in your brain, sending commands to both your rudder hand and your pedaling feet, and then waiting to see the response in your boat. I imagine this will all become faster and smoother and more "automatic" as you keep fishing the PA.

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