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 Post subject: Rudder Issue
PostPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2013 7:55 pm 
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Site Rank - Deck Hand

Joined: Fri Mar 15, 2013 6:32 pm
Posts: 14
Location: Slidell, La.
On a 2013 Oasis with dual steering, rudder turns sharp to the right but not too much left, partially because steering lever hits the left side of the hull. Can you take the lever off and re-position it so that there is more available movement to the left? :?:


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 Post subject: Re: Rudder Issue
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 8:33 am 
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Joined: Wed May 28, 2003 1:12 pm
Posts: 1014
The correct way to adjust the rudder is at the rudder head - loosen the two screws that are holding the steering lines - and re-adjust so that you get equal turning in either direction.

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 Post subject: Re: Rudder Issue
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 8:30 am 
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I can appreciate the info on the rudder adjustment because I too have that issue. My next question is about the effort to steer.
Yesterday my wife and I were out in Tampa Bay in about 15-18 knot winds and the steering lever was extremely hard to keep the rudder in position on a close hauled tack and maintain the direction of travel. I know the bow wants to steer into the wind but I was worried about breaking the rudder control lines or the rudder pin based on how hard I was having to hold onto the steering lever. Any thoughts?
Thanks,
Tony
Tampa, FL


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 Post subject: Re: Rudder Issue
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 8:45 am 
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This sounds to me like either -A-, you didn't have the rudder locked down all the way, or -B-, it was too windy for a full sail - both of those scenarios would make the steering more difficult. In high winds you need to slightly furl the sail in to reduce the loads on to maintain control of the Island. And always make sure that your rudder is fully locked down. (you do that buy pulling the down handle and placing the string into the cleat where the handle exits the hull - it should leave you with about a foot of line danging into the cockpit with the 'down' handle at the end of it)

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 Post subject: Re: Rudder Issue
PostPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2013 8:56 am 
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I have a 2013 TI that I've used maybe 10 or 15 times and I just started having the same hard steering issue. Yesterday it was really bad. The winds were not very strong and I relocked down my rudder several times trying to solve the problem with no improvement. The rudder works fine when pedaling but as soon as I put up the sail I have to pull hard on the lever and hold it with a lot of effort to maintain direction.

I've had this problem before and found that one time the rudder wasn't lock down and another time the adjustment screw was loose and the line had slipped. This time I can't find any problems but something definitely isn't right. Any other ideas?


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 Post subject: Re: Rudder Issue
PostPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2013 1:23 pm 
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Joined: Fri Dec 05, 2008 2:32 am
Posts: 1786
Location: Terrigal NSW, Australia
Have you tried easing the mainsheet out a bit?

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 Post subject: Re: Rudder Issue
PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2013 12:55 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 27, 2003 12:44 pm
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Location: Oceanside, California
Higher winds, weight forward, rudder not staying down, dagger board position... all possible factors. You have to find a balance.

Check the rudder again, play with the dagger position, heavier weight aft or if solo... sit aft, furl the sail a bit, ease the sheet to get moving and reduce rudder load... sheet harder once moving.

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 Post subject: Re: Rudder Issue
PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2013 1:05 pm 
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chrisj wrote:
Have you tried easing the mainsheet out a bit?


I shouldn't need to do that. We are not talking real heavy winds and I have been in much stronger winds without the problem.

I looked everything over carefully and found a couple of things I hope will have an impact. First, I noticed some up and down play in the rudder unless the down line was pulled out really hard. I suspect this is my problem because I had the problem once before until I noticed I forgot to lock it down. However, I did play with this on Saturday when I was having trouble without success. Maybe I just didn't pull hard enough. And second, I found some play in the rudder control lines. They probably stretched a bit since they were new. I readjusted them taking out all the play and it is more responsive now.

I'll try to get in the water this week and see if it's better.

Sure is a fun boat. Even better than I dreamed all those years I wanted to get one. My son and I did our first overnight trip with it and we had an awesome time.

Thanks,
Kris


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 Post subject: Re: Rudder Issue
PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2013 5:19 pm 
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Location: Oceanside, California
Quote:
First, I noticed some up and down play in the rudder unless the down line was pulled out really hard.


When sailing, if water flow pushes the rudder aft... steering will get harder.

Just to be completely clear... You have to use the cleat to lock the rudder down. Simply pulling the line hard does not "lock" the rudder down.

Pull till the rudder drops. Pull any slack out of the line and place the line in the cleat.

Be sure the cleat is functioning correctly to hold the line. If you can... test the rudder-down at the shoreline and see if you can pull the rudder aft (at the rudder blade). If you can... the down line is not pulled hard enough or the cleat is slipping.

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Director of Parts and Accessory Sales
Hobie Cat USA


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 Post subject: Re: Rudder Issue
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 5:15 am 
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I'm having similar steering problems where the steering is extremely stiff, and I've had two events of being out on the water where the steering line slipped from the tensioning screw, and the boat became uncontrollable. I've tightened the screw to the point that the line is now frayed, but there still seems to be a tendency to slip. The rudder is all of the way down. This is unacceptable from a safety perspective, and I don't trust the boat anymore. The steering mechanism is just too complicated and prone to failure. Is there an option to get a normal tiller?


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 Post subject: Re: Rudder Issue
PostPosted: Fri Sep 06, 2013 8:35 am 
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Joined: Tue May 27, 2003 12:44 pm
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Location: Oceanside, California
10013711 wrote:
I'm having similar steering problems where the steering is extremely stiff, and I've had two events of being out on the water where the steering line slipped from the tensioning screw, and the boat became uncontrollable. I've tightened the screw to the point that the line is now frayed, but there still seems to be a tendency to slip. The rudder is all of the way down. This is unacceptable from a safety perspective, and I don't trust the boat anymore. The steering mechanism is just too complicated and prone to failure. Is there an option to get a normal tiller?


Your issue is not design it is technique... an possibly one or two knots needed.

Pull the rudder down line HARD and CLEAT. That holds the rudder down. If you stand behind the boat and pull back on the rudder and it easily moves up a bit. You have not pulled the down line hard enough or it slipped before being cleated. If the rudder slips aft while sailing, you will experience stiff and difficult steerage which puts a strain on the adjustment lines and connections.

After adjusting the steering lines at the rudder. Use the excess line ends to tie a couple half hitches. This locks the line it that position and is the way boats are delivered from the factory.

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Matt Miller
Director of Parts and Accessory Sales
Hobie Cat USA


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 Post subject: Re: Rudder Issue
PostPosted: Fri Sep 06, 2013 5:51 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2011 1:58 am
Posts: 1534
Location: Forster, NSW, Australia
I also added a large washer and wrapped the line a full 360 degrees around the screw, so when the screw is tightened, there is no way the line will slip, plus the greater surface area lessens the possibility of fraying the line. Been untouched for the last 60+ sails.

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Tony Stott
2012 Tandem Island "SIC EM"
www.scenefromabove.com.au


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 Post subject: Re: Rudder Issue
PostPosted: Fri Sep 06, 2013 6:01 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2005 6:29 pm
Posts: 2092
Location: High Point, NC
When the rudder is not completely locked down, it can tail up a little and even a couple inches gives the rudder a tremendous amount of leverage against the rest of the steering system.

I've never liked the pull cord system, greatly preferring the older lever arm system. But Hobie changed it for some reasons so they may have been experiencing problems with the older system that I'm not aware of.

Either way, if you don't have the rudder down straight and tight, the force required to turn it becomes huge.


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 Post subject: Re: Rudder Issue
PostPosted: Sat Sep 07, 2013 2:05 am 
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Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2011 1:58 am
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Location: Forster, NSW, Australia
Just to explain the physics... there is a section at the lower front of the rudder which, when the down line is tight, actually sits in front of the axis of the rudder pin. This means that the forward section sits on the opposite side when the rudder is turned. The water pressure on this forward section acts to counteract some of the water pressure on the larger, back half of the rudder blade. So if you don't keep the rudder down-lin tight, and allow the rudder blae to tip back a bit, this pressure from the forward part ADDS to the pressure on the rear, rather than SUBTRACTS from it. Hence the steering effort becomes hugely harder, and things break....

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Tony Stott
2012 Tandem Island "SIC EM"
www.scenefromabove.com.au


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 Post subject: Re: Rudder Issue
PostPosted: Sat Sep 07, 2013 9:50 am 
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Joined: Sun Apr 20, 2008 6:18 am
Posts: 1375
Location: Sarasota,Key West FL
cafejane :
I have had the exact same problem on my TI (very hard steering), upon closer inspection the rudder pin was nearly sheered off at either the top or bottom only (but not completely), and ready to go completely. You need to pull the rudder pin and check it, When putting it back together make sure everything is clear of sand, I know on mine if I get sand in there (from surf landings) it also tightens up quite a bit. Another thing I have found is if you adjusted your rudder cables on a cool day, and then take the boat out on a hot day, the rudder cables can get too tight (the entire boat grows an inch or two depending on the outside temp). Tight steering cables can also cause difficult steering.
Hope this helps
Bob


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