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PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 6:19 pm 
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 7:17 pm 
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2 much fun! Thanks Spook. Knew that was coming...

God bless you and GOPRO HD. :mrgreen:


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 9:11 pm 
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Yeah, that's good. Well done!

Keith

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 25, 2013 1:49 am 
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Congratulations Spook. You are now officially the Hobie forum guinea pig. You can do all the stuff we would love to do but don't want the damage.

Speaking of damage, was there any ?

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 25, 2013 4:15 pm 
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Slaughter wrote:
Congratulations Spook. You are now officially the Hobie forum guinea pig. You can do all the stuff we would love to do but don't want the damage.

Speaking of damage, was there any ?


No damage at all, not a thing, just the plastic sheer bolt. I have been talking to hobie and the idea of the sheer bolt is not really that good. All the load when going sideways gets transferred through the aluminium tubes, not the kayak, so I am going to toughen them up. Also the rudder blade needs to be bigger if I am going to surf properly. To me it seems that I loose control when the rubber blade is in the white wash of the wave. They have bigger blades for one of their small cats so I will try and fit one of those.

No more upside down pics I hope.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 25, 2013 6:55 pm 
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That pic could win you the big prize mate. Then you may have a spare AI on your hands to capsize as much as you like !!!

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 25, 2013 9:26 pm 
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If you do try it again mate, it "might" be a good idea to stow the treble hooks first. :o


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 25, 2013 10:47 pm 
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Sorry, but I just don't get it... Islands are NOT designed as surfing machines, due to a combination of centre of sail effort, rudder size, weight distribution, hull buoyancy, lack of planing surfaces etc.

Also, did you have the daggerboard down? If so, this is a major no-no, as learned by yacht designers, Whiting, Holland etc when development peaked in the half-ton racing classes, as the hull can trip over the daggerboard.

While the brace bolt is arguably too weak, Hobie clearly chose the current strength to ensure it broke before anything else. The hull has never been in danger, but the brace itself and then the aka is next in line if the bolt is too strong to break. Hobie's solution means that in normal use, swapping in a new bolt gets things back to normal without repairs needed.

I guess you are qualified to carry out these extreme tests though, as you mentioned elsewhere that you have previously sent a yacht to the bottom...

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 25, 2013 11:12 pm 
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Boy, when you guys sail down under, you really sail DOWN UNDER! :lol:


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:52 am 
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Did you break the mast, or mast-mount?

In that still-frame from the video (in the AI/TI Photography thread), the mast seems to be at a very strange angle...

Mike.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 5:29 pm 
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tonystott wrote:
Sorry, but I just don't get it... Islands are NOT designed as surfing machines, due to a combination of centre of sail effort, rudder size, weight distribution, hull buoyancy, lack of planing surfaces etc.

Also, did you have the daggerboard down? If so, this is a major no-no, as learned by yacht designers, Whiting, Holland etc when development peaked in the half-ton racing classes, as the hull can trip over the daggerboard.

While the brace bolt is arguably too weak, Hobie clearly chose the current strength to ensure it broke before anything else. The hull has never been in danger, but the brace itself and then the aka is next in line if the bolt is too strong to break. Hobie's solution means that in normal use, swapping in a new bolt gets things back to normal without repairs needed.

I guess you are qualified to carry out these extreme tests though, as you mentioned elsewhere that you have previously sent a yacht to the bottom...


You dont get it, this is the most fun you can have in and Adventure Island ever and whilst they might not be purposely built to surf, it sure is fun getting a long ride.
And yes that plastic bolt that stops everything from breaking is very weak so out they come and stainless bolts go in and if that breaks then I was obviously having way too much fun. :)

It's not about the design and the purpose, and dagger boards and all that, it's about what you can really do on these things and how much fun you can have. You might die tomorrow and missed out on an exhilarating ride.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 5:32 pm 
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mingle wrote:
Did you break the mast, or mast-mount?

In that still-frame from the video (in the AI/TI Photography thread), the mast seems to be at a very strange angle...

Mike.


Hi Mike,
I was really lucky with the mast, it popped out with no damage at all. I had made sure that the end of the furling line was tied off so I didn't loose the rig but also made sure there was no tension so if it did out it would hopefully fall away from the boat. The chances of snapping it were big so the trick is to not capsize. :) working on that one this weekend.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 11:24 pm 
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Spook - I would recommend keeping less sail out next time, which would lessen the chance of a huli. That would mean your furling line would need to be tensioned.

Turning (quickly) into the wave is usually what gets you. As you surf, the sail goes very limp, and as you slow it starts to fill. Turning into a reach with all the sail out loads it up instantly, just as the wave angle is building and the leeward Ama is digging in - then the whitewater unglues the rudder. A perfect cocktail for a broach and capsize.

There's also a moment when the rudder is overpowered by your speed down the wave (the old one would "Pop") and another when it is neutralized by the wave as it overtakes you again. You sense these forces alot when you are surfing open swells, but in a shorebreak there is only one chance to get it right.

I surf with the dagger in and raked heavily. That way I can still use it to get back up wind for the next set... I use the drives to even out the speed changes.

See if any of this helps in your next session. If not - we'll look forward to the video. :wink:


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 12:17 am 
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NOHUHU wrote:
Spook - I would recommend keeping less sail out next time, which would lessen the chance of a huli. That would mean your furling line would need to be tensioned.

Turning (quickly) into the wave is usually what gets you. As you surf, the sail goes very limp, and as you slow it starts to fill. Turning into a reach with all the sail out loads it up instantly, just as the wave angle is building and the leeward Ama is digging in - then the whitewater unglues the rudder. A perfect cocktail for a broach and capsize.

There's also a moment when the rudder is overpowered by your speed down the wave (the old one would "Pop") and another when it is neutralized by the wave as it overtakes you again. You sense these forces alot when you are surfing open swells, but in a shorebreak there is only one chance to get it right.

I surf with the dagger in and raked heavily. That way I can still use it to get back up wind for the next set... I use the drives to even out the speed changes.

See if any of this helps in your next session. If not - we'll look forward to the video. :wink:


These boats turn on the waves when the rudder and rear of the boat are at the top of the wave in the turbulated water. The rudder gets no grip on the water and weather helm takes over and the boat rounds up. Simple hydrodynamics, whats actually needed is a longer rudder blade. The local hobie shop and I are working on this now.

Sail is kept out full to generate as much drive as possible then sheeted in when attaining higher speed due to decreased angel of apparent wind. Angle to wind decreases as you increase speed. Furling line eased to ensure mast is free to eject from hull incase of emergency. Full sail is need for power.

i have been perfecting this for quite a while, it's only now that we have decent waves at this time of year that I have been able to fully test it out. The nose cone is the biggest bonus if you want to surf otherwise the nose just burries in the wave and turns you sideways.

Plastic bolts have now been replaced with stainless steel. No more breaking.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 2:37 am 
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This is all good stuff. I don't get the chance to see many breaking waves so it's good to see how to approach the situation when I do.
Keep up the wave riding R&D Spook !

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