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PostPosted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 9:43 pm 
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Location: San Diego
Maybe it is time to make a turbo version of the 20 or a higher volume 20 foot boat to compete more directly with the I-20/Nacra 20.

Maybe a Fox style hull (lighter), lighter/taller rig (carbon), spinnaker, and a really big square top main. Carbon wings would also be cool, but not a seat style, just a tube rack to trap off of. It will be expensive. Is anyone willing to put up $20,000ish to $25,000 ish for a fast boat from Hobie?


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 12:11 am 
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Interesting Hammond, that would be cool. I'll tell you though, I have a hard time getting customers to pony up $25G's for the hottest A class, with an outstanding pedigree, let alone a brad new boat. And the aclass is one of the fastest growing cat clases in the world. Probably THE fastest, but I don't have any hard data.
Selling cats is a strange business, every few years there is a fluctuation in what is popular. Just look at what the fleet has done in SoCal in the past say 5 years. Same here in NorCal... and all over the world. I can't figure out the fluctuations. Seems like sticking to the Formula rules might a good idea. Who am I though, I just sell em :D

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 5:49 am 
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Location: Clinton Lake Lawrence, KS
Hammond wrote:
Maybe it is time to make a turbo version of the 20 or a higher volume 20 foot boat to compete more directly with the I-20/Nacra 20.

Maybe a Fox style hull (lighter), lighter/taller rig (carbon), spinnaker, and a really big square top main. Carbon wings would also be cool, but not a seat style, just a tube rack to trap off of. It will be expensive. Is anyone willing to put up $20,000ish to $25,000 ish for a fast boat from Hobie?

Huh?
quote This is simple supply and demand unquote
Hobie has the machine for "high performance sailing", it's called the Tiger.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 6:31 am 
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Location: 315 N. Hwy 79 Panama City Beach, FL 32413 850-235-2281
Surf City Catamarans wrote:
let alone a brad new boat.



Easy Jeremy I think a "brad" new boat would sell like crazy, however a brand new boat would sell like hot cakes in words until it becomes available, then people would complaint about the 20K. new i20 is very very close to 20K, then add a trailer, cradles trax, extra spin and your 25K+.

its going to take a lot of people, I mean a lot of people to buy h16's get sailing "the thing to do" and then Hobie might start on the development of race boats again here in the states, but then again when hobie eu will do it why bother.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 6:59 am 
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sunjammers wrote:
its going to take a lot of people, I mean a lot of people to buy h16's get sailing "the thing to do" and then Hobie might start on the development of race boats again here in the states, but then again when hobie eu will do it why bother.

Well said...especially the "might" and "why bother"...end of story

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 7:42 am 
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Location: San Diego
I am too big to sail the Tiger. It's a great boat, but us fat boys need a bigger toy and I would like to stay with the company that supports one design sailing.

In a perfect world, I am looking for a boat that has a 360 lbs minimum weight. A boat for two big guys with the power to push it along in a mild breeze. Make reef points an option that might really be used. :wink:


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 Post subject: bigger boats
PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 9:56 am 
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Location: Chicago
I agree with Hammond. My H16 is fine for single handing, but when my bro and I want to go out, we're 430# of swamping payload, and he's not fat. I've been looking at H18 and H20, but they're disconitinued, which gives me pause on the Hobie front.

If you look at U.S. demographics, even your poll in the other forum, many if not most of us are Boomers. A lot of us Boomers are experiencing some "cargo shift" but aren't ready to move to Getaways or monohulls yet, I think. (What is the waist/butt size of an "XL" trap harness, BTW?) On my sailing beach we're seeing more Nacras showing up as the old Hobies fade away. We need more, bigger boats that are still easy to sail.

Then again, I don't know anybody who has bought a new boat of any kind. Literally. I know there has to be an active pre-driven market to support the new market, but I'm not sure how the dynamics work. Looking at demographics again, though, most of the wealth is increasingly concentrated in the Boomer generation. Plus, I don't know anyone who first got into sailing on a catamaran -- they moved up from Lasers, Vanguards, etc. I'd think all the indicators would be pointing to bigger beachcats, but I'm an outsider. Leasing programs make any sense?

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 7:25 pm 
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yeah one reason my brother and i like our 20 so much is because it has so much power. we can both be trapping in less than 10 knots of wind, when guys on the tigers may have one man out, if any. granted in heavy wind is can be a lot to handle. i think the reefing points are a good suggestion. we used to have an old 16 that we could reef (that was when we were much smaller and sailing with our old man!). but at any rate i think there is a market for the big, powerful 20-foot cats, and the poeple that keep making them will get the $$$

on the flip side, people shouldn't come down on hobie for discontinuing the 20. it is a business, after all.......


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 9:24 pm 
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Joined: Mon Feb 13, 2006 8:37 pm
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Location: Columbus Ohio
Reality check boys: Isn't Hobie now a kayak company that sells sailboats?
:?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 5:31 am 
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Location: Northfield Minnesota
buzzman2 wrote:
Reality check boys: Isn't Hobie now a kayak company that sells sailboats?
:?


Used to be a surf board company that made sailboats. Then a camping gear mfg that made sailboats.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 5:51 am 
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Joined: Mon Jul 14, 2003 7:11 pm
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Location: Detroit, MI
Quote:
Then a camping gear mfg that made sailboats.


Here's another tidbit of corporate confusion:

In 1998, Sunbeam acquired Coleman Products (who had sold off Hobie Cat in 1988). So you had a kitchen appliance mfg that made camping gear.

In 2002, Sunbeam went bankrupt and in 2005, was aquired by Jarden Corp, who who makes Kerr, Ball and Bernadin canning products.

So now you have a jar mfg making kitchen appliances and camping gear.

Actually Jarden owns a whole bunch of consumer product brand names:
Campingaz (from Coleman)
Coleman
Powermate (from Coleman)
First Alert (from Coleman)
Sunbeam
Mr. Coffee (from Sunbeam)
Oster (from Sunbeam)
Diamond Brands (think matches)
Crock-pot
Bionaire
PineMountain Firelogs
K2 Brands (skis)
Rawlings (from K2)

And that's just a start.

Welcome to corporate America. We're lucky to have a company who's relatively focused.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 11:15 am 
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Location: San Diego
Matt,
Any thought on bringing in or HCF developing a super Fox (non-F-20) for a big boy light wind SoCal market?
Mike

PS-I could be the test case


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 Post subject: Super Fox
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 12:40 pm 
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I don't think so...

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 1:21 pm 
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Matt Bounds- As I read your post, all I could hear is Cliff Clavin's voice.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 2:24 pm 
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Joined: Mon Oct 09, 2006 2:34 pm
Posts: 523
Location: NC
I agree Hammond. I know in sailing circles light=fast, but there really doesn't seem to be too many small cat designs that are focused on us bigger guys. I mean combined crew weight min. for the 16 is 285, correct? I take up like 80% of that. Maybe I just need to find a good 2 year old to crew for me :lol:

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