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PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2007 3:52 pm 
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Location: Sylvan Lake, Alberta, Canada
Hey has anyone installed the "Trapeze Rig Return System" on there 16? If you have does it work good? And do I have to put holes in my tramp? I'm thinking of installing it on my new 2008 H-16.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2007 6:54 pm 
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Location: Northfield Minnesota
It just doubles the amount of shockcord that is used for the return line. You wouldn't have to put any holes in your tramp. I did on my 06' and really liked it, although there are many who would disagree with my descion to do so. I liked it, and there is a post showing what I did.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2007 1:19 pm 
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I think it adds weight and complexity. I do not see any issue with the stock setup. The normal length of shock cord does the trick - no need for more length and block.

Patrick


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2007 3:28 pm 
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Location: Coeur d'Alene Idaho
Fooboo I installed it on my boat earlier this year. It did not last long as I didnt like it. The pulleys attach to the underside of the tramp frame. The kit includes all the hardware needed. My problem was the shockcord would hang up on the pulleys when moving fore and aft along the rail actually causing more tightness. I would have to reach down and unhook the shockcord from around the pulley so I could move along the rail freely. I may not have installed it properly but I agree the stock system is the best. I think I read earlier this year in these forums that Hobie was changing the tramp in 08 to incorporate the shockcord through the tramp. hmmm I would like to see that setup.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2007 11:46 pm 
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Location: Los Angeles
I tried something similar but a little different and it worked perfecly for me.

http://www.thebeachcats.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=12366&g2_serialNumber=6&g2_GALLERYSID=TMP_SESSION_ID_DI_NOISSES_PMT

One of the things I really like about it is that I don't feel that extra forward tug when trapping on the stern. It also doesn't chew up my rail rug.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2007 7:33 am 
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Location: Upstate, South Carolina
DavidBell47,
Sorry if this is a silly question, but the shock cord seems to be a bit low when it goes on the other side under the tramp, does it create any drag in the waves?

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Hobie 16
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2007 1:28 pm 
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Lacalizer,
There's no such thing as a silly question. The mini-blocks are connected on the outside (top) of the hull and the bottom of the opposite side-bar at an upward angle. The Hawaiian righting system and righting bag hang lower than that. Have experienced no wave interference.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 12:35 pm 
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Location: Charlottesville, VA
So I'm finally installing the TRRS using the Hobie-supplied eyestraps and blocks. The screws are about a half inch long, maybe a bit longer, so I suppose I have to drill the holes far enough rom the edge that they will not intersect the rope in the tramp and also miss the aluminum bulkhead behind the track in the sidebar. So I guess that puts me about 3/4" in from the inner edge of the sidebar, on the bottom. Seems the straps should be aligned with the sidebar rather than going across it.

I don't think the fore-aft location is critical, but how far behind the shrouds do they typically go? I was thinking maybe 6" and 12" back.

If anyone had pictures showing the Hobie parts installed, I'd love to see it.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 30, 2013 9:45 am 
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I've been installing this today, and I have to say that my loyalty to Hobie accessories is taking a real beating these days.

The self-tapping screws supplied with the kit are not the way to go. Drilling and tapping would be much better; the cutting threads in these screws are too fat and too fine; they load up with aluminum and enlarge the hole, then the rest of the screw is loose. If you get everything exactly right they're OK as long as you can get the threads to bite immediately; otherwise the screw spins and too much metal is removed. I can work around that with taps and other screws, but still. The screws should at least have more taper and deeper cuts, if not coarser thread.

The eye straps are barely large enough to let the blocks move freely under the side rails. In fact, they don't move freely. This probably isn't a big deal since they should pretty much stay in one orientation forever, but it's just how it is.

The Sea-Dog shock cord hooks included have small holes in them and you cannot conceal a stopper knot in the end. I have larger hooks (Trem?) that came with the boat; the hook body is a bit larger but the lateral hole is larger so the stopper knot can sit inside it.

The big thing, though, is the shock cord itself. Each section is 15' long and can stretch about 100%. Unstretched, it crosses the boat twice (shroud to block on opposite rail and back to the near rail). Installing it per the diagram (across the beam three times) already uses up about 50% of the stretch (it's very tight at that point), and in the event of a pitchpole there less than 10' of stretch left before you get to the end of it and break it. I would barely make it to the forestay before reaching the end. Am I missing something about this?

I can see Dave Ball's reasoning for longer shock cord when you install it with the extra anchor points, but I never thought longer cord would be needed running it the way Hobie intends. The concept for this kit is great, but the execution seems to really be lacking. Hopefully someone can explain why this kit is better than it seems to be. I want to sail tomorrow, so I need a system on the boat, but I feel like I should return this kit. It's like the tie-down system: nice idea, but if you have to replace half the stuff to make it work, what's the point in buying a kit?

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 30, 2013 9:19 pm 
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Location: Knoxville, TN
Anton,

What were you trying to accomplish by installing this complex system? I have to agree with Yoh, the stock system works just fine. I don't see any reason to change it.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 3:45 am 
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I break the stock length shock cords too easily, when the trap wire stays connected to me during a pitchpole. This system should triple the length of available shock cord, giving you three times the stretch.

It's not very complicated.

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My Hobie 16 pages


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 8:09 am 
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Location: Indianapolis, IN
I was thinking about making this system with low friction rings.

Image

There's really not much advantage to them. Just a novelty thing. They cost $10- the same price as the basic Harken micro blocks.

Are there cheaper blocks than the Harken ones that I can use for this system?

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 9:43 am 
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Location: Clinton Lake, KS
MVD wrote:
Anton,

What were you trying to accomplish by installing this complex system? I have to agree with Yoh, the stock system works just fine. I don't see any reason to change it.



I have thought about changing mine up a couple times... I have tried the grommets in the tramp and didn't really care for it...

My main problem is from one tack to the next very often the trap wires are a tangled mess making for even more time popping out on the wire.. If the trap handle was always returned to the same spot I think it could make popping back out double trapped after a tack much quicker... I also often run into situations where we tack.. the crew pops out and a gust hits... I go to hike or something in conditions just between single and double trapped and find the trap wire right behind me... Or whatever...

The secondary problem is right now the line on my trap is either to long or to short.. The shock cord attaches to this line in such a way the 'knot' has to pop in and out past the side rail making things less than smooth.. This should be an easy fix (yet I never seem to get around to it)... I would guess the best solution would be to make the shock cord 'longer'...

I have thought about the systems that double the length of the shock cord under the boat.. but I am afraid it will just put me dragging along further behind the boat.. :lol:


The fixed point systems work well on stuff like a H18... and that is barely more than 7 feet of shock cord in the returned position... As far forward as you often have to trap on a H18 I can't imagine a H16 would be much worse..


Oh... and in a related thought... The jib traveler cars on my 2005 H16... I dunno why I never thought of this before, but I noticed it on a fleet members boat... I had always rigged it with one piece of shock cord ran behind the dolphin striker post connecting the two cars... It has always been a game of fine tuning the amount of return pressure while still being able to travel both cars all the way outboard to keep things simple for the crew... The boat he just purchased had a piece of shock cord running from each car to the corner casting on the opposite side of the boat.... Well... duh... It works great!


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 4:58 pm 
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OK, I see your point. I just haven't had that issue.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 02, 2013 1:05 pm 
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AntonLargiader wrote:

The self-tapping screws supplied with the kit are not the way to go. Drilling and tapping would be much better; the cutting threads in these screws are too fat and too fine; they load up with aluminum and enlarge the hole, then the rest of the screw is loose.



x2! I dunno what Hobie was thinking with these "thread cutting screws". I just put a Hobie remote jib traveler setup on my old 16. Those screws are a joke! Do yourself a favor and get a tap to cut the threads. Do not use those screws to cut the threads! All that happens is they get loaded up with aluminum and strip the threads out! :roll:

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