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PostPosted: Tue Oct 28, 2008 6:57 pm 
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Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2008 10:10 pm
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Location: Gilbert, AZ
Sure feel sorry for you cold winter sailors, it's still in the mid 90's in Phoenix. However we're expecting a cold spell this week; it's going to be in the mid 80's. I did breakdown and buy a shorty wetsuit though!

:lol:


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 3:37 am 
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Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2007 4:07 am
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Location: Punta Gorda, FL
On the subject of winding up in the water, I find it difficult to imagine that that could happen to me if nothing breaks. The Adventure Island is darn difficult to flip, or I would have flipped mine a few times already. ;) :D

I think I remember reading about someone here who had a shear pin give or something while under sail, the downwind ama folded in, and the boat rolled over. Do any of you cold water sailors do anything to prevent that from happening? I was thinking a couple of lines in an X on each side, from crossbeam to ama socket. Although the water here is not THAT cold, and most of it is pretty shallow to boot, I really, really do not want to go swimming in water below 80 degrees. Even with a wetsuit. I'll wait until May, thanks. ;)


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 8:29 am 
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Joined: Thu Mar 13, 2008 9:49 pm
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Location: Newport, NH
I could see ending up in the drink a few ways without capsizing. I crawl around the AI to access the front hatch, I lean out to attach a bungee to the sail when heading downwind and I sit on the sides while leaning out on the akas, I stand up to look for the gloves that fell overboard. I have also found that with the cold weather comes stronger winds and bigger waves. I could see myself slipping in at some point, we all know murphy's law.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 10:28 am 
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Location: Punta Gorda, FL
I never get up out of my seat when I'm out. The only times I have are in the creek when I need to drop the mast to go under a bridge, but that only happens in calm water.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 10:31 am 
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Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2007 6:14 pm
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Location: South Florida
I have not flipped, but a few people have. All it takes are some steep waves and serious wind. My experience is that this sort of thing is never planned OR expected, and it always happens fast.

Keith


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 12:28 pm 
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Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2007 4:07 am
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Location: Punta Gorda, FL
Well, I went down and bought some Frogg Toggs today. l can't wait to try them out. Tomorrow is supposed to be windy, so maybe I'll go out and see how wet I get. :D


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 3:16 pm 
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Joined: Sun Sep 21, 2008 5:04 pm
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Location: Wilmington, North Carolina
Great I am anxiously waiting to hear how these Frogg Toggs work and which model you went with.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 4:31 pm 
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Location: Oceanside, California
Be extra sure to wear a PFD when wearing loose fitting water wear or boots. This sort of clothing makes it VERY hard to swim. I prefer wearing a neoprene wetsuit. Wetsuits are designed for swimming conditions (surfing etc). Tighter fitting which does not capture water weight. Water captured in loose clothes and spray suits can make it VERY difficult to get back in a boat. The neoprene in a wetsuit also adds buoyancy.

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 Post subject: test your gear
PostPosted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 3:56 am 
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Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2008 1:31 pm
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Location: New Jersey
whatever you choose to wear - I suggest you give it a test

get out of your boat and try to get back in a few times, even stay in the water for a few minutes and get used to it

I personally wear a DrySuit in cold water and cold weather. Although probably not as swimable as the wetsuit.

Problem up north with wetsuits is that before they help you stay warm you got to get some water in there to warm up. For surfing they are perfect because your in the water.

what I don't suggest and I will say it is death waders combo with dry top. Any extended visit into the water will slowly work its way in. I have seen Jims video IN THE POOL where he jumps out of the kayak and gets back in quickly. Up north or where the water can kill you because of the temp, wear a drysuit

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 6:32 am 
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Location: Newport, NH
Hey Yakman, what is this video, "In the pool?"

By the way, I almost fell out of my AI yesterday...lol. I went to grab the centerboard from under the front hatch, went to return to my seat and my gloved hand slipped off the gunwale (if you can call it that), I grabbed the aka just before going in head first. I had to laugh as this thread popped into mind. It sure is more difficult to move around with the extra outer wear and lifejacket.....cumbersome to say the least.


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 Post subject: here
PostPosted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 8:30 am 
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Location: New Jersey
Quote:
Waders, wading belt, paddling jacket, and PFD
Waders, wading belt, , and PFD
Waders, and PFD
Waders, wading belt
Waders
and needless to say I did not drown.
These were Hodgman Breathable waders


I also tried paddling pants in different combos
Still did not drown but got a bit wetter.

Bottom line it that the waders were dry and warm when worn properly, even when worn improperly they kept most of the water out.
I would certainly recommend the wading belt and the PFD when ever wearing waders and a PFD at all times when on the water.
Yes this was in a controlled situation in a pool that was 54 degrees. But it did show me a few things about the waders that made me much more comfortable wearing them.

Here is the video
http://youtube.com/watch?v=OYwG52p4yjs

Jim Sammons
La Jolla Kayak Fishing

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 Post subject: i should add
PostPosted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 8:40 am 
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Location: New Jersey
the kayak has no gear and even the seat is off the yak, certainly worrying about your rods and milk crate will add to the situation

if anything it proves that you do get wet, and In CALI who cares its warm

when you really need your gear it won't be for 10minutes,

it certainly proves that it safer than we all thought, but not safe enough for me - and that my opinion

this is not attack on JIM - he is a great guy with awesome experiences and knowledge

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 2:50 am 
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Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2007 4:07 am
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Location: Punta Gorda, FL
Well, I tried out the Frogg Toggs yesterday. They work great at keeping off the spray and are very comfortable, but not the final solution for winter sailing.

Early on, I took a boat wake aboard and was sitting in a puddle. It didn't take long for the water to soak through, and my butt was wet the rest of the day.

It was a warm day, and I was soon sitting in a pool of warm water, so it wasn't too bad, but the Frogg Toggs are definitely not going to cut it if I want to go out in the harbor when the water is cold. With a new wave coming aboard every few seconds, I would be sitting in cold water. Looks like a wetsuit may be my best option for that activity.

Pic of my wife sailing down Pine Island Sound yesterday:
Image


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 9:04 am 
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Joined: Wed Nov 21, 2007 8:19 pm
Posts: 72
Location: Jackson Hole, Wyoming
Howdy!

I can't imagine using our sit on top AI's without without full Gortex dry suits (including feet). The best ones are made by Kokatat. It's not just frigid Northern waters they're made for... I've seen a post here where somebody said conditions off Maui sometimes require them. We would have been miserable on the relatively warm waters of Lake Powell without them!

Perhaps I'm missing something about the dodger accessory. I've never seen one in use. It's certain you'd still get water in your lap (ie when large waves you're surfing on drop you down and suddenly you're sitting in a bathtub of water). You'll still get spray on your face and chest, dripping down. It's undoubtedly harder to fiddle with lines, daggerboards and pedals. I couldn't use my Foretrex 101 GPS velcroed to the front crossbar. Lastly, although the AI is a forgiving boat, you're undoubtedly adding more windage. This is not an option for my circumstances.

A good Gortex suit keeps you warm and dry. You can layer 200 count polar fleece pants and wear a fleece jacket over regular poly long johns. Put on a pair of heavy socks (plus chemical warmer). Lastly, get a pair of super large (for you) booties that loosely fit over the suit without pinching off blood vessels (I've got size 12 feet and use size 15 NRS booties). I wish I would have bought the Kokatat Expedition suit (it's got an integrated hood).

Shop around for windproof balaclavas and ski hats.

I'm allergic to neoprene. I use a cheap pair of big rubberized cotton gloves, with a pair of NRS Reactor neoprene gloves as backup for if/when they get wet.

Pedaling the Mirage drive will add body heat, even if you have wind and don't need it.

In cold weather, you'll still be a bit frosty at times. When launching the boat you'll feel the steely tang of cold water through all of that anyway. This isn't the time to go turtle. Keep those amas from submersing.

Here's a HOT tip. It's common practice to "burp" these suits by placing fingers in the neoprene neck gasket while squatting. Try letting little or no air out of the suit. You'll feel like the Michilen tire mascot, but have extra dead air to keep you warmer.

Happy Trails!
Warm Trails!

Chris

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is equal to the love,
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 10:50 am 
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Joined: Fri Mar 23, 2007 8:12 am
Posts: 428
Location: Florida
Tom Ray wrote:
Early on, I took a boat wake aboard and was sitting in a puddle. It didn't take long for the water to soak through, and my butt was wet the rest of the day.


Put tape on the front 2/3 of the seat scupper holes on hull bottom (see roadrunner's pics) & fully open your seat scuppers.
Then get an additional seat cushion. I use the square throw cushion/floats commonly seen in canoes.

Between draining the water and the extra 1-2" of cushion you will never sit in water again.


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