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PostPosted: Fri Mar 20, 2009 11:16 am 
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Location: Knoxville, TN
I'm piecing together the remnants of a Hawaiian righting system that came on my used H20. No problems putting it back together, I've got a nice "M" shape under the tramp. However, I'm not sure how to properly use it to right the boat. I get the basics: hold the line, lean back, shock cord stretches, etc. My confusion stems from previous experience on H16s. On the 16, (and it's been 20 years since I owned my last one) we would throw the righting line over the upper hull to get more leverage and then hike out to pull the boat over. It doesn't appear that the Hawaiian system will allow you to throw the line over the airborne hull. Is it necessary to do so on an H20? Will I have enough leverage if I just grab the line from where it rests under the tramp and lean back? My normal crew will give us about 295 lbs of combined crew weight (we'll have fun trying to hold this bast down). If any of you have experience with Hawaiian systems on the H20 I'd appreciate your feedback.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 20, 2009 12:05 pm 
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Location: Jersey Shore
Had the system that forms a "V" under the tramp, not the "M", but the idea is the same. Just grab the line and lean back. It's easiest if you throw a wrap around your harness hook so you're not holding on with your arms.
The leverage is determined by how far (horizontally) you get your body away from the lower hull. Whether you route the righting line over or under the hull makes no difference with regard to getting the boat up- it only effects the angle of pull on your body. So just stand as far out as you can (use the dagger board if necessary) and get as horizontal as possible.

295 is on the light side for the 20, but you should be able to do it if you have enough breeze and you get the boat pointed into the wind.

sm


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 21, 2009 11:18 am 
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SRM,

Stand on the daggerboards? Are they that strong? If they broke with someone standing on them I can't imagine the lacerations you'd get from jagged edges. Replacing one and $400 doesn't sound too appealing either. Has anyone tried this?

MVD wrote:
My normal crew will give us about 295 lbs of combined crew weight (we'll have fun trying to hold this bast down).


My aoplogies for a typo in my first post. I meant to type "beast", not "bast" in reference to the boat in heavy air. I wasn't trying to make a profane allusion that might have offended anyone.

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Mark Van Doren
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H16 #112205 (Richard Petty Signature Edition)
H14T #47787
H20 #647 (sold)


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 21, 2009 2:33 pm 
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There is a substantial load on the daggers when sailing upwind. Consider how much force is generated by the rig when double trapping and the daggerboard does the majority of the work in countering that sideways force and transferring it to forward motion.

That said, I don't think I'd stand all the way out on the tip, but in close to the hull will get you a little farther out and shouldn't be an issue for the board. Think about a boat like a Laser- the daggerboard on that boat is subject to a lot lower force than on a Hobie and people stand on those boards all the time to right the boat.

sm


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 22, 2009 7:02 am 
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Location: Knoxville, TN
SRM,

Thanks for the info on using the righting system and explaining daggerboard physics. I've read discussions about rudders failing in heavy winds and high crew weights but never really understood why. It must be those same type of sideways loads that cause rudders to flex and ultimately break. Are EPO rudders so much stronger as to significantly reduce the likelihood of breakage? Is flex reduction the property that makes EPOs faster?

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Mark Van Doren
Division 9 Chairman
H16 #112205 (Richard Petty Signature Edition)
H14T #47787
H20 #647 (sold)


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 22, 2009 7:30 am 
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Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2007 7:04 am
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Location: Clinton Lake Kansas
MVD,

Between where you are and the Canadian border there are a ton of 20's being raced.
Rudder breakage is not a chronic problem with the 20.
There's a higher likelihood of you breaking a rudder casting (keep 'em locked down)
If you you do bust a rudder, rules now allow you to replace with the EPO2. This allows Hobie to build one replacement rudder for all the USA frp boats.
Sail the boat and enjoy 8)

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 22, 2009 7:52 am 
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John,

I'm planning to hit Fleet 23's Leukemia Cup in Dallas on May 2-3 and the Sand Snakes regatta in Little Rock on Memorial Day weekend. The price for showing up to let you veterans kick my butt is that y'all are going to have to share some wisdom with me. The only H-20 I've seen rigged up is mine. Scary, really scary.

If the first couple of regattas go well and I get hooked then perhaps I'll work my way north into Oklahoma and Kansas. How did the Plains states become such a bastion of H-20 sailing?

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Mark Van Doren
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H16 #112205 (Richard Petty Signature Edition)
H14T #47787
H20 #647 (sold)


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 22, 2009 7:34 pm 
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Location: Clinton Lake Kansas
MVD wrote:
John,

I'm planning to hit Fleet 23's Leukemia Cup in Dallas on May 2-3 and the Sand Snakes regatta in Little Rock on Memorial Day weekend. The price for showing up to let you veterans kick my butt is that y'all are going to have to share some wisdom with me. The only H-20 I've seen rigged up is mine. Scary, really scary.

If the first couple of regattas go well and I get hooked then perhaps I'll work my way north into Oklahoma and Kansas. How did the Plains states become such a bastion of H-20 sailing?
DCYC is a great venue for a regatta, you'll enjoy it. March up and introduce yourself as a newbie to the 20 and you'll receive your wisdom.

IIRC, Mark Benge, in OKC, was the one of the first to make the move to the 20. When you're out on the course and a 20 blows by you it's hard to to want one!

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 Post subject: righting
PostPosted: Mon Mar 23, 2009 1:03 pm 
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Location: Northern VA
Suggest some practice righting time in warm water :-) I think the 20 is one of the hardest Hobies to right; that tapered comptip and long heavy mast don't help. It's critical to get the mast upwind so the wind gets under the sail and helps it up. It's also critical to get on the righting line quickly; wait too long and it might turtle, and it's HARD to get back from that. If you flip it over in light air (not easy, but stuff happens), it's going to be very hard to right because the wind won't help you much. Not trying to scare you off; lots of light crews have flipped and righted; you just need more attention to procedure.

Whatever you do, don't let it turtle in 28-30' of water with a mud bottom...it becomes VERY stable with the boat flat and mast stuck (ask me how I know).


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 11, 2009 5:56 pm 
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better to tie a line around the dolphin striker and toss over the hull that is out of the water. you get much better angle when you are trying to right her.


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