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 Post subject: rudder issue
PostPosted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 6:03 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jun 05, 2008 10:11 am
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Location: Slippery Rock, PA
Today we went out for our second excursion this spring. My rudder on the AI kept kicking up. We were on a sedate creek. If I cleat it down it stayed in place. I didn't notice last year that I had to cleat it down all the time. We did some minor adjusting, but didn't think we majorly changed anything. Any suggestions??


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 Post subject: Re: rudder issue
PostPosted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 8:32 pm 
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Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2007 9:57 am
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Location: Phuket, Thailand
janetandfred wrote:
Today we went out for our second excursion this spring. My rudder on the AI kept kicking up. We were on a sedate creek. If I cleat it down it stayed in place. I didn't notice last year that I had to cleat it down all the time. We did some minor adjusting, but didn't think we majorly changed anything. Any suggestions??


If I just peddle the boat on its own in 'Adventure' mode I never cleat the rudder down. When I use the sail I try to remember to cleat it down, sometimes I forget...the stearing becomes sluggish and unresponsive, even somedays when theres little wind and I unfurl the sail for the first time and it draws I cant seem to bear away...its because I have forgotten to lock the rudder! Also you may find that you did not fully deploy the rudder in the first place done that a few times!

Off topic AGAIN... :oops: but......Sounds like Stringy has mounted a daggerboard housing into his drive well plug. What I would like to know is this...Stringy do you notice a difference in rudder control when you sail with your daggerboard mounted in the drivewell plug or is it just the same as it would be with the d/b offset?

Cheers

Philip


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 Post subject: Re: rudder issue
PostPosted: Sat Apr 18, 2009 2:56 am 
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Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2007 2:25 pm
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Location: Central Coast NSW Australia
Janet and Fred,
I have to cleat the rudder in all but the calmest of conditions or slowest speeds on both my AI's. There are many variables that could be causing it to kick up when uncleated but I would only consider it a problem if it kicked up after it was cleated down.
Philip,
I have never considered using the daggerboard plug in my AI as I designed it for my Tandem. You've got me wondering what a difference it may make being centrally mounted and slightly forward. I'll try it next time I'm out. Yesterday I was sailing in Adventure only mode with the small sail and no drive/ ama but with daggerboard down for stability. In 15 -20 knot wind on a broad reach I averaged (GPS) 4.54 knots in 30 minutes and hit a top speed of 7.4 knots. It was an exhilarating ride but my back was sore from hiking out! Great fun though! :wink:


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 Post subject: Re: rudder issue
PostPosted: Sat Apr 18, 2009 5:44 am 
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Location: Slippery Rock, PA
Thanks for the thoughts. We are going to today to a local lake to sail. It seemed a bit odd that on the creek, quite calm, that it was kicking up. But, possibly I hadn't pulled it into place sharply enough. I know sailing on the Chesapeake Bay last summer I had some issues with steering in general even cleated down. We'll see what happens today on the lake. This is the first decent day here in Western PA to hit the water, yeee haaa!!!``


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 Post subject: Re: rudder issue
PostPosted: Sat Apr 18, 2009 9:21 am 
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Location: Phuket, Thailand
stringy wrote:
You've got me wondering what a difference it may make being centrally mounted and slightly forward.


Stringy

Youve got me wondering too, you built it, good on you!!.....man of great ideas :idea: centrally mounted thats the rub....in line with the rudder.... I'd be really interested to know how the rudder feels specially when bearing off from close hauled and going onto a reach. Didnt think about it being a bit forward of the old position, that might muck things up. Go for it :D Give us a full report!!!!!!!

Philip


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 Post subject: Re: rudder issue
PostPosted: Sat Apr 18, 2009 2:12 pm 
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Joined: Thu May 08, 2008 3:29 pm
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Location: Dublin, Ireland
I always sail with the rudder cleated, force of habit, and have had no probelms with steering. My sense is that the day I forget to cleat it a rogue wave will bear down on me and break it!.

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 Post subject: Re: rudder issue
PostPosted: Sun Apr 19, 2009 8:03 pm 
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Location: Slippery Rock, PA
First sail of spring went well...with a few hitches. It was a cooler than expected day (didn't bring the wetsuit) with stronger than expected winds. We generally launch from a beach in warm weather, but this was in cool weather from a dock. All was going well until I got blown into the dock. I had the amas' out ready to go...until... pop! Fortunately there was an extra bolt in the Amas! Gotta love Hobie. Now I have to remember to replace it. Then off into the wind. I cleated the rudder down and had no steering issues. Sailed for a couple hours with the glee of spring!!! Next on the list is a modification to the tiller control to save my left thumb from pain. Last year I saw a modification that used a pvc pipe so that the tiller was held by the hand rather than pushed by the thumb. It wasn't pretty, but appeared quite functional. Now, the courage to start modifying.


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 Post subject: Re: rudder issue
PostPosted: Mon Apr 20, 2009 2:05 am 
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Location: Terrigal NSW, Australia
janetandfred wrote:
Next on the list is a modification to the tiller control to save my left thumb from pain.


Do you have a problem with your thumb? Normally, if you are encountering enough resistance in the tiller to hurt your thumb and you are sailing in strong wind, I'd wonder if you should be reefing the sail a bit. Just a thought :)

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 Post subject: Re: rudder issue
PostPosted: Mon Apr 20, 2009 5:37 am 
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Joined: Fri Nov 21, 2008 3:39 am
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Location: Bairnsdale, Victoria Australia
One of the 'gotta do' mods I have yet to get around to is to clean up the tiller arm which was stamped out with nasty sharp edges. Though it hasn't really hurt my fingers or thumb, I am aware of it and keep promising myself to take a file and sandpaper to it...Pirate :|

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 Post subject: Re: rudder issue
PostPosted: Mon Apr 20, 2009 12:58 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 27, 2003 12:44 pm
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Location: Oceanside, California
The original rudder down handle control system had a cam-over-center type lock that held the rudders down in light to moderate speed conditions. They also relied on a small indent lock.

The rudders using the newer rope pull systems are designed to be cleated when down.

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 Post subject: Re: rudder issue
PostPosted: Tue Apr 21, 2009 6:00 pm 
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Location: Slippery Rock, PA
Thanks M Miller for the definitive answer on cleating down the rudder. Any thoughts on modifying the rudder control into a handle?


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 Post subject: Re: rudder issue
PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2009 5:49 am 
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P.S. Part of the reason I injured my thumb is that we spend 2.5 months as Camp Hosts in Va Beach. We sailed daily and a few too many times I misjudged weather, wind, time and distance and had an adventure that pushed all my limits. Ramping in the sail would have been a good idea, but weather issues pushed me forward. Not smart, but great stories!!!


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 Post subject: Re: rudder issue
PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2009 2:41 pm 
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Joined: Fri Nov 21, 2008 3:39 am
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Location: Bairnsdale, Victoria Australia
janetandfred wrote:
Thanks M Miller for the definitive answer on cleating down the rudder. Any thoughts on modifying the rudder control into a handle?

Somewhere on this forum I have seen a mod where a small 'Ronstan' type flat stainless chainplate was bolted at one end through the little tiller arm at its end. The fitting simply extended the tiller almost double giving more leverage but was able to be pivoted back over itself beside the plastic tiller arm. A small foam handle would make it even more user friendly. I don't need the fix for my thumb but you could use that method it you are having trouble....Pirate :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: rudder issue
PostPosted: Thu Apr 23, 2009 10:55 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 12, 2005 10:46 pm
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Location: Escondido
janetandfred wrote:
Any thoughts on modifying the rudder control into a handle?

Here are some conversions done by forum members:
Image

Image

Image
8)


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 Post subject: Re: rudder issue
PostPosted: Sun May 03, 2009 6:22 am 
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Location: Slippery Rock, PA
Thank-you for the pictures. Visual explanations are always helpful!!


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