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PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 6:54 am 
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Location: Ft Lauderdale FL
This is a question for Matt. This weekend I took a friend who wants to buy a Revo fishing. He was in the Revo and I was in the Adventure. After coming in to sit out a thunders squall we went back out and I noticed a decrease in stability on the AI figuriing the heavy rain had gotten in the hull I opened the center hatch to discove the boat half full of water. It had cracked on the outside of the hull just below the forward end of the drive well where the Mirage drive rests. I am still researching the history of this hull which I bought used before I decide what to do. I told my buddy that I took on a significant amount of water and explained the stability problems while I was pumping out. To my surprise he to had noticed a reduction in stability so we checke and he had alwo taken on a significant amount of H2O. A subsequent inspection of the hull revealed a that the starboard post that supports the mirage drive Cam Lock bolt had failed. I bought this hull in Apr 07. Shortly after I bought it I noticed a bit of discoloration on this post. About a year later I sent the following picture to my dealer, Adventure Times Kayak in West Palm Beach.

Image

Although larger than when the boat was new the area seemed stable and was not leaking so we agreed to take a wait and see approach to the problem. Now the post has failed exactly in the area I first noticed when the boat was new and I later reported to the dealer. As is the hull is unusable and the area would be trickey to repair and the stresses in the area would make a repair dubious at best. I sent this second picture too the dealer Monday and I have not heard back from him.

Image

So what do you think, it looks to me like the hull failed due to a small manufacturing defect in an area of stess.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 8:52 am 
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We have seen some of these. Could be alingment of the fixture that receives the bolt or something to do with the cooling and shrink rate, bolt length... not completely sure. This is repairable per information roadrunner has posted in the forums. He used (as a test) some 3M material a couple years ago and is still holding well.

File the claim... and review the repair idea.

roadrunners fix is here: http://www.hobiecat.com/community/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=12558&p=70161&hilit=column#p70161

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Matt Miller
Director of Parts and Accessory Sales
Hobie Cat USA


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 9:53 am 
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Location: Ft Lauderdale FL
Thanks Matt I will call them this afternoon. You do realize this is a Revolution we are talking about and not an Adventure. That 3M stuff looks interesting but my thought was to use West system GFLEX epoxy. It is designed to adhere to the plastic Yaks and is supposed to be flexible. I have used it before and I have a pint on hand.

Roadrunner what do you think about a similar repair using GFLEX epoxy?

Also it just so happens that the failure in my Adventure is on the front of the drivewell where that stregthening kit is pictured I will ask my dealer if he has ever heard of the kit


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 3:53 pm 
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quirkster wrote:
Thanks Matt I will call them this afternoon. You do realize this is a Revolution we are talking about and not an Adventure. That 3M stuff looks interesting but my thought was to use West system GFLEX epoxy. It is designed to adhere to the plastic Yaks and is supposed to be flexible. I have used it before and I have a pint on hand.

Roadrunner what do you think about a similar repair using GFLEX epoxy?

Also it just so happens that the failure in my Adventure is on the front of the drivewell where that stregthening kit is pictured I will ask my dealer if he has ever heard of the kit


Had the same problem on my 07 AI and after putting in a warranty claim received a new Hull from Hobie Aus. During the intervening period I took a section of narrow diameter pvc pipe cut it top to bottom and bonded it over the broken pillar. I roughed up the pillar pretty hard with a rasp then epoxied the two pipe halves over the pillar, put 2 hose clamps around the whole thing and it all held beautifully, what i did in effect was to splint it. Both my pillars were split.
Also check the mounting in the hull that holds the mast receiver in place. My receiver on the 07 was not seated tight against the inside of the hull, consequently the area of poly around the threaded bar that holds the receiver base in place was cracked...again an ounce of prevention make sure the fit is snug down there.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2009 9:49 pm 
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Location: Escondido
Quirkster, sorry to hear about your hull problems. I'm pretty sure the Gflex would not handle my style of repair, but Philip's solution sounds pretty nice! Gflex would probably be fine with the PVC and hose clamps, especially since you already have some. If you need to stiffen it up so it doesn't run while assembling, you might try adding a pinch of saw dust and spread the blend into the PVC halves (after first wetting everything with straight epoxy). 8)


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 06, 2009 4:26 am 
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Location: Ft Lauderdale FL
RR. thank, I usually use microballoons in the mix to get the required stiffness. I would also wrap the area in fiberglass cloth.
I am hopeful that the dealer will come back with the info that it is covered. I documented the flaw in the area while the warrantee was still in effect and the hull is only 2 mos past the covered period. Almost sounds like planned obsolecence. The problem I have with the PVC solution is the interface between the PVC and the bonding agent add that to the interface between the bonding agent and the hull and you have two points of failure vice one. I have found that if you rough up the hull material and run a flame over it to evaporate the oils I get a very good bond with the GFLEX.

I am curious though does the product you use state that it is made to bond to plastics?


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 07, 2009 12:39 pm 
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Quirkster, I've also tested the Gflex with flame and sanding and was able to break the bond by hand with a moderately aggressive effort. The with the 8010 the PE failed before the bond did.

Regarding the Gflex, West Systems tech dept. now recommends the flame but without sanding. This supersedes the printed instructions. There is an article in issue 26 (I believe) in their magazine (available online) which shows comparative strengths. They also recommend gluing within 30 minutes of flaming since it apparently briefly polarizes the surface, enhancing the bond.

The problem with flaming inside the hull, especially at the cam columns, is getting access all the surfaces without melting the boat, at least for me! :lol:

Yes, the DP 8010 is specifically formulated for HDPE. Locktite also makes a similar industrial product called 3300. They also have a couple of similar products. I hope to test all three in the next couple of weeks and will report results. 8)

BTW, I also tried some screen material in the capacity of your fiberglass cloth and couldn't get it to stay in place while I applied the rest of the product within the limited time span. It's worked fine without it. But with the Gflex you would have more time to get it set up. Good luck!


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 08, 2009 6:19 am 
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Thanks RR. You might have me convinced. I have put a claim with the dealer since I Phot documented the flaw with him well within the warrantee and it only broke a month out of warrantee. The break is clearly at the exact spot I photographed and the flaw was present when the hull was delivered. So I am hopeful Hobie will come through, until I hear either way I am holding off on the repair. In the meantime I have the twice repaired Adventure to fish from.


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