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PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 11:08 am 
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Location: Eagan (St Paul), MN
I was trapping from wing's end yesterday and stuffed the nose and took a little trip to the forestay where I hit a bracket for a wind indicator. Never actually used the wind indicator and don't think I will be now that the bracket got mashed by my arm. My arm got a little mashed too but fortunately looks better than the wind indicator bracket.

Anyway: this got me thinking about installing a set of chicken wires. I've seen some prior posts on this about hooking one to the rudder pin but that seems like it could lead to a lot of tension on that. Someone else wrote about drilling holes in the transom and installing an eye hook to tie the line onto. But I'm not too keen on drilling more holes and I don't have any inspection ports that would let me get to the inside portion of the transom. Wonder if someone has a better idea or more info? What if I somehow tie a cord off to the wing somewhere?

I also worry about capsizing on while attached to the chicken wire and then being suspended above the water and below the upper hull. That also seems like it'd put a lot of tension on wherever the chicken line is attached (not to mention that I'd be pulling the boat towards turtling)?

Appreciate any help.
thx

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e-mail: ab at medjet.net
H17S, Hobie Bravo, A cat
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 1:09 pm 
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What would the function of the chicken wire be?


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 2:41 pm 
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I think you just need to man up Adam. :lol:

Ya know, I haven't ever thought I needed a chicken line on the FX, I just happen to know where you can scoop one up too.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 3:44 pm 
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How about installing a footstrap or two into the wings?

sm


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 4:23 pm 
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Chicken lines in the Sunkist Ad

Still working on this idea also. I going to assume that chicken lines can be tied. Not drilling any holes in my boat.

And like the guy in the Sunkist ad (at 20 seconds in link above), the chicken line is something you grab for quick stability, like the overhead hand straps inside your car.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 4:57 pm 
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Location: Eagan (St Paul), MN
Karl: I've seen you sail and you should think about a chicken wire :D

When you're doing this someday things will come to a painful end:

Image

Thanks for the offer to solve my chicken wire solution for $13k. For that I could pay to have a chimpanzee trained to sail with me and hold my foot down to the wing.

Send4Help: chicken wire is something that ties onto the trap loop and then somewhere to the back of the boat to keep you from getting thrown forward (and around the mast) when you bury the bows underwater and the boat slows and wants to throw you forward.

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e-mail: ab at medjet.net
H17S, Hobie Bravo, A cat
Fleet 444


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 5:01 pm 
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Foot straps to the wing are an interesting idea. Anyone done that? How would you connect them to the wing? Are there prefabricated foot straps out there?

Also: would you have a tendency to rip your ankle off of your leg during a capsize? I've got a fondness for my toes...

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e-mail: ab at medjet.net
H17S, Hobie Bravo, A cat
Fleet 444


Last edited by bock1 on Sun Aug 30, 2009 5:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 5:26 pm 
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Usually you mount the foot straps so that they're loose enough that when you do plant it, you come out pretty easily. Where my left foot is in that pic, I need to add a strap just for it. I haven't come close to digging in trapped out with the spinnaker, yet being an operative word.

I could probably get your H17 sold in week if you bought mine, there's a couple of people in Div7 that are looking for one. There's one for sale in Houston for $7500, and another in NJ that has wings.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 7:09 pm 
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Location: Storm Lake, IA
bring it down to Storm Lake in two weeks I know of at least 3 people who are interested in buying one and they will all be here. If you come we will have a 5 boat fleet! 6 if Karl leaves is spin at home, (but what fun would that be)?


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 7:25 pm 
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Location: Eagan (St Paul), MN
HobieAndy,

thanks for the invitation. I'm out of town that weekend (sister getting married) but next year would love to come down and sail with you guys. {I don't really race but if you ever get together and cruise let me know}.

I'm kind of having a second honeymoon with my H17 so am not really looking to unload it (as I was at some point). Started sailing it solo and got out on the trap and it became a different boat that I am much happier with. Also fixed the wing sockets. Likely to add spinnaker next year. That said, someday I may look for something else.....

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e-mail: ab at medjet.net
H17S, Hobie Bravo, A cat
Fleet 444


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 8:12 pm 
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The one way ticket around the forestay is just one of the joys of pitchpoling.
I never heard the term "chicken wire" but am familiar with "chicken line" which referred to using the righting line pulled up and around your back while trapped out to help keep your footing. Eventually nothing can keep a 160 lb person from flying forward when you go from 15kts to 0 in 1 second.
"Suicide straps" aka "carrying straps" are available from a few sources. They can also be built fairly easily.
The point of the strap is to try and keep the foot most to the stern (ie left foot on a starboard tack) in place. Putting them on the wings on a 17 does not make sense. To avoid pitchpoling on a broad reach you should be AS FAR BACK AS POSSIBLE on the windward hull, not on the wing (ie- standing on the gunwale just ahead of the transom) with one foot on the gunwale and another on the trailing edge of the wing that is one reason the wing support has the angled side.
Imagine the picture of bock1 this way - left foot under a suicide strap and right foot on a wing (if he had one).
On my H16 I had a pair of them on each side a-stern of the tramp. With a double trap set, the captain, Susan, would be as far back as possible on the rail leaning on me and I would standing on the gunwale. When we pitchpoled at light-speed it got very interesting. I think we still have bruises from 30 years ago.
I would mount one strap on each side about 19 inches a-stern of the post-holes.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 31, 2009 9:36 am 
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People used to put footstraps on the 17 wings years ago, but you don't see it much anymore. For racing we only sail windward/leeward courses these days, so trapping off the back of the wings is very rare - hence no need for foot straps or chicken lines.

You can get commercially made footstraps. DaKine is probably the most popular brand but there are others. Check windsurfing shops. A decent footstrap will likely cost between $15 to $25. The best way to connect would probably be to use rivets right into the wing tube. I would try to get two rivets in per side to prevent the strap from twisting.

And yes, ankle injury is possible with footstraps, as is injury from being caught in the chicken line or from being launched during a trip to the bow.

sm


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 31, 2009 1:03 pm 
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Quote:
which referred to using the righting line pulled up and around your back while trapped out to help keep your footing.
If you look at the Sunkist ad paused at 19 and 20 seconds, the chicken line is in front of the crew, not behind.

His left hand is on the chicken line and the right hand is up high, holding the trap.

The line appears to be tied to the front crossbeam and at the rear to the rudder hardware... or something. It also must be a half-bungee and half rope. It appears to be joined, possibly with a loop, near his left hand.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 31, 2009 6:33 pm 
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Ok, I've got about 1/2 hour total expereince on a Hobie 17, so this question may be out of line.

With a double handed boat like a 16, 18, 20 or Tiger, the crew uses the chicken line, and if it is a team that has sailed together a LOT and the skipper trusts the crew with the mainsheet, then they might each have a free hand for the chicken line. but usually the chicken line is there for the crew to hang on to when they are reaching and the conditions are really heavy.

Since a Hobie 17 is a singlehanded boat, and if the conditions are such that you might actually want or need to use a chicken line, and you will probably have the tiller in one hand and the mainsheet in the other hand, which hand are you going to use to hang on to the chicken line with.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 31, 2009 6:33 pm 
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JJ wrote:
The line appears to be tied to the front crossbeam and at the rear to the rudder hardware... or something. It also must be a half-bungee and half rope. It appears to be joined, possibly with a loop, near his left hand.


Alot of H18's rig the righting line this way. I don't think you are seeing a line installed solely for this purpose.


Stephen- Are you going to Mchonogy, Machogey, Mecohny, what ever that lake in western Nebraska is called, this weekend?


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