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 Post subject: Getaway double trapeze
PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2009 4:26 am 
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Has anyone installed two trap wires in a getaway? Which is the most convenient way to attach the wires (looks kinda tight to put everything in the main shackle up top). Should I use a new shackle in the top hole of the mast bracket?
Also, do I need a new hole in the tramp, aft of the existing one to pass the skipper's trap bungee cord? (kinda hesitant to put a new hole there)

thanks for the input

Guillermo


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2009 10:27 am 
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gmozavala wrote:
Has anyone installed two trap wires in a getaway? Which is the most convenient way to attach the wires (looks kinda tight to put everything in the main shackle up top). Should I use a new shackle in the top hole of the mast bracket?
Also, do I need a new hole in the tramp, aft of the existing one to pass the skipper's trap bungee cord? (kinda hesitant to put a new hole there)

thanks for the input

Guillermo


Last time I looked into adding a second trap wire on my Getaway, I was told that this was not a good idea, as the boat was not designed to support the weight of 2 persons on the wire.
If there was a way to beef up the boat to support 2 trapezes, I would certainly install a second one immediately.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2009 11:25 am 
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I had the same hesitation, but I thought about the physics of it and concluded that the boat shouldn't be feeling any additional loading because of having two people in the wire.

When you are sailing with no trap, all the mast force at the top bracket is being taken by the shroud. If you put one person in the wire, load is being shared by the trap wire and the shroud. If we had two people on the wire, load is being shared by the three wires (shroud and two trap wires). The boat/mast shouldn't really care which of the wires are handling the load. In fact shroud wires are being unloaded by the use of the trap.

The only issue would be that with two people on the trap you could be handling more wind than if you only had one. However, what is the difference between having four people sitting on the wings, and two people on the wire? I think that four people on the wing gives you more leverage than two on the wire, and therefore would be loading the boat more, being able to handle more wind (and much more stress because the shroud is taking all the load). And with wings actually the people are at about the same position as a guy in the trap (with no wings).

Please let me know if you see a flaw in my reasoning. At this point it looks to me that the boat wouldn't be loaded any more than with having one person in the wire.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2009 11:52 am 
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As I understand, there are 2 issues :
- On the Getaway, the tang is attached to the comp-tip, not to the aluminum part of the mast (unlike on the 16), which may be more fragile (???)
- There is no dolphin striker, so more wight on the outside can put more pressure on the the crossbar, although that should be the same with the wings, as you said.

So, I don't know... but the recommendation I heard is 1 big guy maximum on the trapeze...


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2009 12:22 pm 
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Quote:
- On the Getaway, the tang is attached to the comp-tip, not to the aluminum part of the mast (unlike on the 16), which may be more fragile (???)
- There is no dolphin striker, so more wight on the outside can put more pressure on the the crossbar


Correct on both counts. Trapeze loads are compression on the mast and crossbar. Since the tang is in the CompTip... we don't recommend the extra loads there or on the forward beam. Example: The trapeze loads are why a striker was added to the Hobie 14 when we went Turbo (Jib and Trapeze) on that model.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2009 1:24 pm 
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Hey Matt, and do you know which person weight does Hobie usually use in their calculations?
My crew is usually a 100-pound kid (and other lighter kids might be sailing in the boat as well) and I am only 160 pounds, so even both of us could be lighter than a heavy guy.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2009 3:08 pm 
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I would guess the average crew estimated from 180 -200 lbs max.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 09, 2009 9:50 pm 
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Location: Strahan Tasmania
Tried it! the boat doesnt seem to perform any better,in fact it didnt feel as comfortable as one hiking and one on trap.Light winds light crew on trap,heavy winds heavy crew on trap,seems to work well with me.
:D Tasmanias only getaway sailor.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 09, 2009 9:55 pm 
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Desmond Becker wrote:
Tried it! the boat doesnt seem to perform any better,in fact it didnt feel as comfortable as one hiking and one on trap.Light winds light crew on trap,heavy winds heavy crew on trap,seems to work well with me.
:D Tasmanias only getaway sailor.


I don't find trapping out for the skipper to be very comfortable on the Getaway, as I can't comfortably stand as back as I'd like.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 6:56 pm 
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I added a second set of trap wires so both kids can hang out at the same time. Thier combined weight is less than 180, so it seems safe enough. If I am trapping as the skipper I use the rear set. The hardest part about the installation was putting the grommets in the tramp. It wasn't a big deal. When we aren't trapping we clip all four lines to the front bungee to decrease the clutter.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 25, 2009 9:14 am 
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has anybody use the wings as racks on the getaway and if so how much more leverage do you get from trapping off the wings as opposed to the hulls :?:


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 25, 2009 2:20 pm 
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My kids use the wings as rails to trap from. It gets them pretty far out. I have no way to measure, but trapping from the wing a seventy pound provides a noticable effect.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 25, 2009 2:41 pm 
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im fourteen and 110 lbs, so would I be able to single hand one of these if I had wings and a trap or would I have to partially/completely furl the jib


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 12:03 pm 
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Matt, if the getaway wasn´t designed to support double trapezing why does the mast tang come with 3 holes (one could assume 1 for the shrouds and the remaining 2 for the trapeze)....

Thx


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 2:19 pm 
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paulbkeegan wrote:
Matt, if the getaway wasn´t designed to support double trapezing why does the mast tang come with 3 holes (one could assume 1 for the shrouds and the remaining 2 for the trapeze)....

Thx

if you look and find assembly instructions you'll see that the three holes on the tang are for;
-one hole (at the bottom) is for a shackle that the shrouds and forestay shackle attatches to
-the other two holes are both for the trapeze wire's shackle (one shackle for both traps)
the image will show the very top hole (is smaller) is where the pin of the shackle goes through and the larger hole (the middle hole of the tang) is where the bottom of the shackle is through. it's a closed loop. the shackle is divided effectively in half and secured. it does not flop around. the two trap wires are on either side of the tang.

also-on a side note the wings state they will old 450 lbs (per wing). i'd say 4 'adults' on one wing is likely overloading the wing.


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