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 Post subject: Re: Sleeping on board
PostPosted: Sat Oct 10, 2009 4:11 pm 
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Location: Calga NSW, Australia
Phil, your idea of using a Hennessy hammock and single PVC pipes totally nails it. I went out and bought a Hennessy hammock (very worth having even if you don't use it on the boat).
I copied your idea with the pipes and voila:
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The actual hammock is ideally suited to this arrangement. It uses a ridge line from which the hammock is suspended, so the only lines I had to add were the guy lines out to the amas. As you say, these greatly enhance the stability and with them, the setup is rock-solid. I found I didn't even need clamps, though I found that bungeeing the pipes to the crossbars made it easier to set everything up. I tested it by having a nap "on board" and it was fine. I could also rock around in the hammock and everything remained perfectly stable. One slight problem is that the fly sheet has to be attached to the amas also, so it sits down a bit snug over the hammock, which can be a bit claustrophobic. When you are in the hammock, it sags down below the fly a bit, so you still get air circulation. I tried threading a boathook down one of the pipes and attaching the fly to that and that helped:
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I only had one boathook handy and it wasn't extendable, but it looks like a worthwhile approach. Also, the mast has to be down to make room for the fly. Next step is to give it a full trial and sleep the night out on my dam. Again, thanks for thinking of it :D.

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 Post subject: Re: Sleeping on board
PostPosted: Sat Oct 10, 2009 5:59 pm 
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Location: Sydney - Parramatta
This concept is really coming along.
Just needs a little bell for calling room service :lol:

Are you thinking of using sleeping bags/blankets etc in the hammock? I'd imagine that even in summer it would be cool out on the water at night.

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 Post subject: Re: Sleeping on board
PostPosted: Sat Oct 10, 2009 6:05 pm 
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Prolly a sleeping bag. For really cold conditions, you can get an undercover for the hammock. With the undercover and a suitable sleeping bag, they have been tested down to minus 12 degrees centigrade. Check out their website.
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 Post subject: Re: Sleeping on board
PostPosted: Sun Oct 11, 2009 5:54 am 
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Joined: Mon Apr 28, 2008 4:45 pm
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Location: Florida panhandle
chrisj
Glad to see you finish it up. I ordered my Hennessy last week, should be here this week. I asked for their list of demos and seconds which they sent in short order. Lots of money to be saved from the regular price!
Which model did you get? Do you think we are safe in hooking the ends to the carrying handle attachment? I was considering using a strap to go around the ends of the hull just to spread the load. Would hate to tear out anything and get dumped in the middle of the night :cry:
I will do another video when I get mine set up with the Hennessy.
You done good!

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 Post subject: Re: Sleeping on board
PostPosted: Sun Oct 11, 2009 10:49 pm 
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Hi Phil, I got an Expedition Asym - that's the only model my local camping goods shop had in stock, plus it's about the cheapest and I didn't need an extra-large or ultra-light model.
I didn't think the loads were excessive on the metal pad eyes at the bow and stern. With the hammock loaded and the hammock line tied off at the top of the PVC pipe, the line is at an angle of 10 to 15 degrees max. to the pipe, so it should not exert much torque. I found I could pull down hard on the section of line running from the hammock to the pipe without greatly increasing the tension in the section running from the pipe to the pad eye. Still, I might be wrong. If you are concerned, the tree hugger straps that come with the hammock could certainly be passed under the hull. I've now tried putting a boat hook down each pipe and swinging the fly from the top of them. One of the boat hooks is extendible and I can use that to adjust the tension of the fly. It works quite well at keeping a space between the hammock and the fly. Also, I can tie the hammock line around the boat hooks. Here's how it looks now:
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The view from inside:
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I'm looking forward to you getting your Hennessy, so we can compare notes.
Chris :D

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 Post subject: Re: Sleeping on board
PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2009 1:31 pm 
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Location: Florida panhandle
Chris,
That is the one I got also. Tracking it to find that it left Canada on Saturday. I will be lucky if I have it this week! OK, so what is the distance between the poles at the height that you tie the hammock? Or how long are your poles and are they different lengths front and back. Have you hung in it to get a feel as to know what the height needs to be for a flat hang and a comfortable hang?

Your boat hook idea is great. I will use the idea but turn it into PVC that is adjustable. What do you think the minimum distance can be between the pole tops in order to get a good hang. I would like to keep the poles as short as possible as well as the hang.

Have you looked at the SuperShelter as a add on? I assume that it gets somewhat cold in your neighborhood at times.
This is a great place for Hammock info if you haven't run across it already. http://www.hammockforums.net/

My only worry on the pad eyes is the vertical pull as opposed to a shear. It will most likely work but.....
Feels like I'm getting behind the power curve here! Send me some side views if you can. philsummers at cox.net

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 Post subject: Re: Sleeping on board
PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2009 2:33 pm 
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Phil, my pipes are each 5' long - not through any carefully calculated design, but because I bought a 10' length of pipe and cut it in two. You think things through more than I do :wink:. The distance between the tops of the pipes is just the distance necessary to make the fly sheet approximately taut - about 10'.
Because of the ridge line, it doesn't make much difference how high you hang the hammock in terms of flatness. This is because the ridge line limits how much you can "stretch" the hammock, unlike a conventional hammock. That said, the hammock is made assymetrical so that you can lie slightly diagonally, which allows you to lie reasonably flat and roll on your side. I find it quite comfortable (I'm 5'10", 170lb). With my current arrangement, I guess the hammock hangs about 18" above the hull with me in it. You might be able to lower the whole thing a bit, but that would make it harder to get in and out. I think it will all become obvious once you have the actual hammock and start fiddling with it.
I'm not in a hurry to get a SuperShelter. I think the climate here would be similar to Florida, so it only gets really chilly on winter nights. Never snows. I think I'll see how I go with just a sleeping bag - I'm more inclined toward camping in the warmer months anyway.
Here's a side view. The hammock is sitting up a bit because there's no-one in it. :D
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 Post subject: Re: Sleeping on board
PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2009 5:14 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 12, 2005 10:46 pm
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Location: Escondido
Phil, your concern about placing the bow/stern padeyes under stress for any extended period is a good one. Matt Miller recently commented on a related topic:
mmiller wrote:
Gio is correct that the bow and stern handles are only designed for "short" lifts... not long term hanging / storage use.

The screws are threaded into brass as noted. They are well anchored / molded in to the hull. You can use them for support lines when car topping, but not where they would be heavily loaded over long periods. Any hardware on the boat is the same. Over time, plastic creeps and flows from long periods of loading. Bow handle fittings, and other hardware attachments, are prone to failure if loaded over long periods. This is noted in the manual.

Just to be clear... DO NOT HANG A KAYAK FROM THE BOW AND STERN HANDLES!


Here's the source: viewtopic.php?f=11&t=14656

While this refers to the use of padeyes for transport vs storage, the concern here is the PE creeping over time. Of course this would depend on the length of your nap and actual amount of pull on the padeyes.

Chris, nice looking set-up! 8)


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 Post subject: Re: Sleeping on board
PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2009 5:34 pm 
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Gee, thanks for that RR - I never dreamed of such a thing as PE creep :shock:. I wasn't too worried about short term loading, because the tension on the line to the pad eye is only about 1/3 of the tension of the line to the hammock and the tension in the line to the hammock is about 2/3 body weight.
I guess I better listen to you and Phil and use straps under the hull instead (I like long naps).
What's the saying?: If one person calls you a donkey, ignore them. If two people call you a donkey, get a saddle!

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 Post subject: Re: Sleeping on board
PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2009 6:58 pm 
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Location: Florida panhandle
Chris
Great side shot! I scaled it out and now have something to work with.
Roadrunner, thanks for reminding me of that. I remember reading it sometime ago. The damage it would cause if it ripped out would be very hard if not impossible to repair. I will go with straps or some other idea.
What I am looking for is a setup that all parts can snapped or hooked into place easily in the dark and without getting wet. I hate a wet sleeping bag. This will mean having the guys already hooked up to the ama's and hopefully in the same plane as the T on the end of the pipe.
Oh well, I'll figure it out when it gets here :(
Chris, are you going to have your feet at the front or the back of the boat? Like if you climb out of the hammock and don't have the plug in the drive it could be interesting! :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Sleeping on board
PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2009 7:15 pm 
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PE creep free!!! The tree hugger straps work just fine.
Image
Phil, I have it set up feet forward right now. I suppose you could put your foot down the drivewell if you got out of the hammock half awake :? .

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 Post subject: Re: Sleeping on board
PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2009 9:42 pm 
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Location: Central Coast NSW Australia
Well, I didn't think it was possible but you two have managed to make the most versatile of craft even more versatile.
Very impressive work Phil and Chris! 8)
BTW- Doesn't the mainsheet exert quite a bit of force on the rear padeye? I can't recall anyone reporting a padeye failure. A while ago I reported about this stupid couple :wink: who had been towed about 36km and reached speeds of 20km/h. The tow rope was attached to the handle on the front padeye.
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No damage done. I'm certainly not encouraging this type of reckless behaviour but the padeyes seem very strong.
As RR points out long term applied force especially as the plastic expands and contracts is damaging. A short overnight stay should be OK. Seems like the strap solves that problem anyway! :)


Last edited by stringy on Mon Oct 12, 2009 10:17 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Sleeping on board
PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2009 9:49 pm 
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Mate, this opens up a world of exploring the Broken Bay, Hawkesbury river area. Yay Phil!!

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 Post subject: Re: Sleeping on board
PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2009 11:27 pm 
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Joined: Wed Dec 07, 2005 11:04 pm
Posts: 615
Location: Hawaii, Big Island
Great Hennesey rigs!
Believe this arrangement would satisfy The Tribe race rule requirement for sleeping.

Aloha

Dan

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 Post subject: Re: Sleeping on board
PostPosted: Tue Oct 13, 2009 1:47 am 
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Location: Shetland, UK
Nice piece of engineering. Shame you couldn't modify the mast so you could use that as your struts to save you taking extra gear with you.

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