HCA says NO to the FX1

The Hobie 17 / 18 / Tiger North Americans
2008 Nationals to be held at Harrisson Hot Springs British Columbia.

The Classes included: Tiger, H18, H17.
Woulden't it be great to have the FX One also. The old and the new of the 18 and the 17.

I have asked the organizing group that put the idea together if the FX One could be added, they said yes.

But when they asked for approval from HCA, Lori Mohney from HCA said this,
"Sorry about the delay in the FX1 department. I would say No to this....unless we could see 10-15 boats it cheapens the word championship."

And so,from Paul Evenden, the event coordinator,
"waddya think? can we get 10 boats? Let me know what you can do, if you can find enough boats, hopefully we can persuade them to change their minds.
get on the blower, get me names of boats that would commit to coming... and I'll try again with Lori.
same rates as the 17.."

In looking back at past NA results I have found, (in classes of how many thousands of boats)
2005 H18 13 boats
2004 H14 9 boats
2004 H16W 12 boats
2003 H14 7 boats
2002 Wave 6 baots
Are these numbers representative of the classes?

I think we can come close.

If Hobie Cat Co. wants to sell these boats then the support needs to be there from HCA.

Why do we not deserve the same respect as any other Hobie member.

_________________
Mike Hensel
'86 Hobie 18, '93 Hobie 14, '80 Hobie 14(restso in progress)
Wind in your sails, water in your shoes, great day!

I am trying to compile a list of Sailors that have an FX 1.

If you are sailing a FX or have a lead on contacting them, please email me at,
sailingahobie at msncom

thanks in advance,

_________________
Mike Hensel
'86 Hobie 18, '93 Hobie 14, '80 Hobie 14(restso in progress)
Wind in your sails, water in your shoes, great day!

Wrong title - it's "The Hobie 17 / 18 / Tiger North Americans". There is another Hobie North Americans being held in Clear Lake, IA for the 14's, 16Y, 16W and 16 Open.

The HCA is very leery of having another "non-event" like the aborted 2006 Tiger North Americans in San Francisco. The HCA has openly said that they will not support a proposal for a North Americans unless there is significant support from the class involved.



No. You're being very selective about which results you show.

Let's look at the last 5 years (I'm excluding the Wave, since there has only been one year that there was a sanctioned event):

Hobie 14:
2002 (Ft. Walton Beach, FL) - 18
2003 (?) - 7
2004 (Syracuse, NY) - 9
2005 (Rehoboth, DE) - 10
2006 (Clear Lake, IA) - 35
2007 (Geneva, NY) - 21

Average: 16.7
According to the 2007 North American Points spreadsheet, there were 44 Hobie 14 sailors that accounted for 61 regatta attendances.

Hobie 16 W
2002 (Ft. Walton Beach, FL) - 14
2003 (Rehoboth, DE) - 12
2004 (Syracuse, NY) - 12
2005 (Ventura, CA) - 13
2006 (Sandy Hook, NJ) - 10
2007 (Geneva, NY) - 16

Average: 12.8
The HCA doesn't track womens teams separately for points. I'm not going to wade through the names of 800 or so 16 sailors to see how many are women.

Hobie 18:
2002 (Ft. Walton Beach, FL) - 16
2003 (Lk, Carlyle, IL) - 15
2004 - No Event
2005 (Clear Lk., IA) - 13
2006 (Lk. Texoma, TX) - 17
2007 (Geneva, NY) - 19

Average: 16.0
According to the 2007 North American Points spreadsheet, there were 75 Hobie 18 sailors that accounted for 145 regatta attendances.


Now let's look at the FX-1:
According to the 2007 Points Rankings, there have only been 2 FX-1's racing - and each of them attended only one regatta! (BTW, you're not one of them, Mke - Division 4 must not be reporting 1 boat starts)

Let's get real. The FX-1 doesn't have the numbers to support a North American Championship - yet. Just because there's another North Americans being held relatively near to you doesn't mean that they should give you a start.

When you can consistently get 5 boats at a regatta (anywhere in the region), then we can talk about a North Americans for the FX-1. Start out small - like MidWinter's West.

I hope this isn't turning out to be confrontatonal, I only want to promote the FX 1.

When ever some one asks me why I bought one, since there arn't any National Events for them. I can only respond that I hope that they will have one sometime.
Others have said they would purchase an FX1 but there are not any events other than local.

Is it a CHicken and the egg issue. If so whats the harm in including the boat and see what interest there is.
But to be so negative doesn't seem right.

I found the FX1 Europeans and there were 5 boats there this year.
It seams that they are not afraid to start out small and see where the class goes.

Just my input so far.

_________________
Mike Hensel
'86 Hobie 18, '93 Hobie 14, '80 Hobie 14(restso in progress)
Wind in your sails, water in your shoes, great day!

Oh BTW, division 4 has 2 FXs starting and we would have 3 if they wern't out of stock.

_________________
Mike Hensel
'86 Hobie 18, '93 Hobie 14, '80 Hobie 14(restso in progress)
Wind in your sails, water in your shoes, great day!

What a CROCK! That adding the FX1 is somehow going to cheapen the "word". What will cheapen the event is the lack of support being shown to a class of boats trying to gain critical mass.
Most of the sailors that have stepped up and bought an FX1 have done so with great faith in the future of the class. They've put their money up on the bet that the class is going to be something. And it wouldn't hurt the HCA to show a little support.

What harm would it do to support this effort by allowing them to particapate in a mixed class nationals. If you only got 4 boats to show, that's 4 more entry fees, and it shows those that are still on the fence that this is going to be a class that is growing and has the support of the governing body.

Hell, you've got to start somewhere. In 2002, 2003,and 2005 the H14 didn't even meet this criteria. And yet they set a record the following year!



We don't even get that for the Tiger in most regions!
MidWinters West is a 1200 mile trip one way, for a two-day points event.
I'm curious as to the percentage of available boats vs. what currently show to a nationals. And is this requirement of 10-15 boats arbitrary or a written policy?
Not having a national is one of the quickest ways to bring the self fulfillment of a desire to kill any fleet. Is that the desire?
You've had the boat in production for how many year? It's about time to hold a nationals and get some visibility.

As the H17 class ages what class do you want them to migrate to? Is the replacement for the H17 a NACRA

_________________
2003 Tiger - Don Atchley

This is really what this boat needs. It's a terrific platform, its creepy fast, and it sails really fricken well. The thing that holds this boat back is the lack of exposure. I've attended two regatta's with mine and have no one to race with. Not that I enjoy racing in a fleet of one either. I do it with the hopes that people will start to recognize this boat, recognize its qualities and step up and buy one. Hobie no longer offers a "race" boat other than the Tiger and the H16 neither of which is a single hand boat. OLDSCHOOL18 is right these people will be on I17's. Not a bad boat you would just think that HCA would much rather preffer them being in their organization versus the rivals.

OK, say we only round up six boats for this event. What are the problems associated with that. Cost? Fine, charge me another $50, I want my event. I realize that there are plenty of problems that have to be dealt with with any event that is as high strung as a nationals, but it seems that everyone wants this boat to just disappear quietly. Is the running of the races the issue, as far as setting another mark? Well the Tigers are going to go crazy running a short course for the 17's & 18's, and neither of those boats will want to have a big course, so why not start the FXone's in front of the Tigers, and let them have thier own A mark? Is it just no one wants to be inconvenienced? What? someone explain this to me.

The HCA does not presently have a position on the matter of an FX1 Championship.

This issue was just brought to my attention about two minutes ago.

Bob Merrick
HCA Chair

Thanks Bob.
Apparently the response from Lori was taken as the official response from HCA.

Does that mean that the HCA will be considering its position on this issue soon? It will take some time to get the new boats on order for the next ship load...

_________________
2003 Tiger - Don Atchley

Send me an e-mail.

bmerrick at sbcglobal.net

Posted for Paul Evenden

In regards the the forum Discussion: http://www.hobiecat.com/community/viewtopic.php?t=8014

As i am unable at this time to post on the forum, i will express my views here. If someone (don or mike) would like to transfer this to the forum, please feel free.

During our Regatta at Harrison on the labour day weekend, Mike and Jason (our 2 FX1 sailors) approched me about including the FX1 in the NA's scheduled for next year. I approached the committee and we felt it would be no problem, assuming we could get approval from HCA (Lori and PU). I had emailed the question to Lori and asked her to contact PU regarding the matter. You have her response.

Mike felt that we could easily see 5-6 boats at the event. 2 locally, and the other from other points of the country (cal and points east). If there were other out there, maybe they would come out of the woodwork if the event was posted.

my understanding is that the boat is fairly new on the market and has not yet taken off in the sales dept. What a better way to get it going? Offer a Championship event, at an ideal sailing location, with an appropriate pairing of boats. If we get 5 or 10 or 15 boats, does the number really matter or that the boats come from a scattering of locations across north america? If we had 5 boats from the northwest only, no that does not represent a NA championship event. But if those 5 boats came from the NW, california, eastern states.. etc, then, yes i would convceive that as being representive.

Is there any way of know how many boats are out there? Can we get a list from the membership committee of FX1 owners or from the HC company as to where they are sold, so we can contact them to guage interest before making it official?

I am not worried about the logistics of adding them, it is a large pond and I will be making sure we have the resources to run the regatta in a most efficient way, probably with 2 windward marks and a seperate finish. I will be talking with the designated PRO soon to discuss the event.

In my last email to mike, i suggested to him to round up the other FX1 sailors he knows, and lets see if we can get a committment for involvement.

I think we do need to focus on why we have these events. Is is for the organization? or for the sailors? If it's for the sailors, my humble opinion would be to advertise, let them register and whomever shows, shows. They will have a top notch event, and maybe next year will encourage others to participate and purchase the boat.
If it's for the organization, then it's all about numbers and looking good i think.

Don't we always say, 5 boats makes a start? How about when the SI's say "one race makes a regatta" Is that representive? not really. What does? 2 races, 3 races? 10 races? How many races makes it representative? You do the best you can with what you have. I say the same thing here. Give them the opportunity and let's run with it.

Paul Evenden
Chair, 2008 Hobie North American Championship Committee
Hobie 17, Hobie 18, Tiger, (FX1?)

_________________
Mike Hensel
'86 Hobie 18, '93 Hobie 14, '80 Hobie 14(restso in progress)
Wind in your sails, water in your shoes, great day!

Thank you to Mr. Evenden and Mr. Hensel for speaking their minds. As Paul eluded this class association had better be about the sailors and not the boats (Hobie USA), otherwise we'll all be racing Getaways and Waves in a few years.

You and other owners are not the only ones trying to give this boat a chance. More food for your fire.

2002 Europeans
FX-One
6 boats all from NED

2007 Europeans
FX-one
5 boats 3 NED 2 GER 1 CH

These are the only two championships with FX-One participation. The FX-One is NOT listed as a boat under their "Past Champions"

Sorry the class is airing dirty laundry here.

_________________
HCANA Class Member

Just a note,

We have not heard a view point from the Hobie Cat Co, only the Hobie Class Association.
Please don't assume what Hobie Cat Co.'s position is.
I have had good support from my local dealer and the Hobie Cat Co.

Thanks every one for the input on this topic.

_________________
Mike Hensel
'86 Hobie 18, '93 Hobie 14, '80 Hobie 14(restso in progress)
Wind in your sails, water in your shoes, great day!

You have NOT heard from the Hobie Class Association yet and your current tack is not helping your cause.

Bob Merrick
HCA Chair

Deep breathes guys.

There is certainly nothing wrong with asking to have an event for the boat.

I would add that the H14, H16Women, H16Youth events have been 3 day events leading into 5 day events.
If the 17, 18 and Tiger event is currently planning a single course, even with a seperate weather mark, then it's already a logistic issue to get all the starts off clean.
Adding another boat would put you in a position to be prepared to have two completely seperate courses. That's two Signal boats, PRO's, staff of chase boats, marks, tackle etc.. You get the picture.
If the event organizer can show they are prepared to deal with all the physical and financial issues then a informed decision can be made.

I have delt with all this first hand on a few occasions and you are not as well prepared as you think and something will come up. It just always does.

_________________
Pat Bisesi
Fleet 204 Syracuse, NY